Silver&Black88 Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 59 minutes ago, NightTrainLane said: GMs with good coaches on the team don't choose the scheme and therefore don't make the grocery list sort of speak. With Gruden and Guether outlining what they wanna do and the kind of guys they like it makes it easy for Reggie to do his job and scout and sign and select the players we add. With Gruden and Reggie both coming from the same foundation and learning the game from the same guys they have similar philosophies. They have said it over and over again that they are working together. This narrative that some are trying to push about control has been shot down multiple times by the men themselves. These are terms that are thrown around by those that want to divide. Mark, Reggie and Gruden have all said that they want the FO and coaches to work like they are suppose to as I described above and Reggie has said multiple time that it's refreshing and great to work with a guy and staff the communicates openly and that shares the same goals, outlook, football eyes and values that he does. So it's not about fans NEEDING there to be a warm/fuzzy feeling, it's that there is a good working relationship, when those that want to divide would rather there not be. It's not a mystery that all the Reggie haters are the same ones shouting that he has no "control" when that isn't how you would describe his job as I noted above. This. Reporters are just trying to create a story because that's their job. Don't get why Raiders fans are so gung ho to run with it. OF COURSE the roster was going to get shaken up. In case anyone forgot, we're picking in the top 10 for a reason. And I'll also remind us that our locker room was in disarray last season which had to be rectified. Obviously Crab and King were easy targets. Nelson being available and King being a punter made them lol hanging fruit Also, news flash: when a team hires a new head coach, they try to shape the roster to their preference and scheme. $100 million HC or rookie HC just the same. Clearly Gruden puts a higher value on STs and blocking FBs than our old staff so we adjusted accordingly If there's one thing that would give me pause it's Grudens comments about our recent draft classes. Those fall a lot on Reggie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNBlackFan Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 2 hours ago, big_palooka said: Anyone pretending Gruden isn't running the show is blind. Gruden has a 10 year $100 million contract. He has 100% control of the roster (as if that is evident enough). I don't know why fans need to have this warm/fuzzy feeling about everyone working in harmony. Gruden didn't come back to football to not be in control of his roster. He hired a director of football research (Dave Razzano) and leans on his own people. This 100% I mean let's be real....the owner literally said it was the happiest day of his entire life when he hired Gruden lol. It's as clear as day who is running the show, and Reggie and his guys will slowly be phased out of the equation. I'm not criticizing Gruden at all for this, as it was known for years that this kind of power would be mandatory for whatever team he returned to coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightTrainLane Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 25 minutes ago, Silver&Black88 said: This. Reporters are just trying to create a story because that's their job. Don't get why Raiders fans are so gung ho to run with it. OF COURSE the roster was going to get shaken up. In case anyone forgot, we're picking in the top 10 for a reason. And I'll also remind us that our locker room was in disarray last season which had to be rectified. Obviously Crab and King were easy targets. Nelson being available and King being a punter made them lol hanging fruit Also, news flash: when a team hires a new head coach, they try to shape the roster to their preference and scheme. $100 million HC or rookie HC just the same. Clearly Gruden puts a higher value on STs and blocking FBs than our old staff so we adjusted accordingly If there's one thing that would give me pause it's Grudens comments about our recent draft classes. Those fall a lot on Reggie. They are gung ho because they didn't like Reggie to begin with. Any chance to drive a wedge, be critical, "joke" about him or hope openly he is fired they will seize on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mct288 Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 37 minutes ago, Silver&Black88 said: This. Reporters are just trying to create a story because that's their job. Don't get why Raiders fans are so gung ho to run with it. OF COURSE the roster was going to get shaken up. In case anyone forgot, we're picking in the top 10 for a reason. And I'll also remind us that our locker room was in disarray last season which had to be rectified. Obviously Crab and King were easy targets. Nelson being available and King being a punter made them lol hanging fruit Also, news flash: when a team hires a new head coach, they try to shape the roster to their preference and scheme. $100 million HC or rookie HC just the same. Clearly Gruden puts a higher value on STs and blocking FBs than our old staff so we adjusted accordingly If there's one thing that would give me pause it's Grudens comments about our recent draft classes. Those fall a lot on Reggie. Anytime someone gets an inflated sense of self and it backfires (i.e. Marquette King) I will now refer to it as lol hanging fruit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver&Black88 Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 1 hour ago, NightTrainLane said: They are gung ho because they didn't like Reggie to begin with. Any chance to drive a wedge, be critical, "joke" about him or hope openly he is fired they will seize on. I feel like it isn't that cut and dry but maybe 51 minutes ago, mct288 said: Anytime someone gets an inflated sense of self and it backfires (i.e. Marquette King) I will now refer to it as lol hanging fruit. This comment was lol hanging fruit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 16 hours ago, NightTrainLane said: They have said it over and over again that they are working together. What else are they going to say? I'm sure they are "working together" but who's got final say? Gruden. He's added 20+ players to this roster. All the fan bias aside about "finding his players" can stop. Gruden clearly studied the roster, and by the shear amount of signings.... evidenced he wasn't impressed with it. 16 hours ago, NightTrainLane said: This narrative that some are trying to push about control has been shot down multiple times by the men themselves. Again... because they have to say all the right things. Gruden is 100% in control and that is evident. Reggie philosophy is building through the draft. Gruden's is signing veteran players. What do you see right now? I see a bunch of veteran players coming in which soon will result in a bunch of Reggie's guys going out. 16 hours ago, NightTrainLane said: So it's not about fans NEEDING there to be a warm/fuzzy feeling, it's that there is a good working relationship, when those that want to divide would rather there not be. It's not a mystery that all the Reggie haters are the same ones shouting that he has no "control" when that isn't how you would describe his job as I noted above. Nobody wants divide. I'm just not turning a blind eye and soaking in the media friendly speak from the organization. Also, I've been a Reggie supporter from day 1 and still am. I prefer Reggie orchestrate the roster and draft. But he's been downsized exponentially. This has the same Gruden/Allen qualities where Gruden calls the shots, builds the rosters with veteran players. Issues was in Tampa, he didn't draft well. We will really see this dynamic in a few weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightTrainLane Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 40 minutes ago, big_palooka said: What else are they going to say? I'm sure they are "working together" but who's got final say? Gruden. He's added 20+ players to this roster. All the fan bias aside about "finding his players" can stop. Gruden clearly studied the roster, and by the shear amount of signings.... evidenced he wasn't impressed with it. Again... because they have to say all the right things. Gruden is 100% in control and that is evident. Reggie philosophy is building through the draft. Gruden's is signing veteran players. What do you see right now? I see a bunch of veteran players coming in which soon will result in a bunch of Reggie's guys going out. Nobody wants divide. I'm just not turning a blind eye and soaking in the media friendly speak from the organization. Also, I've been a Reggie supporter from day 1 and still am. I prefer Reggie orchestrate the roster and draft. But he's been downsized exponentially. This has the same Gruden/Allen qualities where Gruden calls the shots, builds the rosters with veteran players. Issues was in Tampa, he didn't draft well. We will really see this dynamic in a few weeks. As to who as final say none of us know and if you say you do or "it's evident" you're making assumptions. Of course, he is making changes because this roster was built with/for a different coaching staff with different schemes and philosophies. There is always high turnover in regime changes. Miss me with that false equivalency. Replacing Allen and Del Rio with a football mind like Gruden will displace some of the decisions Reggie had to make in the past with regard to players especially in the first year of him being here like I said above. That doesn't mean that after this year they won't get right back to building thru the draft after Gruden has a foundation of players he likes. It doesn't mean that Reggie will be pushed out. It doesn't mean that Gruden has 100% control. Reggie has looked happier than I have ever seen him when talking about his job and working with a staff with a solid direction and clear communication. We have 11 draft picks this year and I think we will continue to have a high # of picks for the next 2-3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidersedge Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Here is Reggie McKenzie's draft history with the Raiders by positions. No way is Gruden gonna let him draft anymore. I'm not even saying Gruden is some genius at drafting but I am saying Reggie's time is up and its best we go in a different direction, which I believe we are. Jon tried to bring in Elliot Wolfe for a reason. QB R4 - Tyler Wilson - Arkansas R2 - Derek Carr - Fresno State R4 - Connor Cook - Michigan State RB R6 - Latavius Murray - Central Florida R5 - DeAndré Washington - Texas Tech R7 - Elijah Hood - North Carolina WR R5 - Juron Criner - Arizona R7 - Brice Butler - San Diego State R1 - Amari Cooper - Alabama R7 - Andre Debose - Florida TE R6 - Nick Kasa - Colorado R6 - Mychal Rivera - Tennessee R3 - Clive Walford - Miami OT R3 - Tony Bergstrom - Utah R2- Menelik Watson - Florida State R7 - Anthony Morris - Tennessee State R7 - Vadal Alexander - LSU R4 - David Sharpe - Florida R7 - Jylan Ware - Alabama State OG R3 - Gabe Jackson - Mississippi State R4 - Jon Feliciano - Miami DE R5 - Jack Crawford - Penn State R7 - David Bass - Missouri Western State R1 - Khalil Mack - Buffalo R7 - Shelby Harris - Illinois State R2 - Mario Edwards Jr. - Florida State R6 - Max Valles - Virginia R3 - Shilique Calhoun - Michigan State R2 - Jihad Ward - Illinois DT R6 - Christo Bilukidi - Georgia State R6 - Stacy McGee - Oklahoma R4 - Justin Ellis - Louisiana Tech R3 - Eddie Vanderdoes - UCLA R7 - Treyvon Hester - Toledo LB R4 - Miles Burris - San Diego State R7 - Nathan Stupar - Penn State R3 - Sio Moore - Connecticut R5 - Ben Heeney - Kansas R5 - Neiron Ball - Florida R6 - Cory James - Colorado State R5 - Marquel Lee - Wake Forest CB R1- DJ Hayden - Houston R4 - Keith McGill - Utah R7 - TJ Carrie - Ohio R7 - Dexter McDonald - Kansas R1 - Gareon Conley - Ohio State S R7 - Jonathan Dowling - Western Kentucky R1 - Karl Joseph - West Virginia R2 - Obi Melifonwu - Connecticut R7 - Shalom Luani - Washington State Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 1 hour ago, NightTrainLane said: As to who as final say none of us know and if you say you do or "it's evident" you're making assumptions. Of course, he is making changes because this roster was built with/for a different coaching staff with different schemes and philosophies. There is always high turnover in regime changes. Miss me with that false equivalency. Replacing Allen and Del Rio with a football mind like Gruden will displace some of the decisions Reggie had to make in the past with regard to players especially in the first year of him being here like I said above. That doesn't mean that after this year they won't get right back to building thru the draft after Gruden has a foundation of players he likes. It doesn't mean that Reggie will be pushed out. It doesn't mean that Gruden has 100% control. Reggie has looked happier than I have ever seen him when talking about his job and working with a staff with a solid direction and clear communication. We have 11 draft picks this year and I think we will continue to have a high # of picks for the next 2-3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 9 minutes ago, raidersedge said: Here is Reggie McKenzie's draft history with the Raiders by positions. No way is Gruden gonna let him draft anymore. I'm not even saying Gruden is some genius at drafting but I am saying Reggie's time is up and its best we go in a different direction, which I believe we are. Jon tried to bring in Elliot Wolfe for a reason. Wow... when you break those out, other than Carr, Mack, Cooper and Jackson..... what an awful performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidersedge Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Yeah. Putting them in positions really shows how horrible the drafting has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightTrainLane Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 2 hours ago, big_palooka said: Your kid is fugly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 3 hours ago, raidersedge said: Yeah. Putting them in positions really shows how horrible the drafting has been. It really does. And that's why we're signing all those FAs now. We didn't build much of anything through the draft. We got a handful of pretty good players but not the depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madleg81 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Reggie's draft's have been Gawd awful...I've lost track when I would see our pick come up and there were quality guys on the board and when our pick was announced my immediate reaction was "WHO?" But this year's draft will speak volumes to 2 things....1) Who's philisophy and voice will ring loudest in the war room between Gruden and Reggie and 2) Has Gruden's time away and doing nothing but film study helped him identify prospects better this time around. I've lost a lot of faith in Reggie when it comes to the draft and I expect more whiffs than hits at this point. I pray Gruden is an upgrade because if not, this team will be stuck in nuetral for some years to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonGruber Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 7 hours ago, big_palooka said: Wow... when you break those out, other than Carr, Mack, Cooper and Jackson..... what an awful performance. I have lost some faith as well But IF Conley plays like that number 1 Corner and Melifonwu has a good year most will be forgiven but that’s just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.