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#7th Greatest WR of All Time?

mdonnelly21

By mdonnelly21
in NFL Comparisons

..  

32 members have voted

  1. 1. #7th Greatest WR of All Time

    • Marvin Harrison
      12
    • Chris Carter
      4
    • Michael Irvin
      4
    • Andre Johnson
      2
    • Torry Holt
      3
    • Paul Warfield
      0
    • Lance Alworth
      4
    • James Lofton
      0
    • Steve Largent
      1
    • Other
      2

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mdonnelly21

mdonnelly21

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7 hours ago, Danger said:

Marvin Harrison >> Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, and especially Don Huston.

I won't be voting since you didn't give us a poll for #4. (Just going to select other so I can see the results)

The main reason I didn't do a #4. Was because of the overwhelming voting for those guys on #3. 

It was crystal clear who was likely going to win the next ones. And for the close one like Fitzgerald and Megatron I did a square off with them giving me the clear answer. 

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Nnivolcm

Nnivolcm

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2 minutes ago, Danger said:

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Marvin played longer, better career stats, and had a stronger prime than Calvin Johnson. 


Jeez. People get so upset when I say I don't have Calvin Johnson in my top 4-5 WRs ever.

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There's a whole lot of context you're ignoring. One mostly played with a QB who is considered by most a top 3 all time QB. The other played nearly half his career with a dumpster fire collection, and the other half with a guy most consider a top 10 current QB. 

Sure Marvin played longer, but that's pretty irrelevant imo. Harrison retired after the Colts didn't want him anymore. Johnson retired on his own terms when all 32 teams still would have loved to have him on their roster (I'd bet most teams would still love to have him today).

How did Harrison have a stronger prime than Johnson? The most yards Harrison ever had in a season was 1722 in '02 while Johnson had an NFL record 1964 in '12. The most TDs Harrison ever had was 15 in '01 and '04 ('04 with Manning winning MVP) while Johnson had 16 in '11. 

Both WRs were undeniably great. I think it's clear who defensive coaches thought were more of a threat when only Calvin warranted this kind of attention:

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Danger

Danger

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When you're looking back on it all, it doesn't matter who COULD have done what, what matters is WHO did what. If it were based off potential alone then yes Calvin outshines everyone including Moss and Jerry Rice. 

You're also ignoring the fact that Calvin Johnson was literally the only option they had so of course they're going to be forcing the ball to him all the time. Matthew Stafford is far from a slouch (top 10 QB) and Calvin had him throwing him the ball for more than half of his career. 

Marvin Harrison had a better prime by the stats I showed you above, but it's clear you ignored those. Per 16 games in their respective best 8 year stretches, Marvin Harrison had superior statistics overall, even if he had a few less yards per game.

I get it, you're a Lions fan, you're gonna support your guy, but there's really nothing outlandish about me thinking that Marvin Harrison was a more successful and more productive WR than Calvin Johnson. As I said before if we're talking about talent alone then Calvin Johnson is #1 easily, but in that same vein, that'd mean that Don Huston isn't in the top 100. 

One MORE thing. Calvin Johnson also played in the most passing friendly era of the NFL. Marvin Harrison's prime in large part was not at that time. That benefits Calvin Statistically. 

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Nnivolcm

Nnivolcm

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43 minutes ago, Danger said:

When you're looking back on it all, it doesn't matter who COULD have done what, what matters is WHO did what. If it were based off potential alone then yes Calvin outshines everyone including Moss and Jerry Rice. 

You're also ignoring the fact that Calvin Johnson was literally the only option they had so of course they're going to be forcing the ball to him all the time. Matthew Stafford is far from a slouch (top 10 QB) and Calvin had him throwing him the ball for more than half of his career. 

Marvin Harrison had a better prime by the stats I showed you above, but it's clear you ignored those. Per 16 games in their respective best 8 year stretches, Marvin Harrison had superior statistics overall, even if he had a few less yards per game.

I get it, you're a Lions fan, you're gonna support your guy, but there's really nothing outlandish about me thinking that Marvin Harrison was a more successful and more productive WR than Calvin Johnson. As I said before if we're talking about talent alone then Calvin Johnson is #1 easily, but in that same vein, that'd mean that Don Huston isn't in the top 100. 

One MORE thing. Calvin Johnson also played in the most passing friendly era of the NFL. Marvin Harrison's prime in large part was not at that time. That benefits Calvin Statistically. 

I'm not ignoring that CJ was the Lions only weapon, in fact that strengthens my argument. It takes a lot less skill to amass those career stats when the defense has to account for other weapons on the offense. Not only did Harrison have a vastly superior QB than Johnson had, he also had multiple RBs to make multiple pro bowls. Johnson only ever had one RB go over 1k yards (Bush had 1006 yards rushing in 2013). In fact, I'm pretty sure Johnson only played in single digit amount of games where his team had a 100 yard rusher in his career. It's easier to defend the pass when you don't have to worry about the run. 

The stats you posted above were career stats and per game stats (conveniently minus the first 3 and last 2 years of Harrison's' career). Those aren't prime stats.  Those stats account for many games with the likes of Drew Stanton, Dan Orlovsky, and Shaun Hill throwing the ball. No WR in the history of ever would put up prime stats with those guys. Prime stats are when a player is at their absolute peak. Calvin Johnson had one of the highest peaks of all time. Harrison's peak simply doesn't compare. By your definition of prime (best 8 years) Harrison had help from Peyton Manning, who won 4 MVPs in that time. Johnson had the same cast of characters as listed above minus 16 games with Kitna his rookie year. Your definition of "prime" is a bad one that you designed to make Harrison look better by comparison. 

I am a Lions fan, but if you polled the Lions forum I bet more people would label me a cynic than a drinker of Kool aid. I'm not supporting Calvin because I'm a Lions fan and he played for the Lions (in fact, if that was the case I would be arguing against him as he's said some not so nice things about my favorite team since retiring). I'm arguing that Calvin Johnson was a better player than Harrison because everything outside of longevity supports that opinion. 

Responding to one MORE thing, if you're talking about peak Marvin Harrison as being the best 8 years in his career, he was playing in the same passing friendly era. That point is a wash. 

calvinjohnson3on1bengals.gif?w=640

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GamedayGuru

GamedayGuru

Posted
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1 hour ago, Danger said:

PyyfwwQ.png

WRvorCW.png

Marvin played longer, better career stats, and had a stronger prime than Calvin Johnson. 


Jeez. People get so upset when I say I don't have Calvin Johnson in my top 4-5 WRs ever.

U seriously using the stats argument? lame. 

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