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GDT Week 9: Baltimore Ravens vs pittsberg steelers

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32 minutes ago, BaltimoreTerp said:

That's 3 plays where Flacco should have converted touchdowns - the throw to Andrews is a TD with a better QB/throw, and the other two are obvious. Your QB literally costing you points like that is absolutely something worth bringing up, as comforting as it might otherwise be to just yell about the offensive line/running game/the weapons Matt Ryan has or whatever else we do. 

Agreed with this. Flacco missed at least 2 easy touchdowns in 2 different ways (inaccuracy and lack of progressions). To discount that is disappointing.

I'd like to also draw attention to what Marty/Greg Roman/Joe D are asking our OL to do still. Why is this happening?

You can't win games in the trenches like this. I'm simply baffled at what's happened between last year and this year.

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1 hour ago, BaltimoreTerp said:

That's 3 plays where Flacco should have converted touchdowns - the throw to Andrews is a TD with a better QB/throw, and the other two are obvious. Your QB literally costing you points like that is absolutely something worth bringing up, as comforting as it might otherwise be to just yell about the offensive line/running game/the weapons Matt Ryan has or whatever else we do. 

My point is, that if we go over Big Bens play in that game, it is very very similar to Flaccos play. Of course its not a 1-1 on missed/completed throws, but Joe seems on par with Big Ben in that game, but Ben benefits from bigger playmakers. Several of their greatest plays came from short dump offs and screens to Conner and Brown, including two of their scores.

If the difference in those two plays in the end zone is what makes Big Ben great and Flacco poor, so be it, because then its such a narrow line between failure and succes.

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2 minutes ago, BaltimoreTerp said:

That's 3 plays where Flacco should have converted touchdowns - the throw to Andrews is a TD with a better QB/throw, and the other two are obvious. Your QB literally costing you points like that is absolutely something worth bringing up, as comforting as it might otherwise be to just yell about the offensive line/running game/the weapons Matt Ryan has or whatever else we do. 

Of course it's something worth bringing up. Flacco absolutely can make those plays, and should. It isn't however- the sole reason we lost the game. Your QB not having a 100% conversion rate on their RedZone throws in a game sucks, but it also isn't a reasonable expectation game to game. Any time Flacco misses a throw, the overreactions are simply incredible. The fans of this club seem to be completely out of touch with the realities of the position league wide. I was laughing watching the Packers-Patriots match up from Sunday Night, thinking how critical fans are of Joe. Brady and Rodgers miss on multiple throws, won't see a TD, commit to the wrong read etc, yet fans act like there is this magic level of Quarterbacking on other teams where this doesn't occur. 

This conversation/discussion is always over complicated for no reason. Yes, Flacco makes mistakes. Just like Brady and Rodgers make mistakes, the same exact ones. Flacco makes more of those mistakes though, because he isn't as good at the position of Quarterback as they are. That will never change. From there, the production received from any of them can be influenced by A) Coaching B) Scheme C) Weapons D) Protection E) Opposition F) Health.

It would be awesome if we had an All-Time Great at the position, but we don't. We have Joe Flacco. On a team with a massive disparity of talent & investment leaned towards the Defense. We have decent Wide Receivers & Tight Ends and a passable Offensive Line. Along with a whatever Offensive Coordinator. What that can equal, tends to be what we've gotten. An offense that can average 30+ the first 4 games, and barely 20 the next 5. 

If you want to criticize Flacco, fine. Every player on this club is certainly worthy of having their play analyzed and evaluated. Stop acting like he isn't a valuable asset to this team though. We don't have access to a better player. It's like pinning losses on our Defense solely because Michael Pierce isn't John Randle, and didn't make X, Y, and Z play. It's even worse though because of the symbiotic nature of Offense. We aren't 4-5 because of Flacco, and if we didn't have him we'd be in a worse position.

@Danand brings up a key point. Flacco's errors hurt us more because we don't have the line and or weapons to compensate for those lost opportunities. Which is true, and also puts the situation into perspective. If the Defense doesn't perform to it's expected level, then Flacco can't play to a Game Manager level. He has to play at an Above Average level, which he usually does. If the Defense gets beat up on though, he has to play at a Great to Elite level. Which both he and the Offense are not capable of doing consistently, because they aren't built to do so. 

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2 hours ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Agreed with this. Flacco missed at least 2 easy touchdowns in 2 different ways (inaccuracy and lack of progressions). To discount that is disappointing.

I'd like to also draw attention to what Marty/Greg Roman/Joe D are asking our OL to do still. Why is this happening?

You can't win games in the trenches like this. I'm simply baffled at what's happened between last year and this year.

That explains a lot.  I was so confused watching the game live as to why I saw Lewis out on the right side more than once on passing plays.

Seems like trickery for the sake of trickery without realising that the reason the opposition wouldn't expect you to do it is because it's stupid

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2 hours ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

I'd like to also draw attention to what Marty/Greg Roman/Joe D are asking our OL to do still. Why is this happening?

It's a little controversial, but I've figured it out.

Greg Roman 2017

cs5kq5eocpl3pubjegxu.jpg

 

Greg Roman 2018 - He shaved the Goatee.

 

Roman has devolved from a rugged no nonsense run game guru, into a cherub like infant treating our lineman like his personal baby toys. 

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53 minutes ago, DreamKid said:

Of course it's something worth bringing up. Flacco absolutely can make those plays, and should. It isn't however- the sole reason we lost the game. Your QB not having a 100% conversion rate on their RedZone throws in a game sucks, but it also isn't a reasonable expectation game to game. Any time Flacco misses a throw, the overreactions are simply incredible. The fans of this club seem to be completely out of touch with the realities of the position league wide. I was laughing watching the Packers-Patriots match up from Sunday Night, thinking how critical fans are of Joe. Brady and Rodgers miss on multiple throws, won't see a TD, commit to the wrong read etc, yet fans act like there is this magic level of Quarterbacking on other teams where this doesn't occur. 

This conversation/discussion is always over complicated for no reason. Yes, Flacco makes mistakes. Just like Brady and Rodgers make mistakes, the same exact ones. Flacco makes more of those mistakes though, because he isn't as good at the position of Quarterback as they are. That will never change. From there, the production received from any of them can be influenced by A) Coaching B) Scheme C) Weapons D) Protection E) Opposition F) Health.

It would be awesome if we had an All-Time Great at the position, but we don't. We have Joe Flacco. On a team with a massive disparity of talent & investment leaned towards the Defense. We have decent Wide Receivers & Tight Ends and a passable Offensive Line. Along with a whatever Offensive Coordinator. What that can equal, tends to be what we've gotten. An offense that can average 30+ the first 4 games, and barely 20 the next 5. 

If you want to criticize Flacco, fine. Every player on this club is certainly worthy of having their play analyzed and evaluated. Stop acting like he isn't a valuable asset to this team though. We don't have access to a better player. It's like pinning losses on our Defense solely because Michael Pierce isn't John Randle, and didn't make X, Y, and Z play. It's even worse though because of the symbiotic nature of Offense. We aren't 4-5 because of Flacco, and if we didn't have him we'd be in a worse position.

@Danand brings up a key point. Flacco's errors hurt us more because we don't have the line and or weapons to compensate for those lost opportunities. Which is true, and also puts the situation into perspective. If the Defense doesn't perform to it's expected level, then Flacco can't play to a Game Manager level. He has to play at an Above Average level, which he usually does. If the Defense gets beat up on though, he has to play at a Great to Elite level. Which both he and the Offense are not capable of doing consistently, because they aren't built to do so. 

I am very much in line with everything you just wrote, and I believe this is as fair to Flaccos ability and deficiencies as it can be described. Well put.

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On 11/6/2018 at 1:11 AM, DreamKid said:

The play I referenced. This guy is from Baltimore Beatdown and also noticed it's absurdity, which wasn't hard. You can't hide from the ALL-22 Marty.

 

The biggest issue I see upon rewatching this play isn’t the play design, it’s Flacco. He gets the ball out so quickly and so short of the sticks with a play that has almost no chance of working.

Look at the bottom of the screen. If Flacco holds the ball just a split second longer, you’ve got the TE running a curl route that can give a slight pick to the defender covering that zone. The WR at the bottom is running a slant route that with good ball placement you hit the receiver in stride for a potential first down.

If Flacco holds the ball for just 2.5-3 seconds vs 1.5-2 seconds, that pass is there. And if we somehow don’t get the first down, it’s going to be 4th and inches with a chance to be aggressive. Instead Flacco makes a horrible decision and plays incredibly conservative almost as if he’s not even TRYING to move the chains. He had quality blocking on the play and chose to rush his throw.

Edited by diamondbull424

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19 hours ago, drd23 said:

That explains a lot.  I was so confused watching the game live as to why I saw Lewis out on the right side more than once on passing plays.

Seems like trickery for the sake of trickery without realising that the reason the opposition wouldn't expect you to do it is because it's stupid

I disagree with the assessment and the blame here. There’s a difference between them calling this play due to believing they can take advantage of a specific alignment and Flacco coming to the line, seeing this alignment and noticing that the PA pass is going to be a busted play if he runs it. Sometimes a QB has to bail out his coaches, just like receivers will sometimes have to bail out their QB from a poorly thrown pass. This is one of those moments for the former. This is the type of play that you audible out of and perhaps revisit later.

The offensive coaches deserve some blame, sure, but Joe Flacco isn’t a young QB anymore. He’s a veteran QB that has had a couple years in this offense now to get acclimated and many years in the NFL to notice when a play is so impossible to execute that a change needs to be made.

Clearly Joe must not be aware of the blocking responsibilities and instead just knows “his role only” and thus he’s not cerebral enough to know when to kill a play. This play being so ineffective is due to a Joe Flacco limitation.

Edited by diamondbull424

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Wink needs to get this middle of the field fiasco figured out, and quick.

Among all the times we did get burned there during the game, the defense actually got bailed out a couple times too. Right out of the 2 Minute break in the first half, the steelers got juju on Mosley once again and nailed us for a huge play. Fortunately a late drop from juju negated it, but he had plenty of daylight otherwise. 

This has happened time and time again, in the Bengal game Peanut got burned by Tyler Boyd for a TD. The Saints did it, the Panthers did it, the steelers did it. It isn't getting better, it's getting worse. Knowing we aren't adjusting, coordinators are throwing rubs at the linebackers to make the mismatches hurt that much worse. 

We may be getting a glimpse into the limitations of Wink's ability. 9 Games is a healthy sample size, and I'm growing less impressed each game. 

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