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Doc Draper

What to do about the quarterbacks?

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38 minutes ago, e16bball said:

I’ve talked a lot about how drafting a QB outside the top half of the 1st round has become a basically fruitless pursuit in the last decade or so. The fact that essentially every team in the league chose to pass on them means they likely lack *something* necessary to be a good starting QB. 

Of all the QBs selected in that barren wasteland since 2010, only 6 have thrown even 800 passes and been better than league-average (by passer rating). These guys are just not emerging as viable franchise QBs.

And of the top 4 among all those guys, two of them are the two QBs Jay Gruden has featured during his NFL tenure (Cousins and Dalton, of course). In other words, he’s taken two guys nobody really thought much of and — without much of a run game to speak of on either roster — he’s turned them into above-average starting NFL QBs. Put another way, Jay Gruden has developed as many of that top 4 as the rest of the NFL combined.

He’s a good QB coach. You could say he lucked into it, had it just happened once. But he’s now done it twice, when no one else does it, and that’s likely indicative of a true talent for it. We don’t know at this point whether he can turn a great prospect into a great QB — but we know he’s good enough to turn a marginal prospect into a viable (if not quite good enough) long-term starter.

 

Amen

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I kinda wonder if Jay Gruden gets an extension mid-season? It may seem crazy but I think he wins a power struggle between he and Bruce. I truly believe Dan loves him as his coach. I personally don’t want it unless something amazing happens but it is what it is. 

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12 hours ago, e16bball said:

He’s a good QB coach. You could say he lucked into it, had it just happened once. But he’s now done it twice, when no one else does it, and that’s likely indicative of a true talent for it. We don’t know at this point whether he can turn a great prospect into a great QB — but we know he’s good enough to turn a marginal prospect into a viable (if not quite good enough) long-term starter.

And if he were our QB coach, or even just our offensive coordinator, I would be okay with that.

As a head coach, he leaves a lot to be desired.

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7 hours ago, lavar703 said:

I kinda wonder if Jay Gruden gets an extension mid-season? It may seem crazy but I think he wins a power struggle between he and Bruce. I truly believe Dan loves him as his coach. I personally don’t want it unless something amazing happens but it is what it is. 

I've mentioned before, I would do it prior to the season. Right now, actually. Extend him for another season or two. 

Not because I think he's a great coach or because I really want him at the helm of the ship -- but he's going to be the man in charge this season, and I want him coaching with a long-term goal in mind, not a short-term "save my job" mindset. That short-term thinking is what ruins promising QB prospects. Haskins should take the field for one reason and one reason only: because he's prepared enough to be deemed ready to play as an NFL QB at a competitive level and benefit from the experience. "He gives us a better chance to win than Colt McCoy" isn't a good enough reason to play him if he's not ready. And God forbid the "he's the future and we want to give the fans (and the fickle ownership) a chance to see him play and get excited for what's to come" thought process enters Jay's mind. 

I want him making the best decisions for Haskins's long-term future. Period. If the job security that comes with an extension helps him to feel comfortable managing Haskins in that way, so be it.

4 hours ago, Woz said:

And if he were our QB coach, or even just our offensive coordinator, I would be okay with that.

As a head coach, he leaves a lot to be desired.

I agree with your second line there, for the most part. 

But earlier in this thread, two posters that I respect were (either bluntly or musingly) suggesting that Gruden may not be very good at developing and deploying QBs. Which I think is not really borne out by the past 10 years. 

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38 minutes ago, e16bball said:

But earlier in this thread, two posters that I respect were (either bluntly or musingly) suggesting that Gruden may not be very good at developing and deploying QBs. Which I think is not really borne out by the past 10 years. 

And I'll concede your point that he took okay QBs and made them viable NFL starters.

The question is can he take Haskins and make him a star? Remember, he was originally hired to "fix" RG3. Now, he may have decided early on that Griffin's ego couldn't be checked and thus hitching his wagon to him was a fool's errand. Put another way: can he mold his system to match his quarterback?

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1 hour ago, Woz said:

And I'll concede your point that he took okay QBs and made them viable NFL starters.

The question is can he take Haskins and make him a star? Remember, he was originally hired to "fix" RG3. Now, he may have decided early on that Griffin's ego couldn't be checked and thus hitching his wagon to him was a fool's errand. Put another way: can he mold his system to match his quarterback?

I think the issue with RG3 and Gruden was that Cousins was here and it was easier to turn Kirk into an NFL QB than it would’ve been Griffin. While Griffin had the much higher ceiling there was just so much work that needed to be done to get him up to speed and I think Jay just moved onto Cousins like most in the organization. 

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30 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

I think the issue with RG3 and Gruden was that Cousins was here and it was easier to turn Kirk into an NFL QB than it would’ve been Griffin. While Griffin had the much higher ceiling there was just so much work that needed to be done to get him up to speed and I think Jay just moved onto Cousins like most in the organization. 

Maybe so. Still my question remains. If the rumors are true that Gruden didn't want Haskins, then why? Is it he didn't want to be saddled with a rookie QB when he was on the hot seat (understandable, and goes to @e16bball's point that they should extend him sooner than later)? Did he see some glaring flaw that the front office (or at least Snyder and Allen) overlooked/dismissed (also possible)? Or does he think he can shoehorn a vet into his system than try change a rookie?

It's entirely possible that I've been drinking too long from the anti-Kool-Aid well and all of this is just me worrying unnecessarily. However, with this franchise, if you aren't sure of something, the safe bet is to wager on them being stupid or short-sighted.

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2 hours ago, Woz said:

Maybe so. Still my question remains. If the rumors are true that Gruden didn't want Haskins, then why? Is it he didn't want to be saddled with a rookie QB when he was on the hot seat (understandable, and goes to @e16bball's point that they should extend him sooner than later)? Did he see some glaring flaw that the front office (or at least Snyder and Allen) overlooked/dismissed (also possible)? Or does he think he can shoehorn a vet into his system than try change a rookie?

It's entirely possible that I've been drinking too long from the anti-Kool-Aid well and all of this is just me worrying unnecessarily. However, with this franchise, if you aren't sure of something, the safe bet is to wager on them being stupid or short-sighted.

Most of the stuff I’ve heard recently is Gruden is starting to fall for Haskins. He didn’t expect him to be this much of a student of the game and his talent is off the charts. Obviously that could all be a load of crap but trusted local media members are reporting this. 

I think he saw one year of starting experience, probably read the things Haskins dad said and decided it would be just another headache. I think now that he’s actually had time to really sit down with him and sees how much he wants to learn that it’s really winning him over. I still think Haskins starts week one and the decision is made by Gruden. 

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10 hours ago, Woz said:

Maybe so. Still my question remains. If the rumors are true that Gruden didn't want Haskins, then why? Is it he didn't want to be saddled with a rookie QB when he was on the hot seat (understandable, and goes to @e16bball's point that they should extend him sooner than later)? Did he see some glaring flaw that the front office (or at least Snyder and Allen) overlooked/dismissed (also possible)? Or does he think he can shoehorn a vet into his system than try change a rookie?

It' s entirely possible that I've been drinking too long from the anti-Kool-Aid well and all of this is just me worrying unnecessarily. However, with this franchise, if you aren't sure of something, the safe bet is to wager on them being stupid or short-sighted.

iXNS93eYEr0dxGZEgYmw7slE5mFjPnv3LuShur4_ 

But neither is likely 

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Explain to me how the Redskins were “short sided” when they took a QB in round 1? 

Seems to me they were thinking of the future when they did that.

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On 5/25/2019 at 11:46 AM, turtle28 said:

Explain to me how the Redskins were “short sided” when they took a QB in round 1? 

Seems to me they were thinking of the future when they did that.

One: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/shortsighted (has nothing to do with sides)

Two: we had been discussing the QB in relation to his current head coach and how the coach's contract's incipient expiration might make for shortsighted decisions.

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