badgers0821 Posted March 23, 2020 Author Share Posted March 23, 2020 5 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Do you see him beating out Linsley? It’s possible, or Turner at RG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 4 hours ago, badgers0821 said: It’s possible, or Turner at RG. It's not possible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 11 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Do you see him beating out Linsley? If we got him we could move on from Linsley and keep the 8.5 million. There are other alternatives rather than take a lesser prospect because you don't think the better one can play immediately. Linsley isn't getting a third contract next year. It happens every year in the draft. I team likes a player, but has a guy so they select player anyway and release or trade the guy they have. Also, the idea that all three interior guys will hold up for 16 games is unlikely. If the kid is a player, he's a player. I like Ruiz better but that's just me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 4 minutes ago, Golfman said: If we got him we could move on from Linsley and keep the 8.5 million. There are other alternatives rather than take a lesser prospect because you don't think the better one can play immediately. Linsley isn't getting a third contract next year. It happens every year in the draft. I team likes a player, but has a guy so they select player anyway and release or trade the guy they have. Also, the idea that all three interior guys will hold up for 16 games is unlikely. If the kid is a player, he's a player. I like Ruiz better but that's just me! What are we going to do with the 8.5 million? We already have 12million (including the rollover) that we already need to spend. By the time the draft rolls around, the market is going to be picked clean, and sitting there with 20 million dollars in unused cap space with our QB situation is unforgivable. Is there anybody concerned about the backup interior situation with Taylor and Patrick? Our IOL 4 and 5 is excellent. If you want to make the argument that drafting Biadiasz for the 2021-2024 seasons makes sense, that's fine. But call a spade a spade, that is not a pick meant to maximize our changes this year. That is a pick that is only going to start paying dividends when we have a 38 year old QB with a 36 million dollar cap hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 I think the point is "project" is a guy who flat out needs work to be viable on the field, not someone who couldn't beat out an established vet their rookie year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 Just now, spilltray said: I think the point is "project" is a guy who flat out needs work to be viable on the field, not someone who couldn't beat out an established vet their rookie year. Which is fair. I was using it to mean, "Non, first year contributor". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 6 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: What are we going to do with the 8.5 million? We already have 12million (including the rollover) that we already need to spend. By the time the draft rolls around, the market is going to be picked clean, and sitting there with 20 million dollars in unused cap space with our QB situation is unforgivable. Is there anybody concerned about the backup interior situation with Taylor and Patrick? Our IOL 4 and 5 is excellent. If you want to make the argument that drafting Biadiasz for the 2021-2024 seasons makes sense, that's fine. But call a spade a spade, that is not a pick meant to maximize our changes this year. That is a pick that is only going to start paying dividends when we have a 38 year old QB with a 36 million dollar cap hit. You don't think there are going to be guys cut after the draft we could use? There are every year but you think this year is going to be different? You don't think we could use that money to allow us to keep an additional free agent next year? Either by extension this year of additional cap space next year. More importantly and this is the biggest question. You think it is wise to pass up a better prospect in the 3rd round because maybe another guy may play this year? I don't think you make poor decisions out of hoping a lesser talent will help you this year. It hurts you down the road. If this kid is the top player on our board, you grab him. It's not often you get a kid in the draft who you plug and play and does as well as Jenkins. That is anything but the norm. I actually think we might agree on that point alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 Just now, Golfman said: You don't think there are going to be guys cut after the draft we could use? There are every year but you think this year is going to be different? You don't think we could use that money to allow us to keep an additional free agent next year? Either by extension this year of additional cap space next year. More importantly and this is the biggest question. You think it is wise to pass up a better prospect in the 3rd round because maybe another guy may play this year? I don't think you make poor decisions out of hoping a lesser talent will help you this year. It hurts you down the road. If this kid is the top player on our board, you grab him. It's not often you get a kid in the draft who you plug and play and does as well as Jenkins. That is anything but the norm. I actually think we might agree on that point alone. Not that are going to cost anywhere near 20 million? The guys getting cut after the draft are almost always dirt cheap. Anybody worth any money gets cut during free agency so the teams can use that cap space. I don't give a **** about additional free agents next year, or about extending our guys next year. Aaron Rodgers is 37 years old and has a cap hit of 21.5 million in 2020. In 2021 he is 38 years old and has a cap hit of 36.5 million. Ancillary pieces in 2021 don't matter. If you can get Biadasz in the 3rd round, go for it. I don't believe that's happening. In fact I think we likely have to trade up from our 2nd round pick to get him. However, if I was convinced for some whacked out reasons that there was a guy who could contribute at a position immediately, I would go for that player, mainly because guys who can contribute immediately at the non-dreck positions, tend to stay contributors and even turn into stars. I don't necessarily agree with the idea that IOL can't contribute as rookies. The premium positions (QB, OT, Edge Rusher, DT and CB) and TE are the spots where you don't see rookies produce. RB, WR, IOL, ILB, Safety and Specialists routinely see rookies produce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 29 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Not that are going to cost anywhere near 20 million? The guys getting cut after the draft are almost always dirt cheap. Anybody worth any money gets cut during free agency so the teams can use that cap space. I don't give a **** about additional free agents next year, or about extending our guys next year. Aaron Rodgers is 37 years old and has a cap hit of 21.5 million in 2020. In 2021 he is 38 years old and has a cap hit of 36.5 million. Ancillary pieces in 2021 don't matter. If you can get Biadasz in the 3rd round, go for it. I don't believe that's happening. In fact I think we likely have to trade up from our 2nd round pick to get him. However, if I was convinced for some whacked out reasons that there was a guy who could contribute at a position immediately, I would go for that player, mainly because guys who can contribute immediately at the non-dreck positions, tend to stay contributors and even turn into stars. I don't necessarily agree with the idea that IOL can't contribute as rookies. The premium positions (QB, OT, Edge Rusher, DT and CB) and TE are the spots where you don't see rookies produce. RB, WR, IOL, ILB, Safety and Specialists routinely see rookies produce. You kind of took my words out of context there. I didn't say they couldn't contribute. The center from MN contributed, but he was mostly awful! Jenkins was pretty darn good as a rookie and that is not the norm. I guess I come from a place where we still need help at ILB, DL, WR, TE, another CB before he have a Super Bowl team. Not seeing all of that happen this year. I get the urgency with Rodgers age but do not see Gute taking that approach of all in for this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 52 minutes ago, Golfman said: You kind of took my words out of context there. I didn't say they couldn't contribute. The center from MN contributed, but he was mostly awful! Jenkins was pretty darn good as a rookie and that is not the norm. I guess I come from a place where we still need help at ILB, DL, WR, TE, another CB before he have a Super Bowl team. Not seeing all of that happen this year. I get the urgency with Rodgers age but do not see Gute taking that approach of all in for this year. We also had several IOL contribute immediately in a positive sense. Jenkins wasn't the only one. The Vikings not being able to draft OL isn't a reason to write it off. Jenkins was probably closer to average than the Vikings dude. You're never going to get every position filled. The best you can do is get the premiums filled and hope the lottery ticket players land at the non premiums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 4 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: We also had several IOL contribute immediately in a positive sense. Jenkins wasn't the only one. The Vikings not being able to draft OL isn't a reason to write it off. Jenkins was probably closer to average than the Vikings dude. You're never going to get every position filled. The best you can do is get the premiums filled and hope the lottery ticket players land at the non premiums. I agree, but the way we were curb stomped by the 49ers, twice made it clear we aren't there yet. We need another D-lineman at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 2 hours ago, Golfman said: I agree, but the way we were curb stomped by the 49ers, twice made it clear we aren't there yet. We need another D-lineman at least. Agreed. We need run stuffers, not these Justin Blacklock/Marlon Davidson/Neville Gallimore types who are pass rushers first, run defenders a distant second. This is why Raekwon Davis makes sense at 62, even if it's a bit of a reach. --- Here's a write-up on Chris Orr, looks like someone we could grab late Day 3 as a good rotational back-up at worst. https://www.si.com/college/wisconsin/football/nfl-draft-2020-chris-orr-wisconsin-football-pro-day I also think Biadsz at 94 isn't a bad idea as long as WR and IDL were addressed beforehand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 15 minutes ago, Joe said: Agreed. We need run stuffers, not these Justin Blacklock/Marlon Davidson/Neville Gallimore types who are pass rushers first, run defenders a distant second. This is why Raekwon Davis makes sense at 62, even if it's a bit of a reach. --- Here's a write-up on Chris Orr, looks like someone we could grab late Day 3 as a good rotational back-up at worst. https://www.si.com/college/wisconsin/football/nfl-draft-2020-chris-orr-wisconsin-football-pro-day I also think Biadsz at 94 isn't a bad idea as long as WR and IDL were addressed beforehand. I agree with you here, but also agree with @AlexGreen#20, he's likely to be gone by 94. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaximusGluteus Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 (edited) ...................... Edited April 6, 2020 by MaximusGluteus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 16 minutes ago, Golfman said: I agree with you here, but also agree with @AlexGreen#20, he's likely to be gone by 94. we have enough Day 3 capital to trade a few spots up. 16 minutes ago, MaximusGluteus said: You keep repeating this over and over and over. Where are you getting this from? What I read from the Combine stuff on the league site, TDN, and other places. Lesbihonest here....we lost 4 games because opposing teams rammed. the. ball. up. the. middle. and. down. our. throats. What part of that are some of you missing? It's like you weren't even watching the games... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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