The QB Thread: Everything Carr, Stidham and beyond...

[BackinBlack]

58 minutes ago, bucksavage1 said:

+Don’t forget the defense

+ Don’t forget continuity in The same offense

The circle of Carr excuses

No circle, its literally always just been the D. 
2016 we made the playoffs as D got turnovers. 
Last year, D got out of bottom 5, made playoffs. 

Every other year, terrible on D

[NYRaider]

1 minute ago, BackinBlack said:

No circle, its literally always just been the D. 
2016 we made the playoffs as D got turnovers. 
Last year, D got out of bottom 5, made playoffs. 

Every other year, terrible on D

Since that 2016 season our offense: 18.8 ppg (23rd), 18.1 ppg (28th), 19.6 ppg (24th), 27.1 ppg (10th), 22.0 ppg (18th)

So we've had one year where we ranked in the top half of the NFL in terms of scoring offense, lol.

[Geezy]

59 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

If we can somehow figure out how to retain our core offensive weapons, rebuild the offensive line, and build a top tier defense from scratch we may have enough for Carr to win with.

Or maybe just not have terrible pass pro and a defense that isn’t bottom 3 in everything. 

[NYRaider]

Just now, Geezy said:

Or maybe just not have terrible pass pro and a defense that isn’t bottom 3 in everything. 

The pass protection is better than it was last season and we're allowing less PPG, lol.

[Geezy]

1 minute ago, NYRaider said:

Since that 2016 season our offense: 18.8 ppg (23rd), 18.1 ppg (28th), 19.6 ppg (24th), 27.1 ppg (10th), 22.0 ppg (18th)

So we've had one year where we ranked in the top half of the NFL in terms of scoring offense, lol.

It’s a shame  Carr couldn’t get on the same page as  the corpse of Jordy Nelson, Andre Holmes and Zay Jones 

[BackinBlack]

Just now, NYRaider said:

Since that 2016 season our offense: 18.8 ppg (23rd), 18.1 ppg (28th), 19.6 ppg (24th), 27.1 ppg (10th), 22.0 ppg (18th)

So we've had one year where we ranked in the top half of the NFL in terms of scoring offense, lol.

Remember that year we had Nnamdi and we were the #1 pass D and everyone thoguht we were just so incredibly good at pass D
but in actuality, it was just because teams would run the ball down our throat every game? 

-
This is kind of similar to that. 
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When your D is bad, you typically cannot get off the field, and are losing, which makes teams run the ball more to protect their lead. 

No doubt our O needs to improve, but until we have a good D, games will come down to the wire, or we get blown out. 
 

[NYRaider]

1 minute ago, BackinBlack said:

Remember that year we had Nnamdi and we were the #1 pass D and everyone thoguht we were just so incredibly good at pass D
but in actuality, it was just because teams would run the ball down our throat every game? 

-
This is kind of similar to that. 
-
When your D is bad, you typically cannot get off the field, and are losing, which makes teams run the ball more to protect their lead. 

No doubt our O needs to improve, but until we have a good D, games will come down to the wire, or we get blown out. 
 

How did our average TOP increase this year then if this theory is correct? lol 

[BackinBlack]

Just now, NYRaider said:

How did our average TOP increase this year then if this theory is correct? lol 

Because we have JJ who is running well. 
But we end up kicking fgs.

Teams then run on us, and have scored 100% of times in the redzone. 
Essentially, they score 7 we score 3

[NYRaider]

1 minute ago, BackinBlack said:

Because we have JJ who is running well. 
But we end up kicking fgs.

Teams then run on us, and have scored 100% of times in the redzone. 
Essentially, they score 7 we score 3

Our red zone TD rate offensively - 2021: 51.7% | 2022: 51.9%

Opponents red zone TD rate defensively - 2021: 81.4% | 2022: 72.9%

[BackinBlack]

9 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Our red zone TD rate offensively - 2021: 51.7% | 2022: 51.9%

Opponents red zone TD rate defensively - 2021: 81.4% | 2022: 72.9%

def thought i saw it was 100%, guess that means we are improving that is good! thanks
But yes, so we score less in the redzone than our oppenents. 
Scoring redzone O is bad at 51.9%, needs to improve, 10th worst. 
Scoring redzone D is terrible at 72.9%, league worst, needs to improve greatly. 

Where the game matters most, we suck on both ends. 
One is literally league worst, one is bottom 10.

Not happy with either, but one is worse than the other

Edit to add;
Also since we arent scoring on O at end of games. . . teams are kneeling. I know Jax kneeled end of game in the redzone, wonder if that counts as one of our stops haha. 


 

Edited November 17, 2022 by BackinBlack

[NYRaider]

5 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

def thought i saw it was 100%, guess that means we are improving that is good! thanks
But yes, so we score less in the redzone than our oppenents. 
Scoring redzone O is bad at 51.9%, needs to improve, 10th worst. 
Scoring redzone D is terrible at 72.9%, league worst, needs to improve greatly. 

Where the game matters most, we suck on both ends. 
One is literally league worst, one is bottom 10.

Not happy with either, but one is worse than the other

Edit to add;
Also since we arent scoring on O at end of games. . . teams are kneeling. I know Jax kneeled end of game in the redzone, wonder if that counts as one of our stops haha. 

We've been terrible in the red zone with a great offensive line and a terrible offensive line, with a good running game and a bad running game, with terrible weapons and elite weapons, and with multiple head coaches and play callers. What's the common denominator here?

[BackinBlack]

2 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

We've been terrible in the red zone with a great offensive line and a terrible offensive line, with a good running game and a bad running game, with terrible weapons and elite weapons, and with multiple head coaches and play callers. What's the common denominator here?

Carr, probably top 5 in redzone penalties too 😂

But thts beside the point. 

32 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

No circle, its literally always just been the D. 
2016 we made the playoffs as D got turnovers. 
Last year, D got out of bottom 5, made playoffs. 

Every other year, terrible on D

That is the only excuse needed for Carr / any QB. 

You want to help out a young QB, build a D, or else you will be in shootouts week in and week out

[NYRaider]

3 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

Carr, probably top 5 in redzone penalties too 😂

But thts beside the point. 

That is the only excuse needed for Carr / any QB. 

You want to help out a young QB, build a D, or else you will be in shootouts week in and week out

The thing I find comical is that everyone blames the defense. Which I get, they've definitely been pretty bad for years. But they blame the defense and act like we've just been great offensively, losing in shootouts week in and out for years. News flash, the offense has been below average for the most part for years as well.

I agree on the young QB situation though. If we're deciding to move on from Carr, I'd imagine it'll be a fire sale on the few valuable offensive assets that we have. So we'd be starting from scratch and rebuilding around him. Would make more sense to build up the OL, defense, and get some young weapons before we go all in on a QB.

[NYRaider]

38 minutes ago, Geezy said:

It’s a shame  Carr couldn’t get on the same page as  the corpse of Jordy Nelson, Andre Holmes and Zay Jones 

Isn't it kind of strange how despite us changing our offensive line, skill position players, play callers, etc. we've still struggled overall and with a lot of the same things such as red zone offense year after year. But it's definitely not Carr, probably just everyone else. 

[BackinBlack]

11 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

The thing I find comical is that everyone blames the defense. Which I get, they've definitely been pretty bad for years. But they blame the defense and act like we've just been great offensively, losing in shootouts week in and out for years. News flash, the offense has been below average for the most part for years as well.

I agree on the young QB situation though. If we're deciding to move on from Carr, I'd imagine it'll be a fire sale on the few valuable offensive assets that we have. So we'd be starting from scratch and rebuilding around him. Would make more sense to build up the OL, defense, and get some young weapons before we go all in on a QB.

But outside of what the top 5-8 Qbs in the league, the elite QBs. . . consistency is very very tough to find in the league. 
Dak, Kyler, Cousins, Carr, stafford, ryan, geno, tannehill, Jimmy G, etc. . . are all very inconsistent. 

You see the good game and think wow if we could get this WR or RB, itll change who our qb is. But it doesnt, they are inconsistent because beating NFL Ds is not easy. You need to be close to perfect week in and week out. A throw a little high is an incompletion whether its DA or a Scrub. 
It is the easy way to think if we get X receiver or imrpove the oline it will help our QB. . . but the best way to help a QB is to build the D. 

You can win with those type of QBs but you need a D that gives them many chances, and can overcome some of the mistakes. 

Carr has shown he can make average WRs look like low key starters, Zay, Nelson, Seth Roberts , all got paid, Crabtree had a career year with us. WR is a luxury position. We have an absolute star in Adams, and he is crushing it for us. Carr may hold the team back in the win loss columns from game to game, but he has shown he can still get WRs the ball.