NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: The fact he didn't allow Bramdin Staley to come in and beat us with a Stick is, actually, quite impressive compared to the last guy qe hired. HS is irrelevant. You'll figure that out eventually. Nobody more than a few years removed from high school is going to care about that. He was obviously good enough in college coaching to move up to the pros, was he not? Being saddled with Herm Edwards did him no favors at ASU, but true failures at the college level don't typically fail their way into the NFL. A positional coach hired by JMD is a ringing endorsement of personal achievement and ability. So you basically have to admit: AP isn't the guy for the job or JMD is great at finding staffers and building a staff, and AP is set to be the first Patriots way assistant to find success in the NFL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 9 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Nah I've made it clear who I want as the staff. Frank Smith as the HC / Darrell Bevell as the OC Two proven commodities that have developed young QB's to become elite players in the NFL and have had success winning games. Do you think either one of them would've gotten run out of a HS program for failing to make the playoffs at a school that hadn't missed the postseason in 4 decades or is that just AP? Bevell? Lmao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) 13 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Nah I've made it clear who I want as the staff. Frank Smith as the HC / Darrell Bevell as the OC Two proven commodities that have developed young QB's to become elite players in the NFL and have had success winning games. Do you think either one of them would've gotten run out of a HS program for failing to make the playoffs at a school that hadn't missed the postseason in 4 decades or is that just AP? It's perfectly possible. HS ball is a totally different animal. Tony Sanchez was a wizard at Bishop Gorman, but he flopped at UNLV. He's now a WRs coach at perennial powerhouse New Mexico State. Why is one of the best HS football coaches of the last 20 years a WR coach at a school barely able to retain D-1 status? Edited December 21, 2023 by ronjon1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, bucksavage1 said: Bevell? Lmao Yup. Currently the Dolphins QB coach that has worked with Tua everyday as he has went from bust to one of the best QBs in the NFL. He also helped Russell Wilson go from mid round pick to Super Bowl Champion and an MVP candidate. For a young head coach I think it'd be extremely beneficial to have a seasoned coach to help him make the transition. Obviously Smith will be the play caller but for a young franchise QB I think having someone that has mentored Tua/Russ in the fold would be great. Miles better than Bo Hardigree who is a JMD understudy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 6 minutes ago, NYRaider said: A positional coach hired by JMD is a ringing endorsement of personal achievement and ability. So you basically have to admit: AP isn't the guy for the job or JMD is great at finding staffers and building a staff, and AP is set to be the first Patriots way assistant to find success in the NFL No, actually, I don't. Because you're leaving out the most likely option: Josh McDaniels was dumb enough to hire an assistant who very openly didn't buy into the Patriot Way and has gotten better results from this squad than Josh ever could. We already established Josh git irked by him throwing shade at the Patriots. AP is decidedly not a Way cultist. Josh was just that dumb. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 7 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: It's perfectly possible. HS ball is a totally different animal. Tony Sanchez was a wizard at Bishop Gorman, but he flopped at UNLV. He's now a WRs coach at perennial powerhouse New Mexico State. Why is one of the best HS football coaches of the last 20 years a WR coach at a school barely able to retain D-1 status? I would say typically guys that fail in HS and college aren't the best NFL head coaches, that's just my personal opinion. If you think 1-3 over the last month inspires confidence going forward, good for you. The only reason to keep AP is if the plan is to tank for Ewers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 1 minute ago, ronjon1990 said: has gotten better results from this squad than Josh ever could. We're 1-3 over the last month and will be huge underdogs in our next three games, when we go 1-6 to finish the season with the only win coming against Easton Stick, will you still feel the same way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 16 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Yup. Currently the Dolphins QB coach that has worked with Tua everyday as he has went from bust to one of the best QBs in the NFL. He also helped Russell Wilson go from mid round pick to Super Bowl Champion and an MVP candidate. For a young head coach I think it'd be extremely beneficial to have a seasoned coach to help him make the transition. Obviously Smith will be the play caller but for a young franchise QB I think having someone that has mentored Tua/Russ in the fold would be great. Miles better than Bo Hardigree who is a JMD understudy Bevell is one of the worst recycled OCs in the NFL that keeps getting opportunities based who he knows. Talk about underwhelming and unimaginative hires. What about his failed OC tenure with the Jaguars recently? Conveniently did not to bring that up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 hours ago, ronjon1990 said: In other words, you won't answer the question. You flipping your position on Champ's job responsibilities and impact or no? Simple question, and you brought it up. What question? Where was I asked a question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, bucksavage1 said: Bevell is one of the worst recycled OCs in the NFL that keeps getting opportunities based who he knows. Talk about underwhelming and unimaginative hires. What about his failed OC tenure with the Jaguars recently? Conveniently did not to bring that up. If Frank Smith is the head coach he will be responsible for the offense and play calling, the OC will just work with the QB and help with game planning. So he gets the blame for Urban Meyers struggles, gotcha. I'd prefer to have a guy that has shown he can help develop young QBs to aid an offensive minded coach that is currently already working with over someone like Bo Hardigree who has shown nothing in the NFL and whose two mentors are both hacks. Our defense was god awful with one of the worst LB groups in the league under AP, are we supposed to ignore that? Edited December 21, 2023 by NYRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 hours ago, ronjon1990 said: Never forget: "No. I'm one of the few people who think a coach needs at least 3 years before you can judge if he's a good coach or not. I think he's a good play caller. Rich would have fallen off last year. Fun story, you're naive if you think he had true staying power as a HC. Notice he's still coaching STs and not coaching another team. You can't win with an average QB. What's your argument?" - Big Palooka, in his infinite consistent wisdom, demanding 3 years and better than average QB play in July for Josh McDaniels before flipping in December demanding Antonio Pierce win with below average QB play right now. https://forums.footballsfuture.com/topic/48016-raiders-sign-qb-jimmy-garoppolo-3-years-675m-34m-gtd/?do=findComment&comment=5241716 Do you have a reading problem or does it not click for you? If a coach is hired to a long term contract, I support the coach getting 3 years to show he can get the players, QB, etc. he envisions. The same logic does not apply to an interim. If AP gets the full time job, I will again say the same thing. He can't win with average and gets his 3 years to improve it. Unless, like JMD he fails to identify the wrong QB and it blows up around him. Stop trying to create division where none is warranted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 This topic is a cesspool. Wake me up when someone is hired AP or otherwise. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 1 minute ago, big_palooka said: This topic is a cesspool. Wake me up when someone is hired AP or otherwise. AP truthers think he is on the level of Bellichick, Payton, and Reid. There is no changing their opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 hours ago, NYRaider said: So he can't beat good teams He hasn’t yet, we ain’t losing to bad teams like we were before he got here though. Hard to beat MVP level QBs with a rookie 4 rounder too, defense been balling though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 9 minutes ago, NYRaider said: If Frank Smith is the head coach he will be responsible for the offense and play calling, the OC will just work with the QB and help with game planning. So he gets the blame for Urban Meyers struggles, gotcha. I'd prefer to have a guy that has shown he can help develop young QBs to aid an offensive minded coach that is currently already working with over someone like Bo Hardigree who has shown nothing in the NFL and whose two mentors are both hacks. Our defense was god awful with one of the worst LB groups in the league under AP, are we supposed to ignore that? So let me get this straight... You want to hire a head coach that currently does not call plays as an OC on his current team. Then hire an experienced but failed underwhelming OC. And your plan would be to have that HC call plays and control the team. That’s a setup where many Coordinators to HCs fail at 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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