Stevein2012 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, HorizontoZenith said: How many of the trade offers we got for Randall do you think were for backup quarterbacks? They chose a backup QB over alternatives. I don't know where the disconnect is here for you. Obviously they like Kizer too. It's possible they liked him more than a 3rd round pick or whatever they could have gotten for Randall as far as a straight up pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, cannondale said: Kizer was the best garbage that we could get for our garbage. So you're of the opinion that the Browns considered their 2nd round pick from last year's draft to have negative or net zero trade value? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, Stevein2012 said: Obviously they like Kizer too. It's possible they liked him more than a 3rd round pick or whatever they could have gotten for Randall as far as a straight up pick. What are you not getting here? I get that they liked Kizer. What are you not getting about why that is EXACTLY why people are upset? I just literally told you a story to explain it to you. A THIRD ROUND PICK helps us more than A KIZER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinaski_86 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 10 hours ago, DavidatMIZZOU said: Nobody is pretending that Randall is elite, or anywhere near that level. I thought he was an ascending player. Randall has shown good and bad play, I would argue that he had 1.5 good years and 1.5 bad years. That seems like a serviceable player. He would be a definite contributor on this team, this season. With Kizer, we are hoping that he develops, but never plays. With the current depth chart, we have Lenzy Pipkins as one of our starting CBs. We have now forced our own hand in this draft. We NEED to take at least one CB, and we maybe, hopefully got better at a position everyone hopes never sees the field. I don't like it. I am not going to lose sleep over it. I am not going to make a really hilarious website about it (www.firegute.com). But I will discuss it on a message board. Gute has not earned the benefit of the doubt yet. This is his first move as GM. To like this move, you have to be one heck of a Deshone Kizer fan, absolutely hate Damarious Randall, or are blindly optimistic about everything Green Bay Packers. You forgot to mention one group: you have to absolutely hate Hundley. Fans would rather have a new shiny toy over Hundley. However, we're still screwed should Rodgers get hurt this year. Kizer isn't going to change that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, AlexGreen#20 said: So you're of the opinion that the Browns considered their 2nd round pick from last year's draft to have negative or net zero trade value? I believe the new regime thought so - absolutely - as many new regimes do. You know how that works Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Stevein2012 said: Obviously they like Kizer too. It's possible they liked him more than a 3rd round pick or whatever they could have gotten for Randall as far as a straight up pick. And that's fine, but you certainly have to understand why people disagree with that decision when Kizer looked like complete garbage for his rookie year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, cannondale said: I believe the new regime thought so - absolutely - as many new regimes do. You know how that works I'm just highly skeptical that they thought he was worth absolutely nothing. That the thought process was, "you can have Kizer or not, what's coming back to you as far as other compensation will be the same." And if that's the case, make the trade and take the extra cap space. This is all assuming that Damarious Randall has evolved into Percy Harvin at Florida. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenrik Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 58 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said: I don't get why people keep saying this. Literally any move we make this offseason will not be something we couldn't have done had we kept Randall. If we re-sign House and sign Sherman, we are still a better defense with Randall than we are without him. If we sign Sherman and draft a cornerback in the first three rounds, we are still a better defense with Randall. Any way you look at it, our defense got worse because of this trade. Literally. Literally any way you look at it. You can never have too many cornerbacks or defensive backs, especially versatile ones like Randall. Especially when all the corners currently on your roster have major injury concerns. Especially when you spent the last two years down to nothing at that position. Again you keep refering to our horrid secondary which has included Randall. You can have too many conerbacks. What you cant have too many of is good conerbacks. Im excited Gutz is working with Pettine to get players he wants and like Macarthy said getting players with some attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, AlexGreen#20 said: I'm just highly skeptical that they thought he was worth absolutely nothing. That the thought process was, "you can have Kizer or not, what's coming back to you as far as other compensation will be the same." And if that's the case, make the trade and take the extra cap space. This is all assuming that Damarious Randall has evolved into Percy Harvin at Florida. They thought he was worth less than a one year rental CB that's a head case because they swapped picks as well. And no QB controversy when they bring in their guy. And GB gets a lottery scratch off in Kizer I think Randall was even a bigger problem than we know or we would have just rode this thing out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinaski_86 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 8 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said: What are you not getting here? I get that they liked Kizer. What are you not getting about why that is EXACTLY why people are upset? I just literally told you a story to explain it to you. A THIRD ROUND PICK helps us more than A KIZER. Because fans like to daydream when it comes to young QBs. They're like new shiny toys. They like to daydream about all the draft picks they might get in return in the future once MM turns him into an All-Pro....Of course if he busts it's MM's fault for not being able to develop him. It's not because Kizer is a bad QB. Not an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 4 minutes ago, Kenrik said: Again you keep refering to our horrid secondary which has included Randall. You can have too many conerbacks. What you cant have too many of is good conerbacks. Im excited Gutz is working with Pettine to get players he wants and like Macarthy said getting players with some attitude. He's talking about the injury problems that have devestated our CB unit, often times Randall being out or gimpy. I just can't imagine a situation where I'd rather have Josh Hawkins as my CB 3/4 than Randall. Again, if Randall is spending his time in the locker room preaching about the church of scientology, that's one thing, but if this is about McCarthy being a curmudgeon and flexing his newfound power, that's where we have issues. Still does not change my opinion on the return value of this trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevein2012 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: And that's fine, but you certainly have to understand why people disagree with that decision when Kizer looked like complete garbage for his rookie year. I do understand and I don't have any problem with people not liking the trade but Gute obviously had a high grade and Kizer that he still trusts and just picked him up along with some draft spots for a player he was trying to get rid of. I get why they made the trade and I guess it just doesn't bother me that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenrik Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Sherman said Packers gave him a call and are interested. Derwin said packers talked to him about playing slot. House, Randall, King? Or Sherman, King, Derwin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollino14 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 They’re getting a FA CB or two. House probably and someone else. Randall has showen flashes and is better than what we have CURRENTLY on the roster, but I guarantee we will pick up someone better than Demarius Randall. Plus, I had to have one ND player on the team! When was the last one!? Ryan Grant?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 13 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said: How many times we gotta disprove the same talking points? It's not about Randall. Except that it is. It's mostly about Randall, but it's about Kizer as well. The benching (of Randall) and subsequent comments by MM were and indicator. It looks to me like they were not going to take Randall's 5th year option, so they got the best they could for him now, getting a guy (Kizer) that they liked in the last draft, rather than let him walk at the end of 2018. The higher picks the Packers get in this draft are just sweeteners to balance the deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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