Training Camp 2018 discussion

[DreamKid]

Beatdown's Notes: https://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2018/7/26/17617182/ravens-training-camp-highlights-lowlights-7-26-18-marlon-humphrey-john-brown-jordan-lasley

 

Player of the day: John Brown

-You can always feel the tension of a big play in progress. The quarterback going through his progressions, until finding the big route down the sideline and launching the football into the sky. Fans begin oohing as they see the battle between cornerback and receiver, hoping the catch is made. Today, John Brown caught that football, 50-yards deep and into the endzone for the touchdown. Joe Flacco’s deep ball is ready for action, even against sophomore cornerback Marlon Humphrey.-

Defense

-Speaking of Marlon, unfortunately, today he had a rough practice. Tim White, John Brown and Jordan Lasley all managed to beat him for touchdowns.

Patrick Onwuasor intercepted a ball against the starters and had a lane to the endzone with maybe two men left to beat. While defensive coordinator Don Martindale mentioned Kenny Young jockeying for the starting role, I believe Patrick’s consistently ahead of the linebackers trying to steal the position beside C.J. Mosley.

Tavon Young produced another strong practice, this time bullying Jaelon Acklin on a short throw in one-on-one drills. Fans were calling for a flag, but there certainly was not enough contact to draw one. Young is going to produce strong results in the slot this season.-

Offense

-The offense produced multiple big plays, including Hayden Hurst hauling in an 18-yard catch, one which we’ve all seen many times in the form of Dennis Pitta. It’s good seeing the first-round pick back on the field after missing a couple practices.

Breshad Perriman continues to deliver. He produced a 15-yard catch against the starting defense, then hauled in another later on. I’m excited to see him play next week.

It wasn’t all pretty by the receivers today though, as Jaleel Scott dropped two passes during drills without coverage. He later couldn’t complete a catch which was behind him. He managed to get one hand on the ball, but couldn’t rope it in. I have not seen anything of note after his redzone touchdown earlier last week. He may be fighting for a roster spot more than some believe.-

 

[Edgar]

Who do you guys see as the starting Offensive line this year?   

 

[DreamKid]

Wink, Rosburg, and MM were the pressers today.

- The only real takeaway from Jerry's was regarding Albert McClellan. It isn't going to be easy to cut him from this team, and him sticking to the roster will 100% mean an uncomfortable cut of another player is on the horizon. 

- MM is really like a forced character on a mid level sitcom, the goofy uncle of the 3rd main or something. He really had nothing to say. Everyone's doing good yada yada yada.

- Wink's was the best. He talked about Marlon and how he'd have to watch the tape but said they specifically tell the guys to not challenge balls downfield to avoid injuries. He actually took the opportunity to talk about how Marlon is going to be a dominant corner in the league. Sticking with corners, he said Tavon is like a pitbull but also a true Raven. So interesting animal concept there. 

He complimented Willie Henry who is bigger, stronger, faster this year and also said that Wormley has started to perform up to the level he expects out of him. Brent Urban is a valuable true knock back DL, and is starting to carry a powerful confidence. A question was asked about Mosley's quite demeanor and how he manages to be a leader as a result. Wink cited an example of a time when Mosley got real loud to get a point across to Tyus Bowser about something. 

The biggest takeaway was Wink stating unequivocally that the Will linebacker starter position is completely up for grabs and a true competition is going on between Kenny Young and Onwuasor. You can tell from his language he isn't high on Peanut. The job will be won in the preseason games according to Wink, so that will be big to watch going forward.

A final note on the Wink presser was that they are working on DeShon Elliot's entries to attack ball carriers and running lanes, from the FS position.

[Edgar]

4 minutes ago, DreamKid said:

Wink, Rosburg, and MM were the pressers today.

- The only real takeaway from Jerry's was regarding Albert McClellan. It isn't going to be easy to cut him from this team, and him sticking to the roster will 100% mean an uncomfortable cut of another player is on the horizon. 

- MM is really like a forced character on a mid level sitcom, the goofy uncle of the 3rd main or something. He really had nothing to say. Everyone's doing good yada yada yada.

- Wink's was the best. He talked about Marlon and how he'd have to watch the tape but said they specifically tell the guys to not challenge balls downfield to avoid injuries. He actually took the opportunity to talk about how Marlon is going to be a dominant corner in the league. Sticking with corners, he said Tavon is like a pitbull but also a true Raven. So interesting animal concept there. 

He complimented Willie Henry who is bigger, stronger, faster this year and also said that Wormley has started to perform up to the level he expects out of him. Brent Urban is a valuable true knock back DL, and is starting to carry a powerful confidence. A question was asked about Mosley's quite demeanor and how he manages to be a leader as a result. Wink cited an example of a time when Mosley got real loud to get a point across to Tyus Bowser about something. 

The biggest takeaway was Wink stating unequivocally that the Will linebacker starter position is completely up for grabs and a true competition is going on between Kenny Young and Onwuasor. You can tell from his language he isn't high on Peanut. The job will be won in the preseason games according to Wink, so that will be big to watch going forward.

A final note on the Wink presser was that they are working on DeShon Elliot's entries to attack ball carriers and running lanes, from the FS position.

No way should McClellan make this team. There simply isn't room and it would be a shame if a player with some upside has to go.

[DreamKid]

12 minutes ago, Edgar said:

Who do you guys see as the starting Offensive line this year?   

 

Safe money is on-

Stanley-Lewis-Skura-Yanda-Brown Jr.

I have big concerns about Matt Skura and his anchor, but the FO might just view it as the simplest answer to the line.

If Lewis starts at Center, then we have to carry Skura. Then Skura isn't going to be better at guard than Nico, Hurst, or JE. So when an injury occurs to a guard in that scenario, one of those 3 will sub in not Skura. All meaning we'd have to carry an extra lineman and accept less versatile depth. 

3 minutes ago, Edgar said:

No way should McClellan make this team. There simply isn't room and it would be a shame if a player with some upside has to go.

Completely agree.

[wackywabbit]

John Brown is the only offensive skill position player addition player that I was/am excited about. Heck, even including returning ones, he's really the only one I'm particularly hopeful about. Collins is fun to watch, but I expect a regression and I'm still optimistic about Kenneth Dixon but it's lukewarm, and IDK how high the upside is. Hurst should be.... fine. Crabtree and Snead aren't dynamic. Brown was the move with largest potential in 2018. Really hope he stays healthy.

[DreamKid]

7 minutes ago, wackywabbit said:

John Brown is the only offensive skill position player addition player that I was/am excited about.

Really? I think he'll be a more effective deep threat than Wallace, but with his history of injures I'm the least optimistic with him. 

Healthy, John Brown will replicate and hopefully surpass an element Wallace brought to our offense. Snead and Crabtree though, bring elements to our offense that have been absent for far too long.

Crabtree is a stronger possession option, and well rounded enough to draw the attention of some team's top corners. He'll drop some balls, and he isn't a big play threat. In the redzone though, he operates at an above average level. 

Willie Snead is a young player that will be a great conversion ace out of the slot, with a little extra YAC behind that. We need players that can help us string drives together and he's key in that regard.

Hayden Hurst is a great downfield weapon and he doesn't drop anything. Adding elite hands to an offense that was near league tops in drops should be beyond appealing.

Mark Andrews is a zone killer and coverage buster, with good hands and underrated YAC. He's also a good redzone weapon.

Why would Collins regress? He's only 23 and if anything should've taken some big leaps physically/athletically in the offseason, as many have reported he has. Ricard will be back, another ascending player who now has actual experience at fullback. Yanda is back, Stanley should be better, stronger, and craftier. Collins has actually taken a big leap with his hands too, so he should be a factor in the passing game as well.

Chris Moore made strides last year and by all accounts carried and furthered that progression into camp this year. Tim White isn't disappointing now back and healthy.

As for the rookies, Jordan Lasley was the most consistent dynamic receiver in College Football last year. He finished 9th in the top 10 statistically for receivers, despite having played 2 less games than (#3)Anthony Miller, 3 less games than (#6)Anthony Johnson & (#8)Steve Ishmael, and 4 less than all the rest above him in the top 10. He was a force. Now what are the reports from Camp? That he's a dynamic player.

Jaleel Scott has great college tape and maybe fully transitioning his game from a small school will take a while, but he's an immediate redzone and 50/50 weapon.

 

I don't share your pessimism. What we added as a group of pass catchers should be greater than the sum of it's parts, but I think we will also see some individual players exceed expectations and stand out.

Schematically I think we figured out what worked last year, near the end of the season, both in the run and pass game. Conservatively hoping, I think Joe Flacco can return to 75% of what he was when at his best. I still have legitimate questions regarding the prospects of him being a 'Broken Quarterback'. His accuracy issues lasted all the way through the season, even when his production and the offense picked up. Now he's not all the way broken like a Hackenberg, but clearly something has been absent with him as the injuries have stacked. A regression has 100% occurred. How much he can reverse of that regression we'll see. Aggressively hoping, I would love it if we saw the complete return of "The Mad Italian Bomber". With downfield blazers, pinpoint back shoulders, special chemistry link ups, audibles at the line, extended plays, league nightmare level clutch play. After last season though, and the previous ones, I can't ever let myself picture that happening again. I'll have to see it on the field to believe it. Making my middle ground and current prediction for Flacco, one of a good not great reform. I think the accuracy issues will remain but too a much less severe degree. I think he'll become way more efficient with his passing, but not scared with it like he was last year. Joe still has a cannon, so I think the deep ball will return and we'll see some  special throws. Also with his mobility back, I think we'll see drives extended every now and then on 10 yard scampers. He will be a good QB next year, probably not the great one from our championship run, but good enough to get another championship with a now elite defense. Whereas last time those aspects were reversed. 

Add in a little Lamar Jackson trickery every now and then, and I think we'll be just fine.

[Danand]

3 hours ago, Edgar said:

Who do you guys see as the starting Offensive line this year?   

 

I believe it is still too early to get a good gauge on who it will be. It seems Stanley will be LT, Yanda, RG and Brown RT, and then Lewis is the favorite for the LG spot, while the OC is up for grabs. If Skura, Siragusa, Shakir fails there, Lewis might be inserted as OC and Hurst goes from allround backup to starter again at LG.

I asked Jeff Zbrich on twitter yesterday where Bozeman was in the equation, as I hadn't seem him mentioned. Apparently they try him out as guard so far.

[Danand]

McClellan might make the roster above players like Correa, as he is a better special teamer, leader and allround backup. If McClellan beats out Correa, I don't think it is a bad move for a 2 year stretch.

[DreamKid]

Sun's notes- http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bs-sp-ravens-rail-training-camp-20180726-story.html

Going deep

-Getting Wednesday off appeared to have benefited the offense, which flew out of the gate early. Quarterback Joe Flacco connected with wide receiver John Brown on a 50-yard touchdown pass down the right sideline during a 7-on-7 drill. Flacco also found Brown on a back-shoulder pass along the right sideline during a full-team exercise, and connected with rookie wide receiver Jordan Lasley for a score in the back right corner of the end zone during a 4-on-3 drill. Lasley celebrated his touchdown by spinning the ball.-

Some context on Humphrey's allowed receptions, for those interested.

Rough outing

-All three of the aforementioned plays occurred at the expense of cornerback Marlon Humphrey, who also surrendered a back-shoulder pass to Brown for a long gain during a full exercise. Humphrey did slap away a pass from Flacco to Brown on an out route, but it was otherwise a day for the second-year pro to quickly forget.-

Not all bad for Marlon today.

Unexpected ending

-During a full-team drill with an emphasis on the no-huddle, Flacco and the offense drove the length of the field to get inside the defense’s 20-yard line. (One of the best plays was a wheel route in which running back Buck Allen leaped over middle linebacker C.J. Mosley to catch a jump ball from Flacco.) But the series ended without a touchdown because inside linebacker Patrick Onwuasor intercepted Flacco’s pass.-

That interception was described as the result of a miscue on behalf of whomever Flacco intended the throw for. Apparently it was a new play that had just been installed. 

Potential sacks

-Although the offense enjoyed a strong showing, the defense would’ve come away with sacks if tackling the quarterback was permitted. Defensive tackles Carl Davis, Michael Pierce and Willie Henry, and outside linebackers Za’Darius Smith and Tim Williams each would’ve had sacks. Pierce would’ve had two against Flacco and Robert Griffin.-

This cuts both ways. It's great that our front is getting sacks from the interior, but I don't like the unsettled inside of our line giving up those pressures and sacks.

 

 

[DreamKid]

5 minutes ago, Danand said:

McClellan might make the roster above players like Correa, as he is a better special teamer, leader and allround backup. If McClellan beats out Correa, I don't think it is a bad move for a 2 year stretch.

That's a scenario I'm okay with. Obviously Correa has more upside as an OLB, but he's trash inside and ultimately I hated his tape coming out of college. Still, cutting a young 2nd round pick who never got an extended shot at his actual position is rough. Let's hope preseason play sorts it all out, and whoever we keep doesn't tear an ACL right after .

[Danand]

1 hour ago, DreamKid said:

That's a scenario I'm okay with. Obviously Correa has more upside as an OLB, but he's trash inside and ultimately I hated his tape coming out of college. Still, cutting a young 2nd round pick who never got an extended shot at his actual position is rough. Let's hope preseason play sorts it all out, and whoever we keep doesn't tear an ACL right after .

I also hate giving up on early round picks after a few years, but both Perriman and Correa haven't done enough to warrant a roster spot above players who have showed significant contribution despite being older/slower/less athletic. At some point football IQ and fundamentals beats out upside which might never emerge - just like we saw it with Arthur Brown.

Its the other way around with Perriman though. Here we have an almost veteran at the receiver position who only has his upside going for him. Do we want to bank on that upside and not acknowledge the upside from other young receivers like Tim White or Janarion Grant or whoever emerges. For me, I like Tim White a lot from what he showed last year and I see him as quite versatile. The idea of having a Janarion Grant type of player on the roster also intrigues me, especially as we have struggled a lot to get something done after the catch.

[DreamKid]

 

[DreamKid]

 

[Danand]

How much will Chris Moore have to do to jump Willie Snead on the wide receiver depth chart?

Not that it matters as  Brown, Moore, Snead, White can play both inside and outside