Jump to content
coordinator0

Running Back. Are We Good?

Recommended Posts

51 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said:

I would never want to move on from Gus. Gus has been fantastic. BUT, let's not pretend he is a complete back. He runs in a style that is very effective with the read option. 

Going forward, I think the Ravens can pencil in 15 carries a game for Gus. But we may plan on running the ball 50 times a game. It might be a mistake to put Gus in positions where he has to catch the ball, pass-protect, run out of different formations, etc. This is not a scouting take, just a feel that Gus is in the perfect role now, and expanding his responsibilities might be a mistake.  

I never stated that we SHOULD expand Gus Edwards role. But why would we need to? He’s proven to be our Thunder back that falls forward for yards. He has a good temperament that is TEAM focused and he plays his heart out.

If you look through this and other threads I’m sure you will find that I’m a proponent of finding additional RB talent. But that RB talent is one where we can utilize them as our lightning threat. A guy who has excellent hands, runs nice routes, has shiftiness to make guys miss. Extra points would go to the front office if they could find such a guy who could also take on the bulk load of our RB role for when Dixon and Gus contracts expire next season. But FTMP these are running backs that we could acquire in the draft on the third day with great scouting.

You're confusing my finding LF to be overrated as an overall threat (because he’s not the receiving back that Barkley or Zeke are), with me failing to acknowledge another back could be worth their salt.

FWIW I’ve already stated that I’m interested in seeing that Temple RB perform in the senior bowl. Also that third Alabama back looks very impressive.

42 minutes ago, sp6488 said:

As AF mentioned, I’m not sure any of this talk means we’re moving on from Gus. Just using Fournette as an example, he has two years remaining on his rookie deal   (Assuming acquired by trade). Ignoring the 5th year option, Gus would be here for an additional year. 

It’s true that both Gus Edwards and Kenneth Dixon have contracts that expire, but what does that have to do with trading for Leonard Fournette. If Gus Edwards has never emerged, would I have been all in for giving up a third round pick for LF’s skillset, absolutely. He’s much too injury prone though for me to have gone beyond that with a 2nd round offer. That said, my point stands, he’s absolutely too similar a runner to what we’ve already got in Gus Edwards.

If we’re going to use draft resources to obtain a potential character malcontent, I’d much rather simply go to the draft for that back. Like I said earlier in the draft, I’m all in for a day 3 back. I’d much rather spend our 3rd round pick on a David Montgomery if he falls than to trade for LF. Your point is that Gus and Dixon leave after one more year, while LF has two more years on his deal. Well guess what, a rookie RB that we draft has four years left on his deal. Making it an infinitely better deal. And this is coming from a front office that scouted and found an UDFA in Alex Collins and Gus Edwards in back to back years. A group that almost recruited Phillip Lindsay to come here. Imagine what they could do if they were actually willing to spend draft resources on the position.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just think people may be undervaluing Fournette. As a comp, look at Gurley. He was awful in year two, he had 3.2 yards per carry and was injured. But now he is a dominant force in the right scheme.

Now, I wouldn't part with much for Fournette, maybe a 5th rd pick (possibly 4th rd). But he has elite potential that I believe Jacksonville failed to unlock.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said:

I just think people may be undervaluing Fournette. As a comp, look at Gurley. He was awful in year two, he had 3.2 yards per carry and was injured. But now he is a dominant force in the right scheme.

Now, I wouldn't part with much for Fournette, maybe a 5th rd pick (possibly 4th rd). But he has elite potential that I believe Jacksonville failed to unlock.   

So is Gus Edwards chopped liver simply because he wasn’t drafted with a top 10 pick then?

I would argue that you are equally undervaluing him. Back when we had the 31st ranked rushing attack with Flacco as the starter, Gus Edwards was our only RB all year that looked worth a snot running behind that unit. Granted it was only for about a game before Lamar stepped in and they both lit the NFL world on fire, but that cannot be discounted.

So if LF can stil develop than so can Gus. It’s not like their athletic profile is all that dissimilar.

Leonard Fournette, LSU

6’1” 240 lbs, 4.51s, 28.5” VL

Gus Edwards, Rutgers

6’1” 235 lbs, 4.52s, 34.5” VL, 4.24s SS, 7.22s cone drill

We haven’t seen enough of Gus Edwards as someone that we target in the passing game to know what he has to offer there, but he’s caught 100% of his targets to this point. And showed to be a solid receiver at Rutgers.There is nothing I’ve seen from Leonard Fournette to convince me that he has superior feet or vision to Gus Edwards either.

Fournette is a talented runner, that much hasn’t been questioned, but so is Gus Edwards. After we missed out on Chubb, I thought all Hope was lost on getting the kind of back that we need, but then along came Gus. With handoff work in the offseason with Lamar and a better center that should kill some of our fumble issues as well.

Now because you compared Fournette to Gurley, one guy is a player whose worst season saw him finish with 1212 YFS and 6 scores while playing in 16 games (he struggled but was able to see the field at least). While the other guy missed half his games (like in college) and had 624 YFS. Now you might say the production efficiency is similar and you’d be right. But what difference does it make if Fournette can bounce back to Gurley levels of efficiency if he’s got a 50/50 shot at being out half the season in the process?

Lastly, just think Alex Collins started 12 games last season as a second year NFL player and had 1160 YFS and many fans thought we had our future at RB found (I didn’t FWIW). Gus Edwards started 6 games this season as a rookie and had 718 YFS. Sign me up for a whole season of seeing what Edwards can do to improve on his rookie season.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know things have soured for Fournette in Jacksonville but I'm not sure how much of it is his fault vs. that organization just being a mess from a leadership perspective- it's a joke to me that after the season they've had, they're just going to throw lower level assistant coaches under the bus and pull tough guy stunts like randomly calling out Fournette/Yeldon while everyone at the top in a position of power keeps their job/faces zero accountability. We have a strong locker room and the sort of culture that would make it a worthy gamble to try to buy low on a potentially elite talent like Fournette. I like what I've seen from Gus but I can't help but feel he's always just sort of going to be... fine. An elite running back takes this offense to the next level, and there aren't many other ways we can manufacture an opportunity to get one beyond leveraging potential opportunities like this one if the Jags do shop Fournette. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

So is Gus Edwards chopped liver simply because he wasn’t drafted with a top 10 pick then?

I would argue that you are equally undervaluing him. Back when we had the 31st ranked rushing attack with Flacco as the starter, Gus Edwards was our only RB all year that looked worth a snot running behind that unit. Granted it was only for about a game before Lamar stepped in and they both lit the NFL world on fire, but that cannot be discounted.

So if LF can stil develop than so can Gus. It’s not like their athletic profile is all that dissimilar.

Leonard Fournette, LSU

6’1” 240 lbs, 4.51s, 28.5” VL

Gus Edwards, Rutgers

6’1” 235 lbs, 4.52s, 34.5” VL, 4.24s SS, 7.22s cone drill

We haven’t seen enough of Gus Edwards as someone that we target in the passing game to know what he has to offer there, but he’s caught 100% of his targets to this point. And showed to be a solid receiver at Rutgers.There is nothing I’ve seen from Leonard Fournette to convince me that he has superior feet or vision to Gus Edwards either.

Fournette is a talented runner, that much hasn’t been questioned, but so is Gus Edwards. After we missed out on Chubb, I thought all Hope was lost on getting the kind of back that we need, but then along came Gus. With handoff work in the offseason with Lamar and a better center that should kill some of our fumble issues as well.

Now because you compared Fournette to Gurley, one guy is a player whose worst season saw him finish with 1212 YFS and 6 scores while playing in 16 games (he struggled but was able to see the field at least). While the other guy missed half his games (like in college) and had 624 YFS. Now you might say the production efficiency is similar and you’d be right. But what difference does it make if Fournette can bounce back to Gurley levels of efficiency if he’s got a 50/50 shot at being out half the season in the process?

Lastly, just think Alex Collins started 12 games last season as a second year NFL player and had 1160 YFS and many fans thought we had our future at RB found (I didn’t FWIW). Gus Edwards started 6 games this season as a rookie and had 718 YFS. Sign me up for a whole season of seeing what Edwards can do to improve on his rookie season.

Very good analysis, thanks. 

Watching some of Fournette's 2017 highlights, the one difference between them is Fournette can break tackles. He is a much more dangerous runner than Edwards in the open field. Edwards can churn out yards on every carry, but on a well-blocked play where Edwards gets 15, Fournette could get 40+.  

Why can't we have both? IMO, the Ravens should probably carry 4-5 RBs, we don't need as many WRs any more. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe we need complimentary pieces in the running back group. Putting Fournette and Gus on the same team would most likely mean one of them would be inactive on gameday. So far Gus hasn’t shown any reason to believe he can’t develop into a more complete back or be utilized in more ways. Gus, Dixon, Collins and a 3rd down back who can be used as a pass outlet and with some speed would be a group with complimentary abilities. I still believe we have something in Collins, but it all depends on his fumbling issues.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

@AngusMcFife and @BaltimoreTerp

You guys have moved my position some. In the end it’ll depend on what Fournette is traded for. If it’s a good deal, I’m down. He’s definitely more explosive than Gus Edwards. But I’m only down for Fournette if he’s going for a third round pick or less.

Edited by diamondbull424

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After seeing the offense today, I am more inclined to make an investment at RB. 

If you take away the gaping holes produced by scheme, Edwards and Dixon are nothing special. Edwards has a role in the offense going forward, but he is not a dynamic player. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



×