Kristaps Porzingis Traded to Dallas

[Tyronnosaurus]

What type of big is a good fit next to KP? Should he be a 4 or a 5?

[seminoles1]

6 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

That's not a bad shout actually, but Kyrie's numbers will be superior if he keeps this play up for five seasons. Some of it wasn't Parker's fault due to the Spurs style of play for a while and the way they played, but Kyrie will have the edge there. And if Kyrie gets three rings? I would think we would be seen as the better player. Do you disagree? 

Well Parker would have 4 rings and has a sizeable lead in All-NBA teams right now. If Irving stays healthy then he'll probably make it this season though.

[J-ALL-DAY]

Just now, jrry32 said:

No, he won't be. He still wouldn't sniff the top 5. Off the top of my head, you have Magic Johnson, Stephen Curry, Chris Paul, Jerry West, Oscar Robertson, Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, and John Stockton. I doubt that's close to everyone. Who does he top on that list? He's arguably not even in the class of a single guy on that list.

Different type of players, but if he does what I said he will, then he can surpass Nash. Magic/Steph/Oscar are off limits, then you can put CP3/Stockton likely there as well. Though CP3 will be an interesting experiment when it is all said and done. Rightfully or not, he doesn't have the best playoff reputation and has some suspect moments. Kyrie is pretty much the opposite. Now, to me CP3 has been fine in the playoffs minus a few series he would want back. 

You are severely underestimating the type of reputation Kyrie will have if he is a 3X NBA champion with a bunch of clutch moments. 

[jrry32]

6 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

That's not a bad shout actually, but Kyrie's numbers will be superior if he keeps this play up for five seasons. Some of it wasn't Parker's fault due to the Spurs style of play for a while and the way they played, but Kyrie will have the edge there. And if Kyrie gets three rings? I would think we would be seen as the better player. Do you disagree? 

Honestly man, do you really think Kyrie Irving would deserve mention alongside Magic, Big O, Curry, Nash, etc. because he won a couple rings as a #2 or #3?

[J-ALL-DAY]

1 minute ago, seminoles1 said:

Well Parker would have 4 rings and has a sizeable lead in All-NBA teams right now. If Irving stays healthy then he'll probably make it this season though.

Kyrie's injury hurt him badly last year. Was looking at an ALL NBA birth last year, likely 2nd team. This year he should definitely make it. Westbrook will have a lot more accolades but will he be seen as the better player? Questionable. 

[jrry32]

3 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Different type of players, but if he does what I said he will, then he can surpass Nash. Magic/Steph/Oscar are off limits, then you can put CP3/Stockton likely there as well. Though CP3 will be an interesting experiment when it is all said and done. Rightfully or not, he doesn't have the best playoff reputation and has some suspect moments. Kyrie is pretty much the opposite. Now, to me CP3 has been fine in the playoffs minus a few series he would want back. 

You are severely underestimating the type of reputation Kyrie will have if he is a 3X NBA champion with a bunch of clutch moments. 

I don't care about reputation. I'm not going to speculate over that. You're honestly telling me that you'd rather have Kyrie than prime Steve Nash? Seriously? Nash was a better shooter and distributor. It's not even a contest for me. Nash was 7x All NBA Team and a 2x MVP.

[J-ALL-DAY]

2 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

Honestly man, do you really think Kyrie Irving would deserve mention alongside Magic, Big O, Curry, Nash, etc. because he won a couple rings as a #2 or #3?

Nash? Yes. Already told you the off limit list. Nash was an unbelievable player, but name me all the pass first PGs that won a ring as the best or second best player on the team? Eventually people will realize what type of impact an elite scoring PG has. And the type of impact pure bucket getters have in close series. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

2 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

I don't care about reputation. I'm not going to speculate over that. You're honestly telling me that you'd rather have Kyrie than prime Steve Nash? Seriously? Nash was a better shooter and distributor. It's not even a contest for me. Nash was 7x All NBA Team and a 2x MVP.

Nash definitely the edge in the regular season. But if he was more aggressive looking for his shot in the playoffs, I think the Suns have more success. I'm not going to argue this point anymore. I do it pretty much every year as we see the same thing over and over in the playoffs. We can revisit this again after the playoffs and see just how Kyrie performs. 

[jrry32]

1 minute ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Nash? Yes. Already told you the off limit list. Nash was an unbelievable player, but name me all the pass first PGs that won a ring as the best or second best player on the team? Eventually people will realize what type of impact an elite scoring PG has. And the type of impact pure bucket getters have in close series. 

Off the top of my head, Magic and Jason Kidd. But let's not imply that Kyrie will have ever been the #1 on a championship team in your scenario. He would be the #2 or #3. Steve Nash could have easily won a ring if you gave him Anthony Davis and Kevin Durant in his prime.

[J-ALL-DAY]

Just now, jrry32 said:

Off the top of my head, Magic and Jason Kidd. But let's not imply that Kyrie will have ever been the #1 on a championship team in your scenario. He would be the #2 or #3. Steve Nash could have easily won a ring if you gave him Anthony Davis and Kevin Durant in his prime.

I said best or second best. Could Nash have won in that role? Possibly, but he sure had some damn good teams. 

Kidd? I mean are you considering him the 2nd best player on that Mavs team? I mean....I guess? But meh. 

Again, no need to argue any further. We could revisit this after the playoffs as we get to see Kyrie as THE guy on his team. 

[jrry32]

2 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Nash definitely the edge in the regular season. But if he was more aggressive looking for his shot in the playoffs, I think the Suns have more success. I'm not going to argue this point anymore. I do it pretty much every year as we see the same thing over and over in the playoffs. We can revisit this again after the playoffs and see just how Kyrie performs. 

Bro, c'mon. Just try and tell me that the Suns lost these series because Nash didn't do enough:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2007-nba-western-conference-semifinals-spurs-vs-suns.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2006-nba-western-conference-finals-suns-vs-mavericks.html

J, you're better than this, bro. Nash nearly dragged Shawn Marion, Leandro Barbosa, Tim Thomas, Raja Bell, and Boris Diaw to the NBA Finals. Kyrie couldn't do anything before LeBron.

[jrry32]

5 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

I said best or second best. Could Nash have won in that role? Possibly, but he sure had some damn good teams. 

Kidd? I mean are you considering him the 2nd best player on that Mavs team? I mean....I guess? But meh. 

Again, no need to argue any further. We could revisit this after the playoffs as we get to see Kyrie as THE guy on his team. 

Kyrie isn't the guy on his team. It's like arguing that Stephen Curry is THE guy on the Warriors. Kyrie is on a stacked team. If they don't make the Finals, that's an indictment on him.

Compare the two of them as players and honestly tell me that Kyrie is better at basketball. You seem to be falling for the RINGZZZZZZ madness right now.

EDIT: And I'll say it. If these Celtics had prime Steve Nash instead of Kyrie, they'd be better a team.

[J-ALL-DAY]

1 minute ago, jrry32 said:

Bro, c'mon. Just try and tell me that the Suns lost these series because Nash didn't do enough:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2007-nba-western-conference-semifinals-spurs-vs-suns.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2006-nba-western-conference-finals-suns-vs-mavericks.html

J, you're better than this, bro. Nash nearly dragged Shawn Marion, Leandro Barbosa, Tim Thomas, Raja Bell, and Boris Diaw to the NBA Finals. Kyrie couldn't do anything before LeBron.

Kyrie couldn't do anything before LeBron? Come on, you're better than this bro....Dude was 21 years old lol. And the Cavs were improving every year.

Trust me, you don't have to sell me on Nash or some of those Suns squads, especially the 05 squad. I didn't say he was the reason they lost. Just that the team may have had more success if he was more aggressive looking for his shot. 

When the teams are even, damn near every playoff series ends up coming down to the same thing. Kyrie is a flat out killer down the stretch and he ends up swaying tight series his way. If he fails this year down the stretch and isn't able to come through in 50/50 series? That would make me rate him a bit differently. But......

[J-ALL-DAY]

5 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

Kyrie isn't the guy on his team. It's like arguing that Stephen Curry is THE guy on the Warriors. Kyrie is on a stacked team. If they don't make the Finals, that's an indictment on him.

Compare the two of them as players and honestly tell me that Kyrie is better at basketball. You seem to be falling for the RINGZZZZZZ madness right now.

EDIT: And I'll say it. If these Celtics had prime Steve Nash instead of Kyrie, they'd be better a team.

I could buy that, especially with the type of players the Celtics have. But if you want to play that game, then Cavs don't win a cship in 2016, especially with LeBron's style of play and the way he makes it an isolation game. 

But I'm going to leave it here. Said what I need to say....Which seems like I say it every single year lollll @champ11

[jrry32]

2 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Kyrie couldn't do anything before LeBron? Come on, you're better than this bro....Dude was 21 years old lol. And the Cavs were improving every year.

Trust me, you don't have to sell me on Nash or some of those Suns squads, especially the 05 squad. I didn't say he was the reason they lost. Just that the team may have had more success if he was more aggressive looking for his shot. 

When the teams are even, damn near every playoff series ends up coming down to the same thing. Kyrie is a flat out killer down the stretch and he ends up swaying tight series his way. If he fails this year down the stretch and isn't able to come through in 50/50 series? That would make me rate him a bit differently. But......

It's not that hard to be a "killer" when you have LeBron keeping you in the game. Nash averaged 21.3 PPG and 12.7 APG on 48.4% from the field, 52.0% from 3, and 86.2% from the line against the Spurs. I'm sure he could have been a "killer" too if he had LeBron next to him.

Nah, I'm serious. Kyrie might have been young, but the Cavs weren't any good. Now, he ended up playing second fiddle to LeBron and then being traded to a stacked Celtics team that went to the ECF without him. The man hasn't had to do heavy lifting since those early career days. He hasn't earned the accolades you're giving him. You're basically heaping accolades on him because he's "clutch."