Eagles extend DT Tim Jernigan for 4 years

[Dr LBC]

10 minutes ago, BAConrad said:

Your point?

The Seahawks had that happen to them. And theyve been able to still stay competitive because of its blue chip, franchise players and QB. Just like the Eagles will once we have to cut ties with a few of those guys. Also, Curry will be gone after this season anyway. The core of our front is the starters: Graham-Cox-Jernigan-Barnett. All of whom will be on this team for the next 3+ years at least. 

As for the news about Jernigan....IM FRIGGIN STOKED. I praised this move all offseason and kept wondering out loud why nobody seemed to ever mention it when talking about offseason acquisitions.  Our DL is stacked, and Howie Roseman is continuing to make every other GM not named Bill Bellichick his B****

First off, don't circumvent the swear filter by using *'s or symbols in place of the actual letters; it counts the same as swearing around here (i.e. a violation of the rule, but  against foul language).

Secondly, I get that you're excited and rightfully so, but the underlined part just isn't factually true.  Yes, Roseman is kicking butt as a GM, but there is no evidence he is "making every other GM his female dog."  He hasn't had dealings with every other GM, much less dealings where he came out the irrefutable winner.  He isn't setting some new paradigm.  And, while the Eagles are certainly looking on a very favorable track right now, he has 2 Division titles (1 of which while Andy was still around) which accounted for the only two playoff appearances, no playoff wins, and no championships.  Roseman is definitely kicking some butt, but his team needs to actually win something before he's making B's out of every other GM except for the one who has 5 Lombardi's.

And let's not pretend like Howie hasn't made his fair share of bad trades.  It would be fair to say that his good trades have done more good than his bad trades did harm, but he has several recent trades that haven't exactly aged particularly well, and none of what has been mentioned in this particular paragraph substantiated the level of hyperbole your underlined statement threw out.

[BAConrad]

What terrible trades has Howie made? just curious

And I said that particular phrase with the meaning being that Howie, pre and post Chip Kelly, has been a fantastic GM, arguably one of the best.

Note: Les Snead deserves to be mentioned as well in those regards. Jeff Fisher was his only kryptonite.

[Dr LBC]

14 minutes ago, BAConrad said:

What terrible trades has Howie made? just curious

And I said that particular phrase with the meaning being that Howie, pre and post Chip Kelly, has been a fantastic GM, arguably one of the best.

Note: Les Snead deserves to be mentioned as well in those regards. Jeff Fisher was his only kryptonite.

The Clemons-for-Tapp trade was straight up bad.  The DeMarco Murray trade isn't aging well, particularly with what Murray has been able to do in Tennessee.  Giving up on a 2nd round pick in Eric Rowe after only a year to turn around and draft (prospect-for-prospect) a near-identical player in Rasul Douglas doesn't present very favorably.  Trading away Dion Lewis hasn't aged well considering what he's been able to do for the Pats and the piddly return they got on him from the Browns.  The Asante Samuel trade wasn't a particularly good one (his value was poor, but the Eagles were also responsible for that, and he ended up outperforming both of the guys they dealt him so that they could start).  Giving up multiple picks for Arrelious Benn - who had done nothing to merit multiple picks even if they were late picks - was a bad trade.  The Dennis Kelly for DGB trade isn't aging well at all considering you guys once again are needy in the OT depth department and Kelly just extended with the Titans.  Ditto at this point for the Allen Barbre trade this season.  And time will tell on the Ronald Darby trade - leaving Jordan Matthews out of it, Howie still gave up a 3rd round pick, leaving you guys without a 2nd or 3rd next draft, for a guy who didn't perform particularly well his last season in Buffalo... and that was before his injury early this season.

I never said he made "terrible trades" (outside maybe the Tapp one where Schneider put the pwnage on him), but he has his fair share of bad ones just like many other current GM's.

[squire12]

What players are PHI going to release to create the cap space needed for 2018?   Spotrac has them at $3.8M over the cap.  This is before the likely increase in overall salary cap to ~$180M (the projection that I have seen most consistently for the 2018 salary cap).

From the looks of it, 

Torrey Smith saves $5M

Brent Celek saves $4M

[Eagles $5$]

45 minutes ago, The LBC said:

The Clemons-for-Tapp trade was straight up bad.  The DeMarco Murray trade isn't aging well, particularly with what Murray has been able to do in Tennessee.  Giving up on a 2nd round pick in Eric Rowe after only a year to turn around and draft (prospect-for-prospect) a near-identical player in Rasul Douglas doesn't present very favorably.  Trading away Dion Lewis hasn't aged well considering what he's been able to do for the Pats and the piddly return they got on him from the Browns.  The Asante Samuel trade wasn't a particularly good one (his value was poor, but the Eagles were also responsible for that, and he ended up outperforming both of the guys they dealt him so that they could start).  Giving up multiple picks for Arrelious Benn - who had done nothing to merit multiple picks even if they were late picks - was a bad trade.  The Dennis Kelly for DGB trade isn't aging well at all considering you guys once again are needy in the OT depth department and Kelly just extended with the Titans.  Ditto at this point for the Allen Barbre trade this season.  And time will tell on the Ronald Darby trade - leaving Jordan Matthews out of it, Howie still gave up a 3rd round pick, leaving you guys without a 2nd or 3rd next draft, for a guy who didn't perform particularly well his last season in Buffalo... and that was before his injury early this season.

I never said he made "terrible trades" (outside maybe the Tapp one where Schneider put the pwnage on him), but he has his fair share of bad ones just like many other current GM's.

Lol clearly you don't know what you're talking about the Eagles... i would stop. Murray a trade??? Samuel a trade??? 

[Dr LBC]

1 minute ago, Eagles $5$ said:

Lol clearly you don't know what you're talking about the Eagles... i would stop. Murray a trade??? Samuel a trade??? 

Or you know... you could refute with actual discussion rather than just blindly (lazily) dismissing.

I said the Murray trade hasn't aged well because of how Murray has performed in Tennessee.  Was it likely the Eagles were going to hold onto him given what they paid him relative to how he performed?  No.  But when you trade away a guy that underperformed after you paid him fat and the contract is a major reason why you get a paltry return on him, guess what?  That doesn't reflect well on the General Manager who made those moves.

Asante Samuel outperformed both Asomugha and DRC the year the Eagles traded him to Atlanta.  That's not debatable, the proof is in the play and the stat book.

But please, by all means, defend how I know nothing about what I'm talking about and how trading Chris Clemons and a 4th round pick for Darryl Tapp who never played a full season for the Eagles and never sniffed the production he had in Seattle in any of his years with the Eagles was a good trade.

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

If you want to argue that Howie isn't perfect, fair enough, but what he did this past off season, and the off season before by getting a first for Bradford after drafting Wentz... he has to be a top name in terms of GMs. He has taken a team that was literally destroyed by Chip Kelly and made it into a potential Super Bowl team in two years, with what looks to be a very good young QB on the roster. Yeah, he isn't the best at analyzing talent, but the fact that he is still hitting on draft picks shows that he has learned to trust the people under him who know more. His ability to maximize our cap space has been nothing short of magic his entire career here and he has had numerous trades that ended with us getting massive value down the line.

So no, Howie isn't perfect, but he is really freaking good.

[BAConrad]

1 hour ago, The LBC said:

Or you know... you could refute with actual discussion rather than just blindly (lazily) dismissing.

I said the Murray trade hasn't aged well because of how Murray has performed in Tennessee.  Was it likely the Eagles were going to hold onto him given what they paid him relative to how he performed?  No.  But when you trade away a guy that underperformed after you paid him fat and the contract is a major reason why you get a paltry return on him, guess what?  That doesn't reflect well on the General Manager who made those moves.

LOL. Howie didnt sign Murray. Holy hell man. Honestly. Google is your best friend right now.

Asante Samuel outperformed both Asomugha and DRC the year the Eagles traded him to Atlanta.  That's not debatable, the proof is in the play and the stat book.

But please, by all means, defend how I know nothing about what I'm talking about and how trading Chris Clemons and a 4th round pick for Darryl Tapp who never played a full season for the Eagles and never sniffed the production he had in Seattle in any of his years with the Eagles was a good trade.

Ummm yeah this last part is about to really help you out....

 

 

..in looking like you know nothing about what were discussing

As my friend above said, you actually really should at least do a quick google search if you dont know anything about a team, at the very least. 

Howie Roseman became GM in 2010. Up until then Andy Reid had final say.

The Clemons/Tapp trade was made in 2009. 

 So basically the only two "bad" trades you could come up with in your tiny little mind was The Asante trade in 2012 (which was for a 7th that turned into Bryce Brown, and Asante proceeded to fall off a cliff after we traded him, retiring soon after)

 

and the Murray trade....lmao. Really? Murray was terrible for us and wasnt "Howies guy"...as in Chip is the one who signed Murray,  back during those two dark years where Chip completely demolished our team. Wanna know what we got for Murray? First, his contract off our books. Second, a 4th round draft pick which we then used to trade for that one dude.....Forgetting his name...Oh Carson Wentz.  

Not only that, but he then managed to get rid of ANOTHER terrible player in Maxwell with a huge contract, using him in part of the key part of the Wentz trade in swapping 13th pick for Miamis 8th for Maxwell and Kiko. 

The Dion Lewis trade? Once again...CHIP KELLY MOVE. 

Got any other brilliant things to say that I can also take a hot poop on like I did just now? 

[BAConrad]

And I am actually still laughing that you had to dig so deep and thus had ro mention any trades involving two 30+ year old career back up offensive lineman 

[Dr LBC]

9 minutes ago, BAConrad said:

As my friend above said, you actually really should at least do a quick google search if you dont know anything about a team, at the very least. 

Howie Roseman became GM in 2010. Up until then Andy Reid had final say.

The Clemons/Tapp trade was made in 2009. 

 So basically the only two "bad" trades you could come up with in your tiny little mind was The Asante trade in 2012 (which was for a 7th that turned into Bryce Brown, and Asante proceeded to fall off a cliff after we traded him, retiring soon after)

 

and the Murray trade....lmao. Really? Murray was terrible for us and wasnt "Howies guy"...as in Chip is the one who signed Murray,  back during those two dark years where Chip completely demolished our team. Wanna know what we got for Murray? First, his contract off our books. Second, a 4th round draft pick which we then used to trade for that one dude.....Forgetting his name...Oh Carson Wentz.  

Not only that, but he then managed to get rid of ANOTHER terrible player in Maxwell with a huge contract, using him in part of the key part of the Wentz trade in swapping 13th pick for Miamis 8th for Maxwell and Kiko. 

The Dion Lewis trade? Once again...CHIP KELLY MOVE. 

Got any other brilliant things to say that I can also take a hot poop on like I did just now? 

First off, if you can't address criticism of your team without resorting to hurling personal attacks at other members (as you've done with the bolded), then go find another site to post on because I'll gladly recommend to Webby that your privileges here be revoked as we have rule about that as well as a simple expectation of common courtesy.  It's not an unreasonable expectation for you to act like a damn adult.

If you can actually manage that, then I'm perfectly happy to defend my position in a civilized conversation (and yes, I can actually do that because for as petty as you were about trying to pick apart my "reading abilities" you pretty much faceplanted in the process with regards to your own).  If not, i'll be happy to issue you a warning and recommend you to Webby for a vacation from the site.

[Dr LBC]

56 minutes ago, AZ_Eaglesfan said:

If you want to argue that Howie isn't perfect, fair enough, but what he did this past off season, and the off season before by getting a first for Bradford after drafting Wentz... he has to be a top name in terms of GMs. He has taken a team that was literally destroyed by Chip Kelly and made it into a potential Super Bowl team in two years, with what looks to be a very good young QB on the roster. Yeah, he isn't the best at analyzing talent, but the fact that he is still hitting on draft picks shows that he has learned to trust the people under him who know more. His ability to maximize our cap space has been nothing short of magic his entire career here and he has had numerous trades that ended with us getting massive value down the line.

So no, Howie isn't perfect, but he is really freaking good.

This is what I've been arguing.  But apparently saying he has any fault or flaw and hasn't "made female dogs out of every GM not named Belichick" equates to "not knowing anything about the Eagles."  Or so seems to be the position of several so far...

[Dr LBC]

Also, for the record, Tapp was traded March 2010 - so that very much was a Roseman trade and not an Andy Reid trade.  And Samuel snagged 5 interceptions for Atlanta the season he was traded (2012) which was more than Asomugh and DRC had combined that season.  But yeah... he fell off a cliff immediately after the Eagles traded him, right

[BAConrad]

3 minutes ago, The LBC said:

First off, if you can't address criticism of your team without resorting to hurling personal attacks at other members (as you've done with the bolded), then go find another site to post on because I'll gladly recommend to Webby that your privileges here be revoked as we have rule about that as well as a simple expectation of common courtesy.  It's not an unreasonable expectation for you to act like a damn adult.

What criticism? How is it criticism if what youre saying is inherently false in the first place? I am so very sorry if you felt I wasnt being adult like, but this is a debate forum, and I refuted your false statements with actual reality and truth. Is this not a place to debate? And are we not allowed to have fun while we do it? What I said didnt break any rule IYAM. I didnt call you a name. Or directly insult you. Just because your subjective value of what determines "respect" is tantamount to that of a grandmother from the '60s?

3 minutes ago, The LBC said:

If you can actually manage that, then I'm perfectly happy to defend my position in a civilized conversation (and yes, I can actually do that because for as petty as you were about trying to pick apart my "reading abilities" you pretty much faceplanted in the process with regards to your own).  If not, i'll be happy to issue you a warning and recommend you to Webby for a vacation from the site.

Please. I implore you to tell me how anything I said was wrong regarding those trades. 

I apologize for the "tiny mind" remark. Truly. I sometimes forget how sensitive some people can be relative to myself (seriously, I do)

[BAConrad]

11 minutes ago, The LBC said:

Also, for the record, Tapp was traded March 2010 - so that very much was a Roseman trade and not an Andy Reid trade. 

Youre right.

My source:

• 2/28/09 - Traded CB Lito Sheppard and a 5th round pick in 2010 
(traded to Arizona who selected QB John Skelton) to the NY Jets 
for a 5th round draft pick in 2009 (TE Cornelius Ingram) and a 4th 
round draft pick in 2010 (traded to Seattle along with DE Chris 
Clemons for DE Darryl Tapp)
 2008 

I misread this last part. My fault.

Anyway, the basic fact that we are talking about trades such as these are a testament to how good Roseman has been. 

That the worst things you could find that hes done were trading away aging corners who lasted one year on their new team, underperforming veterans like Clemons who overachieved elsewhere, and back up 30+ year old OL......THAT is my entire point here. I see nothing more than 1, maybe 2 trades involving players such as Chris Clemons and Dennis Kelly...

[Dr LBC]

1 minute ago, BAConrad said:

What criticism? How is it criticism if what youre saying is inherently false in the first place? I am so very sorry if you felt I wasnt being adult like, but this is a debate forum, and I refuted your false statements with actual reality and truth. Is this not a place to debate? And are we not allowed to have fun while we do it? What I said didnt break any rule IYAM. I didnt call you a name. Or directly insult you. Just because your subjective value of what determines "respect" is tantamount to that of a grandmother from the '60s?

Please. I implore you to tell me how anything I said was wrong regarding those trades. 

I apologize for the "tiny mind" remark. Truly. I sometimes forget how sensitive some people can be relative to myself (seriously, I do)

It has nothing to do with sensitivity.  And don't try to pretend or play it off as just busting balls.  Own it.  That's what an adult does.

As to showing you how anything you said was wrong, see my above post.  I did.  For all your insistence that I should Google things, perhaps you should try it.  The Tapp trade was made March 16, 2010, very clearly after Roseman had assumed the GM post.  Asante Samuel, bluntly put, statistically outperformed both DRC and Asomugha the season he was traded.  The acquisition of Bryce Brown or even the subsequent future picks that he was traded for is fairly inconsequential, as Brown cost you guys as many games (the fumble in Dallas that Claiborne returned for the game-deciding TD ring a bell?) as he won for you.

And, I'm sorry, but scoffing at an OL because they're in their 30's (when OL consistently productively play deep into their 30's) is what's laughable, dude.  Especially when those trade were made the past two seasons and your team has then gone on to have issues with OL depth due when injuries mount.  Regardless of their age, those OL were still quality depth capable of playing tackle or guard who would have stepped in and lessened the impact of those injuries.  But Roseman has a track record of trading away OL.  Some of them have had negligible outcomes (Stacy Andrews, even though he was slated to be a starter when he was traded away; Winston Justice, so that you guys could roll out King Dunlap as a starting tackle), but it's a habit that, by and large, has not been one to yield positive results for Roseman.