NYRaider Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 13 minutes ago, BayRaider said: His play wouldn’t have lost him his job. It would be his play combined with answering “No” to “Did you feel the offense let the defense down?”, like what was he thinking saying no to that? Wilson is slowly digging his own grave. Although I have said multiple times, never judge a QB until at least like 40% through season 3. Look at Tua for example, I never stopped believing in him. He has talent for days. Tua actually won games though and was decent. Zach Wilson is god awful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggie. Posted November 23, 2022 Author Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 54 minutes ago, BayRaider said: His play wouldn’t have lost him his job. It would be his play combined with answering “No” to “Did you feel the offense let the defense down?”, like what was he thinking saying no to that? Wilson is slowly digging his own grave. Although I have said multiple times, never judge a QB until at least like 40% through season 3. Look at Tua for example, I never stopped believing in him. He has talent for days. Yet you already wrote off Mac Jones? Edited November 23, 2022 by biggie. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Yin-Yang said: I can’t fathom that we’re talking about Jimmy like he’s a one way ticket to the championship game, lol. And now we’re comparing Jimmy, almost a decade into his career, to Jerry Rice in his first 3 seasons. I know you’re using that to reinforce the narrative that starting terribly doesn’t mean you’ll always be terrible, but you don’t think using young Jerry Rice is a bit of a stretch? Lol. Nothing about Jimmy’s play or body of work indicates that he’s a high end QB. The guy is a “good enough to not be the sole reason you fail, but not good enough to cover up the roster” QB. Keep saying “I’d rather win with Jimmy than lose with a better QB”, but that’s a non sequitor because having Jimmy doesn’t mean you’re going to the championship game. If Jimmy was punching tickets to the NFCCG every year, and the only thing holding him back was health, then go get a good backup. Not mortgage your future for a rookie, lol. Nothing is certain, so no I wouldn't characterize my comments thus far for Jimmy as a "one way ticket to a championship game". Very few QBs in NFL certain I'd ever place such a label on, if I ever did. If the Jets got the type of Jimmy G that we're seeing now, then that gives them a chance with that team. That's all anyone can ask for. Yes it would be nice if the Jets stumbled upon the next wunderkind like Mahomes or Allen, but if you can't find that, and you have a team ready to go now, getting a QB like Jimmy is a great option. It's hard to find a QB that plays even at a decent level like that, and some franchises have been looking for years. And yes I made the comparison with Jimmy G and Jerry Rice in that specific situation of not performing up to par in multiple playoff games. What's the problem? At the time, Jerry was doo doo in the playoffs, and kept turning the ball over. There was buzz that he couldn't get it done in the playoffs for three years. Obviously that was BS, but that was the word at the time for a while. Jimmy doesn't have to be a high end QB, and no one is making that claim. He's a good QB that can give a team a chance, and help them win. Him having bad playoff performances thus far isn't indictive of what's going to happen later. I guess a Jet fan can succumb to that type of fear and superstition if they want to, but I'd personally be excited in their place if he got signed playing the way he is now. Don't see what the problem is. Edited November 23, 2022 by TecmoSuperJoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: We aren't? “I’d rather have Jimmy and get there than another QB and not”, implying what? That Jimmy gets you there. 11 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: If the Jets got the type of Jimmy G that we're seeing now, then that gives them a chance with that team. That's all anyone can ask for. Yes it would be nice if the Jets stumbled upon the next wunderkind like Mahomes or Allen, but if you can't find that, and you have a team ready to go now, getting a QB like Jimmy is a great option. It's hard to find a QB that plays even at a decent level like that, and some franchises have been looking for years. Which is exactly why I said it’d be a good fit. I already said barring something semi-crazy like trading for Carr or very crazy like attaining Rodgers/Brady, Jimmy’s as good an option as they’ll find for 2023. 11 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: And yes I made the comparison with Jimmy G and Jerry Rice in that specific situation of not performing up to par in multiple playoff games. What's the problem? At the time, Jerry was doo doo in the playoffs, and kept turning the ball over. There was buzz that he couldn't get it done in the playoffs for three years. Obviously that was BS, but that was the word at the time for a while. Because one guy was in his first couple years in the league and the other will be a 10 year vet when he signs with a new team? Because one later went on to be the GOAT at his position, thus proving he’s not at all like anybody else in NFL history, yet we’re using a situation of his as if Jimmy can also turn things around just as simply? C’mon now. Jimmy’s a known commodity. No one’s bringing him in thinking they found their Kurt Warner or Steve Young. You bring him in as a solid QB to stabilize the position, knowing you’ll probably be looking for someone better in a year or two. 11 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: Jimmy doesn't have to be a high end QB, and no one is making that claim. He's a good QB that can give a team a chance, and help them win. Him having bad playoff performances thus far isn't indictive of what's going to happen later. I guess a Jet fan can succumb to that type of fear and superstition if they want to, but I'd personally be excited in their place if he got signed playing the way he is now. So his awful QBing in the postseason isn’t indicative of awful QBing going forward in the postseason, but his solid QBing in the regular season is completely indicative of solid QBing for his next team? Makes total sense… Similar to the last guy, you’re arguing with yourself because I already said Jimmy + NYJ = good fit. But I also happened to say he’s a game manager and is QB purgatory player, so that ruffled feathers for some reason. Edited November 23, 2022 by Yin-Yang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 I gave up on ESPN years ago but I typed in Zach Wilson on YouTube and basically every TV personality they have has taken the time to roast him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said: “I’d rather have Jimmy and get there than another QB and not”, implying what? That Jimmy gets you there. Which is exactly why I said it’d be a good fit. I already said barring something semi-crazy like trading for Carr or very crazy like attaining Rodgers/Brady, Jimmy’s as good an option as they’ll find for 2023. Because one guy was in his first couple years in the league and the other will be a 10 year vet when he signs with a new team? Because one later went on to be the GOAT at his position, thus proving he’s not at all like anybody else in NFL history, yet we’re using a situation of his as if Jimmy can also turn things around just as simply? C’mon now. Jimmy’s a known commodity. No one’s bringing him in thinking they found their Kurt Warner or Steve Young. You bring him in as a solid QB to stabilize the position, knowing you’ll probably be looking for someone better in a year or two. So his awful QBing in the postseason isn’t indicative of awful QBing going forward in the postseason, but his solid QBing in the regular season is completely indicative of solid QBing for his next team? Makes total sense… Similar to the last guy, you’re arguing with yourself because I already said Jimmy + NYJ = good fit. But I also happened to say he’s a game manager and is QB purgatory player, so that ruffled feathers for some reason. Yes, because it's happened. That doesn't mean it will happen again for sure, but it can happen as we've seen even with him playing badly. Can doesn't denote a guarantee like you said though. What does Jimmy being a 10 year vet have to do with anything? It's not his fault he was drafted to be behind Brady, traded to a losing team that wasn't going to the playoffs, and then got hurt for a couple of seasons. I'm talking about when the first few opportunities presented itself for either player. Yeah Rice went on to be the GOAT at his position, and he was still a bum for the first three years in the playoffs. Jimmy doesn't have to be a future legend to have a good playoff game in the future. Yes, Jimmy is a known commodity. No one is arguing against that here. He can help the Jets win for a few years potentially. Isn't that good? No his awful quarterbacking in the postseason isn't indicative of terrible quarterback playing going forward in future postseasons. Just like it didn't for Rice, and just like it didn't for Peyton Manning their first few years in the playoffs where they as HOF players were disappointments. He'll play decent football in the regular season, but then just decide to play terribly every single time a playoff campaign commences because what happened in previous trips? That's like starting to believe in a curse, and that's lunacy lol. I wouldn't label him as a QB purgatory player, so maybe that's the rub. We'll see what happens. Edited November 23, 2022 by TecmoSuperJoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 3 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: I wouldn't label him as a QB purgatory player, so maybe that's the rub. We'll see what happens. QB purgatory player that led the 49ers to the Super Bowl and should've led them to another one last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, biggie. said: Yet you already wrote off Mac Jones? Mac Jones will always be a decent starter but he doesn’t have Top 10 QB potential like the four selected before him. Like, he’s bust proof, but he’s never gonna be that good. There is only so much one can do with an arm like his combined with lack of athleticism. Need one or the other, preferably both. Edited November 23, 2022 by BayRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 43 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: Yes, because it's happened. That doesn't mean it will happen again for sure, but it can happen as we've seen even with him playing badly. Can doesn't denote a guarantee like you said though. Ohhhhh, it’s happened. It’s almost as if how Jimmy’s performed in the past has some sort of indication on what your expectation of him is going forward. Wow, crazy crazy thought… 43 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: What does Jimmy being a 10 year vet have to do with anything? It's not his fault he was drafted to be behind Brady, traded to a losing team that wasn't going to the playoffs, and then got hurt for a couple of seasons. I'm talking about when the first few opportunities presented itself for either player. Yeah Rice went on to be the GOAT at his position, and he was still a bum for the first three years in the playoffs. Jimmy doesn't have to be a future legend to have a good playoff game in the future. It has to do with him having plenty of experience at this point, unlike Rice as a rookie lol. Not a hard concept. 43 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: Yes, Jimmy is a known commodity. No one is arguing against that here. He can help the Jets win for a few years potentially. Isn't that good? Zach can help the Jets win for a few years potentially. Isn’t that good? [insert QB who played like crap in their first two seasons and then went on to have a good career/win a SB], because if it can happen to that QB and Jerry Rice, it could happen for Zach! 43 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: No his awful quarterbacking in the postseason isn't indicative of terrible quarterback playing going forward in future postseasons. Just like it didn't for Rice, and just like it didn't for Peyton Manning their first few years in the playoffs where they as HOF players were disappointments. Yeah, Peyton Manning and Jerry Rice are totally the norm, LOL. Funnier part is how underwhelming Manning was in the postseason as a whole. Why would you expect a guy whose shown to be poor at something, with a decent enough sample size, to magically just flip a switch? Because some HOFers did it? See it to believe it. Jimmy has shown no indication that he’s going to be a valuable asset in the postseason, and has in fact shown to be a poor overall postseason performer to this point. Maybe that changes, but those are the facts as of now. 43 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: He'll play decent football in the regular season, but then just decide to play terribly every single time a playoff campaign commences because what happened in previous trips? He’ll play decent football in the regular season but then will show that he’s just a game manager when the competition gets stiffer in the playoffs, as he’s done multiple times. Again, not a hard concept. 43 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: That's like starting to believe in a curse, and that's lunacy lol. Lunacy is putting Jimmy Garroppolo in the same sentence as Jerry Rice and Peyton Manning, lol. 43 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: I wouldn't label him as a QB purgatory player, so maybe that's the rub. We'll see what happens. Looking forward to him re-signing long term with the 49ers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukjets21 Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 34 minutes ago, BayRaider said: Mac Jones will always be a decent starter but he doesn’t have Top 10 QB potential like the four selected before him. Like, he’s bust proof, but he’s never gonna be that good. There is only so much one can do with an arm like his combined with lack of athleticism. Need one or the other, preferably both. This is quite presumptuos, I've seen nothing to believe he'll be a solid starter for years - which is the minimum needed to not be a bust as a 1st round QB. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said: Ohhhhh, it’s happened. It’s almost as if how Jimmy’s performed in the past has some sort of indication on what your expectation of him is going forward. Wow, crazy crazy thought… It has to do with him having plenty of experience at this point, unlike Rice as a rookie lol. Not a hard concept. Zach can help the Jets win for a few years potentially. Isn’t that good? [insert QB who played like crap in their first two seasons and then went on to have a good career/win a SB], because if it can happen to that QB and Jerry Rice, it could happen for Zach! Yeah, Peyton Manning and Jerry Rice are totally the norm, LOL. Funnier part is how underwhelming Manning was in the postseason as a whole. Why would you expect a guy whose shown to be poor at something, with a decent enough sample size, to magically just flip a switch? Because some HOFers did it? See it to believe it. Jimmy has shown no indication that he’s going to be a valuable asset in the postseason, and has in fact shown to be a poor overall postseason performer to this point. Maybe that changes, but those are the facts as of now. He’ll play decent football in the regular season but then will show that he’s just a game manager when the competition gets stiffer in the playoffs, as he’s done multiple times. Again, not a hard concept. Lunacy is putting Jimmy Garroppolo in the same sentence as Jerry Rice and Peyton Manning, lol. Looking forward to him re-signing long term with the 49ers! Ooof. Yeah you're completely missing the bigger picture again. And now you sound like you're starting to go off the fringe a bit too much for my taste. But it's ok. Just football chat. Prayin for you tho dawg. Edited November 23, 2022 by TecmoSuperJoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 hour ago, NYRaider said: QB purgatory player that led the 49ers to the Super Bowl and should've led them to another one last season. Warren Moon wept. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 54 minutes ago, ukjets21 said: This is quite presumptuos, I've seen nothing to believe he'll be a solid starter for years - which is the minimum needed to not be a bust as a 1st round QB. Well I guess I mean Mac will never be like omg terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 17 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: Ooof. Yeah you're completely missing the bigger picture again. And now you sound like you're starting to go off the fringe a bit too much for my taste. But it's ok. Just football chat. Prayin for you tho dawg. Yeah, completely missed the part where Jimmy sucking in the postseason is somehow not indicative of him sucking in the postseason, but Jerry Rice sucking in the postseason is indicative of Jimmy Garroppolo turning it around, made sense. It’s okay, my man. Sometimes even the simplest things go over the biggest of heads, no shame. No hard feelings either. 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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