big_palooka Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 7 hours ago, ronjon1990 said: Champ was hired by Shanahan as a college scout- a position you've already dismissed as having no role. He held it for 2 seasons prior to becoming a McDaniels guy in higher up positions you've also already dismissed as having zero relevance. Also, nobody ever said he was a Patriot guy (he never worked for the Patriots), but a McDaniels guy- which he largely was. Sit back down, kid. Except he wasn't, because he came up with Shanahan, worked with John Fox and the joined a rebuilding Bears team. He just happened to be in Denver when JMD came through and hired Ziegler. You try to tie them all together as means to disqualify Kelly, in reality he is his own man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 hours ago, big_palooka said: Except he wasn't, because he came up with Shanahan, worked with John Fox and the joined a rebuilding Bears team. He just happened to be in Denver when JMD came through and hired Ziegler. You try to tie them all together as means to disqualify Kelly, in reality he is his own man. So he's tied to a bunch of guys who lose their jobs? Even better. No wonder you have a thing for him. #flocktogether. Now, are you flipping like Mia Khalifa on that Chamo's job was more than that of a mere paper pusher the same as you flipped on McDaniels? Because it wasn't long ago you, laughably and erroneously, tried arguing that Champ should have no scarlet letters to his resume for the terrible drafting and roster building he's very often been a part of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolni Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 21 hours ago, Nightmare said: Going to be interesting to see what jobs do become available. I think ours will score relatively highly on any rankings of attractiveness tbh. Trying to look objectively, there are a lot of appealing things about the Raiders job. The one huge, gaping hole is the QB situation which we won’t be in a good position to immediately fix. But I think if you graded the available jobs we’re probably one of the more appealing ones… The job openings I'm expecting: Raiders, Panthers, Chargers, Commanders, Patriots, Falcons, Bears. I wouldn't be shocked to see the folowing openings: Saints, Titans, Buccaneers We could have 10 openings, but 7 or 8 will probably be the reality. The new HC(GM) would have: -great draft capital, lots of cap space and young roster with the Bears -franchise QB, talented roster, however big salary cap decisions with the Chargers -young playmakers, patient owner in an easy division with the Falcons I could easily see those openings being listed ahead of us and there could be others too, based on HC's preference. We have a great tax situation, great stadium and facility and a so-so roster without QB and a questionable owner...also that so-so roster cold easily be labeled as bad, if thee new staff couldn't, wouldn't want to invest in JJ or/and keep DA... Our draft position won't be super and while we will have solid cap space, we will also have limitations... I'm not so sure about us being a top destination... If the 2-3 hot names, choose to go elsewhere our best option maybe will be the Kelly-Pierce duo afterall... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 13 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: So he's tied to a bunch of guys who lose their jobs? Even better. No wonder you have a thing for him. #flocktogether. Now, are you flipping like Mia Khalifa on that Chamo's job was more than that of a mere paper pusher the same as you flipped on McDaniels? Because it wasn't long ago you, laughably and erroneously, tried arguing that Champ should have no scarlet letters to his resume for the terrible drafting and roster building he's very often been a part of. I don't want Kelly as the GM. Already stated that several times. However, if you're going detract from his resume based on draft picks made by the GM. Then you also have to add to his resume for being a part of a Super Bowl roster. That's how it works right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 18 minutes ago, big_palooka said: I don't want Kelly as the GM. Already stated that several times. However, if you're going detract from his resume based on draft picks made by the GM. Then you also have to add to his resume for being a part of a Super Bowl roster. That's how it works right? In other words, you won't answer the question. You flipping your position on Champ's job responsibilities and impact or no? Simple question, and you brought it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) Never forget: "No. I'm one of the few people who think a coach needs at least 3 years before you can judge if he's a good coach or not. I think he's a good play caller. Rich would have fallen off last year. Fun story, you're naive if you think he had true staying power as a HC. Notice he's still coaching STs and not coaching another team. You can't win with an average QB. What's your argument?" - Big Palooka, in his infinite consistent wisdom, demanding 3 years and better than average QB play in July for Josh McDaniels before flipping in December demanding Antonio Pierce win with below average QB play right now. https://forums.footballsfuture.com/topic/48016-raiders-sign-qb-jimmy-garoppolo-3-years-675m-34m-gtd/?do=findComment&comment=5241716 Edited December 21, 2023 by ronjon1990 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 10 hours ago, Geezy said: With 2 of those Ls coming from two of the top teams in the AFC brother So he can't beat good teams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styrian Raider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 19 minutes ago, NYRaider said: So he can't beat good teams So you would've fired Andy Reid in his first season as a HC aswell? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 42 minutes ago, Styrian Raider said: So you would've fired Andy Reid in his first season as a HC aswell? I wasn't aware that AP was an assistant with the Packers for years that helped develop a HOF QB as a key staffer for their Super Bowl run before he got hired. I thought he was a LB coach that JMD hired who had previously failed as a HC at Long Beach Poly and as a DC at Arizona State. My apologies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styrian Raider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, NYRaider said: I wasn't aware that AP was an assistant with the Packers for years that helped develop a HOF QB as a key staffer for their Super Bowl run before he got hired. I thought he was a LB coach that JMD hired who had previously failed as a HC at Long Beach Poly and as a DC at Arizona State. My apologies. Oh I am sorry. I didn't knew that you started to need context all of a sudden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) 50 minutes ago, Styrian Raider said: So you would've fired Andy Reid in his first season as a HC aswell? Bro would hire Helen Keller as OC if he thought she had that "dawg" in her. What that "dawg" is, however, is anyone's guess. He doesn't know, either. What I'm saying is he'll say all this now, but if you bring up someone like Reid, he'll dance around an answer and try to change the subject and want context, stats, etc. Narrative shopping at its finest. Edited December 21, 2023 by ronjon1990 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, Styrian Raider said: Oh I am sorry. I didn't knew that you started to need context all of a sudden. The context that AP has failed at the HS / College levels but now half of our fans think that he's suited to be an NFL head coach despite crapping the bed over the last month because he wears cool clothes, makes cool comments, and beat Easton Stick? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 4 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: Bro would hire Helen Keller as OC if he thought she had that "dawg" in her. What that "dawg" is, however, is unknown. What I'm saying is he'll say all this now, but if you bring up someone like Reid, he'll dance around an answer and try to change the subject and want context, stats, etc. Narrative shopping at its finest. Nah I've made it clear who I want as the staff. Frank Smith as the HC / Darrell Bevell as the OC Two proven commodities that have developed young QB's to become elite players in the NFL and have had success winning games. Do you think either one of them would've gotten run out of a HS program for failing to make the playoffs at a school that hadn't missed the postseason in 4 decades or is that just AP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 Chiefs - Andy Reid Chargers - Bill Bellichick Broncos - Sean Payton Raiders - Antonio Pierce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, NYRaider said: The context that AP has failed at the HS / College levels but now half of our fans think that he's suited to be an NFL head coach despite crapping the bed over the last month because he wears cool clothes, makes cool comments, and beat Easton Stick? The fact he didn't allow Brandon Staley to come in and beat us with a Stick is, actually, quite impressive compared to the last guy we hired. HS is irrelevant. You'll figure that out eventually. Nobody more than a few years removed from high school is going to care about that. He was obviously good enough in college coaching to move up to the pros, was he not? Being saddled with Herm Edwards did him no favors at ASU, but true failures at the college level don't typically fail their way into the NFL. Edited December 21, 2023 by ronjon1990 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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