Potential Aiyuk Trade Talk

[3rivers]

56 minutes ago, Steeler Hitman said:

He's never been able to do that buddy.  P.S. He's in midseason form on the preseason challenges too!😜

I didn't rewatch that play enough, but was GP in?  

I never saw a stat sheet of HC challenge win %, but would expect tomlin to be below the middle . He misses some by not challenging, he might miss more of those than others.  Does the team have a crew of  video game kids reviewing the plays and calling dow for the challenge? Who is reviewing this for the steelers?

Tomlin might not have access to the the replay as he should. I would demand an Ipad with zoom feature to watch the replay if I was the HC.  Or lets just put a 100" LCD TV on the sideline behind the HC - it's 2024, not 1984. The replay back in the 80's was bad, this is better but they can improve. At least the league is trying to improve and trying new ideas.  Not sure what to make of the kick off yet

[Dcash4]

36 minutes ago, Steeler Hitman said:

Why throw your best deal out there when they are dragging their feet and changing the landscape from day to day?

Because the Steelers don’t have any control of the situation and it’s an attempt at gaining leverage in a space you have none.

If they offer a deal that Aiyuk accepts that the 49ers are unwilling to match, you win. You need to creat conflict between contract we would be willing to pay and the cap they won’t move past, Aiyuk could pressure to the point where it becomes untenable to keep him, if that were the case. 

If the reports are true we are sub $28M, the gap likely wasnt big enough to cause that conflict. We need conflict to end this with Aiyuk in black and gold. 

1 hour ago, Steeler Hitman said:

Remember also that Aiyuk got mad at the 49'ers for putting things out in the media a few weeks ago as well.

Aiyuk and his team are also playing things out publicly. This is the pot calling the kettle black. 

1 hour ago, Steeler Hitman said:

We don't know that. Other than he is coming to practice, wearing different color shorts and shirts to avoid being potntially fined, what do we really know? What has really changed?

but we do know…because he is still a 49er. Going back to the above, there isn’t enough conflict between him and the 49ers to no longer entertain their offers. He hasn’t said no to the 49ers (yet), he has said no to their deal - and that’s a big difference. 

At the end of the day this boils down to a pretty simple solution at this stage: the 49ers want Aiyuk. Aiyuk wants the 49ers to pay him. He found a willing partner he would accept as a backup plan to the point that he can now play chicken and wait for the 9ers to flinch. The 49ers have caved in multiple areas but don’t want to cave fully, setting terrible future negotiation precedent. The gap between it all isn’t big enough to create conflict they are both willing to be done with (at this stage). 

[skywlker32]

10 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

What does it contradict? He can say “I’ll take that deal if I have to, but why don’t you guys just pay me more money?”. 

If he “agreed to a contract” to the Steelers, why is he still negotiating with the 9ers to the point where the rumors say the hold up is now only on the final year details? 

The Steelers deal wasn’t good enough to shut down his desire to be a 49er. It was good enough to be a backup plan and a negotiating tactic, however. 

And…I just need to know…but you are aware Aiyuk’s team can use the media too, right? 

It's simple. Because ultimately the 49ers don't have to trade him. The story is no different than what we've been hearing. The 49ers feel like they have given more than they wanted, but Aiyuk wants more guaranteed money (supposedly the "minor" part of the last year of his offered deal).

[warfelg]

8 minutes ago, skywlker32 said:

It's simple. Because ultimately the 49ers don't have to trade him. The story is no different than what we've been hearing. The 49ers feel like they have given more than they wanted, but Aiyuk wants more guaranteed money (supposedly the "minor" part of the last year of his offered deal).

I also don’t know why Aiyuk camp would want to leak that a rumored deal is less than what it was rumored to be after it leveraged SF to come up more. Like if he was trying to use us as a leverage point he probably picked the worst GM to use because everyone knows Lhan has been at this stuff a long enough time and knows our MO of not bidding against ourselves. If him and his agent thought this was a good idea then woof. 

[skywlker32]

3 minutes ago, warfelg said:

I also don’t know why Aiyuk camp would want to leak that a rumored deal is less than what it was rumored to be after it leveraged SF to come up more. Like if he was trying to use us as a leverage point he probably picked the worst GM to use because everyone knows Lhan has been at this stuff a long enough time and knows our MO of not bidding against ourselves. If him and his agent thought this was a good idea then woof. 

You have to figure that there are potentially 4 types of reports here. Reports from:

1. Aiyuk's camp
2. 49ers camp
3. Steelers camp
4. Real insider info

This could be a more fact based report.

[edit] To evaluate where the source came from, the easiest way is to figure out who it benefits. Any report that the contracts offered were LOWER than expected doesn't benefit anyone really. In the case of a deal from Steelers supposedly being lower than reported:

1. Aiyuk KNOWS what was offered
2. 49ers won't offer more if the Steelers supposedly aren't as competitive
3. Steelers KNOW what they offered

Edited August 20 by skywlker32

[warfelg]

10 minutes ago, skywlker32 said:

You have to figure that there are potentially 4 types of reports here. Reports from:

1. Aiyuk's camp
2. 49ers camp
3. Steelers camp
4. Real insider info

This could be a more fact based report.

2&4 make the most sense in saying the Steelers offer is actually lower than reported. 

Again. My feelings. But anything about a deal with SF being near done or Pit not offering enough feels like a 9ers camp thing. SF/Pit and Aiyuk/Pit having agreements feels like an Aiyuk camp thing. We’re in waiting mode feels like a Pit camp thing. 

Once again my feelings - it makes no sense that, based on what Breer is saying, that under $28mm AAV is what we offered when it’s been at or above that number for almost a month now. Unless we are talking like it was $27.75mm and the reporters were rounding. But that doesn’t feel like a case to say less than to that degree. 

[Dcash4]

18 minutes ago, skywlker32 said:

It's simple. Because ultimately the 49ers don't have to trade him. The story is no different than what we've been hearing. The 49ers feel like they have given more than they wanted, but Aiyuk wants more guaranteed money (supposedly the "minor" part of the last year of his offered deal).

Absolutely correct, but that’s where I go back to my follow up post on the matter. There’s not enough conflict between the price points to drive anyone to end this. It’s just in limbo because it’s manageable. Hence the reason it’s likely “I’ll take that deal….unless you can also figure it out” instead of “that’s the deal I want, just send me to the Steelers”. 

We are not the end game. We are the consolation prize. 

[skywlker32]

8 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

Absolutely correct, but that’s where I go back to my follow up post on the matter. There’s not enough conflict between the price points to drive anyone to end this. It’s just in limbo because it’s manageable. Hence the reason it’s likely “I’ll take that deal….unless you can also figure it out” instead of “that’s the deal I want, just send me to the Steelers”. 

We are not the end game. We are the consolation prize. 

It could be a combination. Aiyuk could be telling them to just trade him, but the 49ers are trying to do their "due diligence" by making a new offer. He may not have told them he's DEFINITELY out either and that they need to BEAT the Steelers offer and not only match it. The only thing the Aiyuk can absolutely control is signing with the 49ers because taking their offer means he gets extended whenever he wants. He can tell the 49ers he's out all he wants and the 49ers have no obligation to move him. He can agree to the Steelers offer all he wants, but ultimately the 49ers have to allow him to take it.

[warfelg]

7 minutes ago, skywlker32 said:

It could be a combination. Aiyuk could be telling them to just trade him, but the 49ers are trying to do their "due diligence" by making a new offer. He may not have told them he's DEFINITELY out either and that they need to BEAT the Steelers offer and not only match it. The only thing the Aiyuk can absolutely control is signing with the 49ers because taking their offer means he gets extended whenever he wants. He can tell the 49ers he's out all he wants and the 49ers have no obligation to move him. He can agree to the Steelers offer all he wants, but ultimately the 49ers have to allow him to take it.

I'll add that I think from our end, this isn't that big of a deal to be waiting like this. Like, waiting does not preclude us from doing anything with Heyward, Muth, even potentially Harris before the start of the season. Especially because of depending on how you do the Heyward contract you can open a ton of space for this year and bring in Aiyuk still. As long as we continue the tactic of no extensions in season, we can wait this out 3 more weeks of being patient with this process.

That's a big part of what puts me in the mindset that we're not leaking anything, and Aiyuk likely isn't leaking anything (well adding in too that he's had a few posts about being annoyed with SF using the media) because given he seems to only want traded here, we would be bidding against ourselves. And if he doesn't want to give us a "one more contract" chance then, eh, whatever, likely that would mean that SF would want to be compensated more on a trade. At this point it's about SF dragging their feet to some degree and for them to figure out the cap on what Aiyuk wants.

[Steeler Hitman]

1 hour ago, 3rivers said:

I didn't rewatch that play enough, but was GP in?  

I don't think so. The angle shown didn't show his feet. However, it didn't look as close as the one he didn't do on the Jefferson catch last week. Maybe he wanted to play situation football and isn't as concerned with the score as he is the practice situations.  However, jokingly, but kinda serious, he isn't real good with the challenges. 

I never saw a stat sheet of HC challenge win %, but would expect tomlin to be below the middle . He misses some by not challenging, he might miss more of those than others. 

Agreed. I don't think any of us need an official stat sheet, but yes he is off on many challenges and in many situations as well. By that I mean down in distance, situation, clock managemnet. 

Does the team have a crew of video game kids reviewing the plays and calling down for the challenge?

No that I am aware of, but dang, ther's enough people in the press ox who can see and should be able to influence. 

Who is reviewing this for the Steelers?

I am not sure about now, but a few years ago it was said to be DC Austin. 

Tomlin might not have access to the the replay as he should. I would demand an Ipad with zoom feature to watch the replay if I was the HC.  Or lets just put a 100" LCD TV on the sideline behind the HC - it's 2024, not 1984.

Actually not a bad idea. But the home stadiums have the replay control. Typically they show they for the coaches.  Everyone has strengths and weaknesses, and this is not one of Coach T's strengths. He is at least in regu;lar season form. 😜

The replay back in the 80's was bad, this is better but they can improve. At least the league is trying to improve and trying new ideas.  Not sure what to make of the kick off yet.

No one really is either. Teams are not showing what they will do regular season.  A lot of vanilla here as well.

 

[armsteeld]

Regarding that Pickens sideline catch, his right foot was clearly in but his left tiptoe actually grazed the ground. If you slow it down, you can see the foot react (bounce) from hitting the grass. I thought it was a catch watching it live and after the replay. Review was wrong there.

[3rivers]

2 minutes ago, armsteeld said:

Regarding that Pickens sideline catch, his right foot was clearly in but his left tiptoe actually grazed the ground. If you slow it down, you can see the foot react (bounce) from hitting the grass. I thought it was a catch watching it live and after the replay. Review was wrong there.

why not have a 100" TV behind the coach so he can review it though?   

who is upstairs telling tomlin it's worth the challenge or not?  HC's don't have the footage right in front of them right away, so the system is flawed unless the people upstairs are good and in charge. 

If the HC is the one that challenges, lets make his views of the play the best available and right away. 

[3rivers]

don't want to show plays to the falcons says DK

smith was their coach, I am sure they know his plays.

how about not living in fears, and just call the plays and get better at them ?

[warfelg]

2 minutes ago, 3rivers said:

why not have a 100" TV behind the coach so he can review it though?   

who is upstairs telling tomlin it's worth the challenge or not?  HC's don't have the footage right in front of them right away, so the system is flawed unless the people upstairs are good and in charge. 

If the HC is the one that challenges, lets make his views of the play the best available and right away. 

NFL Rules affects all of this. They rely on in stadium replays to watch it along with TV feed that’s on a delay in the booth. That’s why teams are better challenging at home as opposed to on the road, as the home video production team is very quick to show the plays that should go in their favor. 

[Steeler Hitman]

1 hour ago, Dcash4 said:

Because the Steelers don’t have any control of the situation and it’s an attempt at gaining leverage in a space you have none.

Correct. If you ultimately have no controldon't manufacture it  with someone who knows that you don't. If he was a free agent, the Steelers would be able to do that. Ultimately, San Fran controls both ends. They could focre Aiyuk to be here next year and not be a free agent if he doesn't accept the terms. They don't ever have to approve or sign the trade. You can blow everything up, but ultimately no one wins in the end: 

1. They don't get Aiyuk to play for them and they piss him off.

2. He's in the smae place next year and won't have a team that wants him as bad. He's sat out a n entire year and wants big $$$. Teams will be hesitant.

3. Becuase teams are hesitant, the 49'ers won't get the capitol they want anyway.

If they offer a deal that Aiyuk accepts that the 49ers are unwilling to match, you win. 

But do you really know what that is? I am a big Pat Kirwin guy and he speaks of this strategy, but it works more with teams that are capped pressed, not with teams that are looking to trade. Pat also always says, "Don't tell another team what they need or don't." I.E. You try to force a hand in a front office you don't have control in and you lose. I wouild be with you more if he was a free agent. That's ultimately how we got Queen from the Ravens. They couldn't pay both of their ILB's. We made an offer they couldn't match. 

You need to create conflict between contract we would be willing to pay and the cap they won’t move past, Aiyuk could pressure to the point where it becomes untenable to keep him, if that were the case. 

The 49'ers still have the leverage of the ollective bargaining agreement. I tender you your option. You don't sign and play and you are back to the same point. Ask Lev Bell how that worked out for him. 

If the reports are true we are sub $28M, the gap likely wasnt big enough to cause that conflict. We need conflict to end this with Aiyuk in black and gold. 

Which reports do you believe? The reports also said that the Steelers and Aiyuk have an agrred upon deal inplace once the trade is signed. The contract $$$ is no issue. 

Remember all of the talks. The Steelers offered a #1 at draft time. They 49'ers bulked. 

Aiyuk and his team are also playing things out publicly. This is the pot calling the kettle black. 

The last thing that I heard Aiyuk say, was that he asked the 49'ers to stop airing their lundry in the media. Since, the speculation has been out and there have been no "true" attributable quotes from anyone really. All has been a rinse and repeat of speculation. What color T-shirt or shorts is Aiyuk wearing to practice. Oh, and he's not actually practicing. San Fran is trying to get all that they can. Aiyuk is trying to get all that he can. The Steelers are trying to get what they can as well. That's business. 

but we do know…because he is still a 49er. Going back to the above, there isn’t enough conflict between him and the 49ers to no longer entertain their offers. He hasn’t said no to the 49ers (yet), he has said no to their deal - and that’s a big difference. 

Good business. Why should he. His mind may be made up. Unlike the AB situation where we had him traded to the Bills and he bulked. We tried to trade him to the 49'ers too. AB raised so much hell, San Fran said no thanks. Definitely, not a one. Aiyuk is being a pro. Let the media and your agent talk. BTW, we haven't heard  from his agent much either. 

At the end of the day this boils down to a pretty simple solution at this stage: the 49ers want Aiyuk. Aiyuk wants the 49ers to pay him. He found a willing partner he would accept as a backup plan to the point that he can now play chicken and wait for the 9ers to flinch. The 49ers have caved in multiple areas but don’t want to cave fully, setting terrible future negotiation precedent. The gap between it all isn’t big enough to create conflict they are both willing to be done with (at this stage). 

So it is speculated. We really don't know this. You eventually have to put a time limit on this stuff for other business. As far as San Fran is concerned, they have until the trade deadline. If Aiyuk doesn't play, then he gets fined and misses out on being a free agent next year .  He ultimately Is the property of the 49ers until they sign a deal or trade him. They are not happy he cost them potential draft capital with the Browns and Pats.  I  think they are taking their time and not making it easy for anyone. That's strictly my opinion.