2019 Offseason Preview/FA Rumors

[Bobby816]

2 minutes ago, ekill08x said:

Yeah I don’t want Ed Oliver at 3. I am a big believer of BPA but we are likely to be gifted with a high end and high potential edge rusher at 3 if we don’t trade down and we want to take the 2nd best IDL? Please be smoke screens, please be fooling us all. I beg of you Mac. Could you imagine if both Bosa and Allen are there (I like Bosa slightly more but would still be so pumped with either) and we effing take Ed Oliver?! Having a great interior on the DL is terrific, but those players are very often available in FA. Edge rushers are not. Do the right thing Mac. DO THE RIGHT THING.

Exactly. Its virtually guaranteed that 1 of Allen or Bosa will be there for us at 3. These are top guys in the draft and 100% not reaches. It makes no sense to me to ignore a need with that high of a pick with a player 100% worthy of the spot for a guy not at a need that's just arguably on the same level. We draft Oliver and I cant wait to hear all the guys pro him complain about still no pass rush off the edge.

[Bobby816]

3 minutes ago, SDotNova said:

All these guys are probably jumping on each other’s rumors. 

Playing devil’s advocate on Oliver. Apparently local scouts said Oliver played closer to 270. He bulked up to 286lbs for the combine. But then was at 281lbs for his pro day. Shouldn’t there be concerns he won’t be able to maintain a weight in the 280’s? 

I know most are disregarding Burns (legit reason btw) because of his weight. Seems like Oliver should have similar concerns. And he is playing a position that is more physical. 

Now Oliver is athletic enough to play edge. But at edge, his athletism is more normal than it is at DT.  

 

As an edge he's just not fast enough. He knows it too (why he didn't run). He's crazy athletic for his size. But not crazy athletic for an edge rusher.

[barnaby8787]

1 minute ago, Bobby816 said:

As an edge he's just not fast enough. He knows it too (why he didn't run). He's crazy athletic for his size. But not crazy athletic for an edge rusher.

LOL. Dude ran between a 4.71 and 4.73 at 281 lbs and had a shuttle time that was faster than most edges in the class, including Josh Allen but he’s not fast enough or athletic enough to play edge?  

[Bobby816]

3 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

LOL. Dude ran between a 4.71 and 4.73 at 281 lbs and had a shuttle time that was faster than most edges in the class, including Josh Allen but he’s not fast enough or athletic enough to play edge?  

Except there's countless film on Allen rushing from the edge and doing it at a high level in the SEC. There's 0 tape of Oliver on the edge rushing. So back to my point... its pretty idiotic to draft a guy at 3 and change his whole position in hopes he can work there (we wasted this with Coples and Sheldon). Just choose the guy who's proven there. Oliver has interior moves not edge moves.

[barnaby8787]

1 minute ago, Bobby816 said:

Except there's countless film on Allen rushing from the edge and doing it at a high level in the SEC. There's 0 tape of Oliver on the edge rushing. So back to my point... its pretty idiotic to draft a guy at 3 and change his whole position in hopes he can work there (we wasted this with Coples and Sheldon). Just choose the guy who's proven there. Oliver has interior moves not edge moves.

That’s a different argument and a fair one. Saying he’s not athletic enough is not. 

[Bobby816]

2 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

That’s a different argument and a fair one. Saying he’s not athletic enough is not. 

I said he's crazy athletic. I said he doesn't have speed for the edge. I never saw his running numbers. Bc he didn't run at the combine.

[barnaby8787]

9 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I said he's crazy athletic. I said he doesn't have speed for the edge. I never saw his running numbers. Bc he didn't run at the combine.

Again, look at his 40 and shuttle time from his pro day. Watch some tape. He’s plenty fast and athletic enough. 

[SDotNova]

10 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

LOL. Dude ran between a 4.71 and 4.73 at 281 lbs and had a shuttle time that was faster than most edges in the class, including Josh Allen but he’s not fast enough or athletic enough to play edge?  

Pro day numbers tend be slightly better than combine numbers. But he also ran those numbers 20lbs heavier than Allen and 15lbs heavier than Bosa. Just because we can’t truly know how to adjust these numbers to make them comparable, I’ll assume those pretty much offset. So if you are thinking of Oliver as this moving chess piece, he may not be able to hold up against NFL guards inside. And he has pretty much the same athleticism as Bosa and Allen. But those guys have shown to be able to get to the QB from the edge. 

There’s just enough question marks on these guys that I’m just going to hold my breath.

[Dr.O]

Oliver and Allen have basically the same flaws except Houston played Oliver out of position.

[barnaby8787]

3 minutes ago, SDotNova said:

Pro day numbers tend be slightly better than combine numbers. But he also ran those numbers 20lbs heavier than Allen and 15lbs heavier than Bosa. Just because we can’t truly know how to adjust these numbers to make them comparable, I’ll assume those pretty much offset. So if you are thinking of Oliver as this moving chess piece, he may not be able to hold up against NFL guards inside. And he has pretty much the same athleticism as Bosa and Allen. But those guys have shown to be able to get to the QB from the edge. 

There’s just enough question marks on these guys that I’m just going to hold my breath.

Why do you think he won’t be able to hold up against guards?  

[SDotNova]

1 minute ago, barnaby8787 said:

Why do you think he won’t be able to hold up against guards?  

It’s a risk. According to local scouts he played at around 270. He did bulk up to 286 but then dropped to 281 for his pro day. We don’t know he can maintain a weight in the 280’s. He’s pretty strong but that’s a lot of weight to give up. Donald maintains a weight in the mid 280’s. 

It’s a concern. My favorite player in this draft also has weight concerns. So I’m not saying this is the be all end all. It’s just something that should be factored in.

[barnaby8787]

Just now, SDotNova said:

It’s a risk. According to local scouts he played at around 270. He did bulk up to 286 but then dropped to 281 for his pro day. We don’t know he can maintain a weight in the 280’s. He’s pretty strong but that’s a lot of weight to give up. Donald maintains a weight in the mid 280’s. 

It’s a concern. My favorite player in this draft also has weight concerns. So I’m not saying this is the be all end all. It’s just something that should be factored in.

He put up 32 reps at 225. I’m not too concerned. I think he’s a movable piece. I’d still prob take Josh Allen over him, but I’d be cool with him. 

[rickyt31]

I like Oliver, but I'm not believing we're going to pick him at #3.He wouldn't be labeled to one position in this defense. DT, DE, 34 OLB, 34 ILB are all possible. His hands are just as good as anyone I've seen in a while. So he wouldn't be a terrible pick. I think we're trying to fool a team like the Raiders or Falcons to move up for him. We do need help on the Dline though.

[rickyt31]

If we traded back for a good deal and drafted Oliver, I could live with that. I wouldn't draft him over Williams and Allen at #3

[jetjuice]

On 4/20/2019 at 1:48 PM, KingOfTheDot said:

If you say Allen is better I’m gonna say I disagree. Why is it when someone doesn’t agree with you dudes they’re wrong when all of this is opinionated. It’s not like I said some far fetched or troll worthy. Oliver is a top ranked prospect and much like 49ers fans are doing with QWill, it’s happening here with Oliver. 

Because you dont say it subjectively, you act like its objective fact which is what I'm getting at here. But agree to disagree, I think Allen is better but I can see both sides so we can just leave it at that.