jrry32 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 minute ago, GSUeagles14 said: what do you think long term future is? would he be playing just for free team clothing? what have we been posting the last two pages... pretty sure these things called stats? no goal post moving here. again, not pretending anything, cant produce where i said he jad an average season although ive asked numerous times. Until you can do that then we camjust agree its only you living in fantasyland where certain games dont exist. this is almost worse than tyler refusing to make an argument for kamara being the best.... FF where if you know your wrong just keep pretending and dodging. I didn't accuse you of saying he had an average season. That's a straw man argument you invented. I accused you of cherry-picking what games count, ignoring the games that didn't support your argument, and then moving the goal-posts when your point got exposed. And Goff's "long-term future in LA" isn't in doubt if they put a "hold" on his "huge contract." He's under contract through 2020. You'd have to argue that they wouldn't extend him. You didn't make that argument because you know it's dumb. You're simply moving the goal-posts when you got caught with your pants down. As for your argument that Goff was an "average QB" over the second half of the season, you didn't preface it with statistically until after I proved you wrong. Your argument fails when you have to look beyond just the pure statistics. That's the danger of context. It's why you quickly backpedaled after you got exposed. FF, where when you know you're wrong, you just keep talking in circles in hopes your opponent will give up and move on. But again, I know your tactics, so I'm not giving you the last word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSUeagles14 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, jrry32 said: I didn't accuse you of saying he had an average season. That's a straw man argument you invented. I accused you of cherry-picking what games count, ignoring the games that didn't support your argument, and then moving the goal-posts when your point got exposed. And Goff's "long-term future in LA" isn't in doubt if they put a "hold" on his "huge contract." He's under contract through 2020. You'd have to argue that they wouldn't extend him. You didn't make that argument because you know it's dumb. You're simply moving the goal-posts when you got caught with your pants down. As for your argument that Goff was an "average QB" over the second half of the season, you didn't preface it with statistically until after I proved you wrong. Your argument fails when you have to look beyond just the pure statistics. That's the danger of context. It's why you quickly backpedaled after you got exposed. FF, where when you know you're wrong, you just keep talking in circles in hopes your opponent will give up and move on. But again, I know your tactics, so I'm not giving you the last word. ahh... theres that fantasy land where your making stuff up in your head again... I never said the 2nd half was more important than the first half. Never said any game wasnt important. Only that he was average in the 2nd half, which is correct. and while i didnt define long term, which i had to explain to you earlier why defining things was important, most reasonable people would consider it longer than two years. im not even sure what your arguing there, but ill gladly let you know long term is longer than two years in my book. so thats two for me and none for you. ill give you the last word now, since its so important to you. You have my permission to post... hop to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 Just now, GSUeagles14 said: ahh... theres that fantasy land where your making stuff up in your head again... I never said the 2nd half was more important than the first half. Never said any game wasnt important. Only that he was average in the 2nd half, which is correct. and while i didnt define long term, which i had to explain to you earlier why defining things was important, most reasonable people would consider it longer than two years. im not even sure what your arguing there, but ill gladly let you know long term is longer than two years in my book. so thats two for me and none for you. ill give you the last word now, since its so important to you. You have my permission to post... hop to. I'm glad I have your permission. You claimed he was an average QB in the second half of the season. You were proven wrong. You backtracked and tried to add a qualifier because that's what you do. You did the same thing with the Goff long-term point. Instead of claiming that the Rams wouldn't hold onto him, you backtracked to the Rams holding off on offering him a "huge contract." Of course, as everybody knows, putting a "hold" on a contract extension means that there's still the possibility of it happening. If you were actually intending to say that the Rams wouldn't stick with him long term, you would have said, "The Rams won't offer him an extension." Again, your language is telling. You start off with concrete statements and then backtrack to qualifiers and equivocations when somebody calls your bluff. Let's be honest, just about every person on this forum knows that when you have a 24 year old QB with back-to-back 100+ passer rating seasons who led his team to a 24-7 record and his offense to averaging 30+ PPG over the past two years, you don't question whether he has a long-term future with his team. Unfortunately, it seems that you are an exception to that rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSUeagles14 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 minute ago, jrry32 said: I'm glad I have your permission. You claimed he was an average QB in the second half of the season. You were proven wrong. You backtracked and tried to add a qualifier because that's what you do. You did the same thing with the Goff long-term point. Instead of claiming that the Rams wouldn't hold onto him, you backtracked to the Rams holding off on offering him a "huge contract." Of course, as everybody knows, putting a "hold" on a contract extension means that there's still the possibility of it happening. If you were actually intending to say that the Rams wouldn't stick with him long term, you would have said, "The Rams won't offer him an extension." Again, your language is telling. You start off with concrete statements and then backtrack to qualifiers and equivocations when somebody calls your bluff. Let's be honest, just about every person on this forum knows that when you have a 24 year old QB with back-to-back 100+ passer rating seasons who led his team to a 24-7 record and his offense to averaging 30+ PPG over the past two years, you don't question whether he has a long-term future with his team. Unfortunately, it seems that you are an exception to that rule. bro, fantasyland aside, he was average in the 2nd half. You havent even really debated that, just wanted to pretend games didnt exist. I dont even know what youre trying to say with the 2nd point, long term to me is pretty clear but but Again, my mistake by not defining long term but also again, most would consider it longer than two years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 minute ago, GSUeagles14 said: bro, fantasyland aside, he was average in the 2nd half. You havent even really debated that, just wanted to pretend games didnt exist. I dont even know what youre trying to say with the 2nd point, long term to me is pretty clear but but Again, my mistake by not defining long term but also again, most would consider it longer than two years. I thought you were done? Yet again, you immediately backtrack after writing something concrete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSUeagles14 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, jrry32 said: I thought you were done? Yet again, you immediately backtrack after writing something concrete. ah, so youve conceded he was average in the 2nd half now that youve moved out of fantasy land? And where do you feel ive backtracked, by admitting that not defining long term was a mistake. If so, do you think long term is two years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, GSUeagles14 said: ah, so youve conceded he was average in the 2nd half now that youve moved out of fantasy land? And where do you feel ive backtracked, by admitting that not defining long term was a mistake. If so, do you think long term is two years? Nah, you're still wrong, but you already said you're done talking yourself in circles. I'm not letting you have the last word. As I said, I know your tactic, and I'm not giving you the satisfaction this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The BILLievers Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 16 hours ago, jrry32 said: My thoughts were that Goff had a disappointing rookie year, but I was still sold on him based on the traits he displayed in college and flashed at times that year despite the terrible circumstances. If Allen were a highly accurate college QB who struggled as a rookie in difficult circumstances in Buffalo, I'd feel differently about him. Instead, he was an inaccurate college QB who has seen his accuracy problems continue in the NFL. Why should I believe that will change? A little unfair - So Goff had a terrible year his rookie season, why did he have a terrible year? Maybe showing his weaknesses that scouts saw from college??? If you don't show improvement on your "weaknesses" from college to year 1 in the NFL that doesn't make you a bust. Especially if you're a QB with completion percentage issues and your OL and WRs suck. Brett Favre 52.4% Southern Miss. 1990 Mark Brunell 52.0% Washington 1993 Kerry Collins 56.3% Penn State 1995 Drew Bledsoe 54.3% Washington State 1993 Brian Griese 59.5% Michigan 1998 Jeff George 58.8% Illinois 1990 Jake Plummer 55.4% Arizona State 1996 Jeff Garcia 56.8% San Jose State 1994 Donovan McNabb 58.4% Syracuse 1999 Neil O’Donnell 58.8% Maryland 1990 Trent Dilfer 59.1% Fresno State 1994 Trent Green 55.8% Indiana 1993 Jake Delhomme 52.6% Louisiana 1997 Matt Hasselbeck 55.6% Boston College 1998 Mike Vick 56.0% Va Tech 2000 Tyrod Taylor 57.2% Va Tech 2011 Colin Kaepenick 58.2% 2011 Matthew Stafford 57.1% Georgia 2009 Josh McCown 51.2% SMU 2002 Carson Palmer 59.1% USC 2003 Kyle Orton 58.8% Purdue 2005 David Garrard 57.0% East Carolina 2002 Jay Cutler 57.2% Vanderbilt 2006 Matt Ryan 59.9% Boston College 2008 Brian Hoyer 55.8% Michigan State 2009 Derek Anderson 50.7% Oregon State 2005 Chad Henne 59.7% Michigan 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The BILLievers Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 Obviously not all of those guys are/were great QBs but if a QB like Josh Allen could just get to 60% with his running ability and big play ability with his arm, the Bills would be more than fine and don't need him completing 65%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 minute ago, The BILLievers said: A little unfair - So Goff had a terrible year his rookie season, why did he have a terrible year? Maybe showing his weaknesses that scouts saw from college??? If you don't show improvement on your "weaknesses" from college to year 1 in the NFL that doesn't make you a bust. Especially if you're a QB with completion percentage issues and your OL and WRs suck. Brett Favre 52.4% Southern Miss. 1990 Mark Brunell 52.0% Washington 1993 Kerry Collins 56.3% Penn State 1995 Drew Bledsoe 54.3% Washington State 1993 Brian Griese 59.5% Michigan 1998 Jeff George 58.8% Illinois 1990 Jake Plummer 55.4% Arizona State 1996 Jeff Garcia 56.8% San Jose State 1994 Donovan McNabb 58.4% Syracuse 1999 Neil O’Donnell 58.8% Maryland 1990 Trent Dilfer 59.1% Fresno State 1994 Trent Green 55.8% Indiana 1993 Jake Delhomme 52.6% Louisiana 1997 Matt Hasselbeck 55.6% Boston College 1998 Mike Vick 56.0% Va Tech 2000 Tyrod Taylor 57.2% Va Tech 2011 Colin Kaepenick 58.2% 2011 Matthew Stafford 57.1% Georgia 2009 Josh McCown 51.2% SMU 2002 Carson Palmer 59.1% USC 2003 Kyle Orton 58.8% Purdue 2005 David Garrard 57.0% East Carolina 2002 Jay Cutler 57.2% Vanderbilt 2006 Matt Ryan 59.9% Boston College 2008 Brian Hoyer 55.8% Michigan State 2009 Derek Anderson 50.7% Oregon State 2005 Chad Henne 59.7% Michigan 2008 He was in a scheme with coaching that made its players look quite bad. See, e.g., Todd Gurley; Nick Foles; Case Keenum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 8 minutes ago, The BILLievers said: Obviously not all of those guys are/were great QBs but if a QB like Josh Allen could just get to 60% with his running ability and big play ability with his arm, the Bills would be more than fine and don't need him completing 65%. It's not really about getting to 60%. It's about how you get to 60%. I'm sure the Bill's can scheme him to 60%, but it's not going to do any good if it's not an efficient 60%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 17 hours ago, jrry32 said: at times that year despite the terrible circumstances. What were the terrible circumstances Goff had this year? Didn't he just lose Cooper Kupp for a portion of the season? I didn't think anything else bad happened to the Rams offense, but I haven't watched a lick of them this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 minute ago, BleedTheClock said: What were the terrible circumstances Goff had this year? Didn't he just lose Cooper Kupp for a portion of the season? I didn't think anything else bad happened to the Rams offense, but I haven't watched a lick of them this year. His circumstances were good/great this year. I was talking about his rookie year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 minute ago, jrry32 said: His circumstances were good/great this year. I was talking about his rookie year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 8 hours ago, jrry32 said: Nah, you're still wrong, but you already said you're done talking yourself in circles. I'm not letting you have the last word. As I said, I know your tactic, and I'm not giving you the satisfaction this time. It wasn't worth all that effort. Next time don't even bother engaging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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