Mike Maccagnan Thread

[jetskid007]

6 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

Since Mac took over, Jets are dead last in players drafted who are still in the league. Given that all of his first rounders are still on the team/in the league, that says he sucks at drafting outside of the first. 

Show me this data. Also, are you simply factoring the number of players drafted or the hit rate per pick. If Macc has the least draft picks of any team since taking over, he can hit on every player and at best be average in this statistic. 

Without context your statement means nothing... 

[barnaby8787]

1 minute ago, jetskid007 said:

Show me this data. Also, are you simply factoring the number of players drafted or the hit rate per pick. If Macc has the least draft picks of any team since taking over, he can hit on every player and at best be average in this statistic. 

Without context your statement means nothing... 

Reliable enough?

https://mobile.twitter.com/Jason_OTC/status/1063063410789793792

[barnaby8787]

5 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

1 & 2) I'm speaking in terms of you saying it was barely better on both counts. You can't argue that his draft class was barely better with the caveat that Idzik had more picks. He had 6 more picks, with one of them being a top 15 pick. Second, I do think Macc's drafts were substantially better. What has Sheldon done since he's left here? I think he was a player who caught fire early, but his flame has faded (like Wilk's did) due to a lack of discipline. 

3) Trumaine's passer rating allowed is 81.6, which is ranked #18 in the NFL. 

They weren’t significantly better. Idzik has the one extra first, but he had three 4th’s and 4 6th rounders. It’s not like he blew all early picks here.

Sheldon was a beast last year in Seattle. Top 10 in QB pressures last year and top 20 in run stops amongst DT’s.  Having a down year this year  

And again, you’re missing the point. Pff is based on their passer rating against. Take the BS INT away and where does he stand?  He’s a really good #2/below average #1 corner who was paid like an elite number 1. 

[jetskid007]

3 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

Reliable enough?

https://mobile.twitter.com/Jason_OTC/status/1063063410789793792

It's not. This is a statement, not the actual data. This doesn't show is how many of the 28 picks selected turned out to be solid players. Also leaves open whether the Jets have the least picks (28) of any team in the league since 2015. 

If the Jets have the least picks in the league over that span, but hit on a higher rate than average, would that make his drafts above average or below average? Yes you can criticize Macc for not getting more picks, but do you penalize for the the few moves that were good short-term, late round pick trades that led to acquiring Brandon Marshall, Ryan Clady, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Henry Anderson? Do you hold it against him for trading two 2nd round picks to move up for Darnold?

I'm not arguing Macc has been good, but this statement is extremely flawed. 

[barnaby8787]

2 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

It's not. This is a statement, not the actual data. This doesn't show is how many of the 28 picks selected turned out to be solid players. Also leaves open whether the Jets have the least picks (28) of any team in the league since 2015. 

If the Jets have the least picks in the league over that span, but hit on a higher rate than average, would that make his drafts above average or below average? Yes you can criticize Macc for not getting more picks, but do you penalize for the the few moves that were good short-term, late round pick trades that led to acquiring Brandon Marshall, Ryan Clady, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Henry Anderson? Do you hold it against him for trading two 2nd round picks to move up for Darnold?

I'm not arguing Macc has been good, but this statement is extremely flawed. 

Likely based off percentage. If you look at Mac’s first draft, 5 of the 6 picks are out of the league right now.  He had bad trades too man. Rashard Robinson trade was horrific. Trading up for Darnold in hindsight was a great move. Nobody discounts that. You have to look at the big picture though. He’s well-below average at drafting. You can agree or disagree but the majority will agree with me. In terms of FA signings, the majority of his higher dollar ones have been busts. Again, you can agree or disagree, but most will agree with me. 

[jetskid007]

8 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

Likely based off percentage. If you look at Mac’s first draft, 5 of the 6 picks are out of the league right now.  He had bad trades too man. Rashard Robinson trade was horrific. Trading up for Darnold in hindsight was a great move. Nobody discounts that. You have to look at the big picture though. He’s well-below average at drafting. You can agree or disagree but the majority will agree with me. In terms of FA signings, the majority of his higher dollar ones have been busts. Again, you can agree or disagree, but most will agree with me. 

Now you're just making an assumption to fit your narrative... ever hear that saying, "when you assume you make an 'a-s-s' out of 'u' and 'me'"?

If you want to prove your point, do the work. Otherwise, what you say is totally irrelevant to me. 

 

And for the record, this isn't a popularity contest for me. Saying that "most will agree with me" doesn't make me feel one way or another. Fans are usually delusional, impulsive, and lack the proper knowledge to have an informed opinion. I never said he's been good at drafting, I said he's right where a rookie GM is expected to be after 4 years, possibly better. The Jets owe it to themselves to let him see things through. 

[barnaby8787]

1 minute ago, jetskid007 said:

Now you're just making an assumption to fit your narrative... ever hear that saying, "when you assume you make an 'a-s-s' out of 'u' and 'me'"?

If you want to prove your point, do the work. Otherwise, what you say is totally irrelevant to me. 

Go ask him what it’s based off of. The guy is extremely reputable. Do you think he just pulled that out of thin air?  I’ll go send him a tweet and see what he says.  If you don’t even want to try and see someone else’s side, I’m just not going to comment on anything you say though because that comment was rude AF. 

[jetskid007]

Just now, barnaby8787 said:

Go ask him what it’s based off of. The guy is extremely reputable. Do you think he just pulled that out of thin air?  I’ll go send him a tweet and see what he says.  If you don’t even want to try and see someone else’s side, I’m just not going to comment on anything you say though because that comment was rude AF. 

Or you can go ask him; I'm not the one making the argument. His statement reads "Since 2015 the Jets rank last in drafted players still in the league and tied for 22nd with players still on their own team." This means total players. If he meant a percentage, he would've said so. Sorry if I'm coming off a little harsh, but you're trying to have an intelligent argument with a lawyer who is trained to pay attention to the details. 

It took me 5 minutes to select 5 random teams and calculate how many picks they've had from 2015-2018. 

• Cleveland: 45
• Minnesota: 37 
• Cincinnati: 38 
• New Orleans: 28
• Dallas: 35 

If you want to do an exercise to prove your point, go open an excel document, copy and past every player drafted by each team in the league over the past 4 years, highlight the ones out of the league in red, then highlight players (1) still on their respective teams in green and (2) still in the NFL but new team in yellow, and tally up each figure per team. Then, calculate those figures against how many draft picks each team had, and you'll come out with a formula. I'm willing to bet you $50 that the Jets % of players still on their team/out of the league compared to the number of draft picks is somewhere among league average (12-20). DM me for my venmo. 

You want to look like a smart guy? Go do your homework.

Otherwise you just look like a smartass with no argument to show for it... 

[KingOfNewYork]

Is this dude defending Macc?

 

[KingOfNewYork]

5 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

Sorry if I'm coming off a little harsh, but you're trying to have an intelligent argument with a lawyer who is trained to pay attention to the details. 

lol

[Rockice_8]

21 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

Since Mac took over, Jets are dead last in players drafted who are still in the league. Given that all of his first rounders are still on the team/in the league, that says he sucks at drafting outside of the first. 

Exactly what I was going to post.  I think he's at like 30% or 33% overall when the league average was like in the high 40's I believe.  It's been months since I've seen that article but his low 30% of players drafted still in the league was among the worst of all GM's.  Totally going off memory on those %'s so I could be off some.

@jetskid007 Sheldon has been pretty solid and basically just as good if not better than Williams not nearly as expensive as Williams is going to be either.  I won't kill Mac though because he was able to move him for value (2nd).  As for Tru #18 isn't good when you are paid like a top 5 CB.  Add to the fact that he isn't matching up with #1 WR's see HOU game where he stayed on his side while Hopkins did his thing.  He has been a pretty big disappointment. 

 

[Rockice_8]

51 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

It's not. This is a statement, not the actual data. This doesn't show is how many of the 28 picks selected turned out to be solid players. Also leaves open whether the Jets have the least picks (28) of any team in the league since 2015. 

If the Jets have the least picks in the league over that span, but hit on a higher rate than average, would that make his drafts above average or below average? Yes you can criticize Macc for not getting more picks, but do you penalize for the the few moves that were good short-term, late round pick trades that led to acquiring Brandon Marshall, Ryan Clady, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Henry Anderson? Do you hold it against him for trading two 2nd round picks to move up for Darnold?

I'm not arguing Macc has been good, but this statement is extremely flawed. 

For someone who claims to pay attention to details didn't he trade three 2nd's?

Yes the B-Marsh, Clady, and Fitz trades were all pretty bad.  For one they were only here for what 2 seasons each at most? And Two it didn't lead to the playoffs so if you are going to trade picks for veterans you better be sure they lead to success.  You could argue that trading for those guys also hurt him by resigning Fitz because we were so close (we really weren't we were just benefiting from the easiest schedule in the league) which lead to another wasted year developing a bad QB in Hack and passing on two great young QB's.

If he would have just gave up on Hack we could have kept those three picks and had Watson or Maholmes and maybe built a better team.

The biggest support for Mac is that he found a possible great young QB.  I am thrilled with that more then anyone until you realize he traded away valuable assets to be in position (not the worst thing), wasted assets other assets like a 2nd taking his first swing a miss (terrible swing it was), passed on other good QB's because he drafted a terrible one very highly, and finally got extremely lucky that said QB fell in his lap (he should be thanking Gettlemen every chance he gets). 

If Sam gets taken at two there is no doubt we'd be screaming for Mac's head probably you included.  I'm sorry but getting terribly lucky isn't what I want out of my GM. 

[barnaby8787]

24 minutes ago, KingOfTheDot said:

Is this dude defending Macc?

 

Yep

[Rockice_8]

Yeah lets let Mac use up this 100M+ on his guys.  Under performing and now an off the field problem?  Clean house on Monday, this is a joke. 

 

Eric Allen‏Verified account @eallenjets now22 seconds ago

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Veteran CB Trumaine Johnson did not practice Wednesday. #Jets HC Todd Bowles said his absence was an in-house matter that the team is dealing with. When asked if Johnson will play Sunday vs. the Patriots, Bowles said, "We'll see." #NYJvsNE

[KingOfNewYork]

I like Bowles, I’ll be honest. However he has to go. 

But Macc has been so damn bad for us that if he’s retained I definitely may just watch from afar.