LionArkie Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: @LionArkie @Louis Friend @Karnage84 @BigC421/ @Sllim Pickens I think we should start to seriously discuss the trade down offer from the Chargers. As it stands: #6, #37 and #112 for #3. This trade could be made with the understanding that, if Tua is taken 1st or 2nd overall, it does not take place. (I imagine that would suit the Chargers as well.) I’d be good with this. Possibly even without the tua clause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigC421/ Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 (edited) That’s not nearly enough in real life, situation obviously is different. Negotiations go a lot slower on a forum than phone calls and all. I would think 6, 37 and next years 2nd would be a starting point. If we’re serious about going the democratic route we should actually have the Tua discussion 1st. I personally think he’s to good to pass and this teams ceiling is far to low even with a perfect draft to justify passing on him. This team isn’t a good draft away from being a legitimate contender. The uncertainty of Decker and Golladay long term also makes the supposed 3 year Stafford window look less appealing. We could lose them both or resign them both either way it brings problems that could hinder ability to improve in the immediate. I think people are overlooking this aspect both guys are right in that range where the open market will likely over pay them. Theres enough talent and resources on this team to rebuild on the fly but not enough to expect to be a top 5 team over the next couple years. Tua changes everything. Passing on him changes nothing. Think about your life as a Lions fan and let that sink in Edited April 2, 2020 by BigC421/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted April 2, 2020 Author Share Posted April 2, 2020 Just now, BigC421/ said: That’s not nearly enough in real life, situation obviously is different. Negotiations go a lot slower on a forum than phone calls and all. I would think 6, 37 and next years 2nd would be a starting point. If we’re serious about going the democratic route we should actually have the Tua discussion 1st. I personally think he’s to good to pass and this teams ceiling is far to low even with a perfect draft to justify passing on him. This team isn’t a good draft away from being a legitimate contender. The uncertainty of Decker and Golladay long term also makes the supposed 3 year Stafford window look less appealing. We could lose them both or resign them both either way it brings problems that could hinder ability to improve in the immediate. I think people are overlooking this aspect both guys are right in that range where the open market will likely over pay them. Theres enough talent and resources on this team to rebuild on the fly but not enough to expect to be a top 5 team over the next couple years. Tus changes everything. Passing on him changes nothing. Think about your life as a Lions fan and let that sink in You don't have to sell me on it: I'm game. If we don't get a trade down, I think we just take Tua and feel good about the future of this franchise. I'm not against requesting next years 2nd, but, for the purposes of FFMD, I think I'd rather just grab the 4th. It allows us to make another pick this year and keeps the value even. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionArkie Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: You don't have to sell me on it: I'm game. If we don't get a trade down, I think we just take Tua and feel good about the future of this franchise. I'm not against requesting next years 2nd, but, for the purposes of FFMD, I think I'd rather just grab the 4th. It allows us to make another pick this year and keeps the value even. I too don’t think it’s enough, but they don’t have the resources and a next year pick does nothing for this exercise. I wouldn’t give up 4 picks to move up 3 spots. This is why I agreed to it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 1 minute ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: You don't have to sell me on it: I'm game. If we don't get a trade down, I think we just take Tua and feel good about the future of this franchise. I'm not against requesting next years 2nd, but, for the purposes of FFMD, I think I'd rather just grab the 4th. It allows us to make another pick this year and keeps the value even. I agree, would rather stay within 2020 draft picks for trading in (open to trading a future 2nd or 3rd if there is a worthy deal). Tua: There's two ways to look at this. Lions, even with Stafford, aren't going to be much better and we're getting our QBOTF. Fair point. No Tua: If that's your position, then a) the Lions will be firing Quinn/Patricia and a new regime is likely going to prefer to draft their own guy and b) next year has Lawrence and Fields. If this is a team that is as bad as people expect, we'll still have a rather high draft pick and begin rebuilding by the trade deadline, etc. Any move like that is a 2-3 year rebuild as the roster has been tailored to a Patriots style defense. I would rather bypass the QB myself unless we plan on moving Stafford this year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionArkie Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 What about drafting tua and trading Stafford this year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: I agree, would rather stay within 2020 draft picks for trading in (open to trading a future 2nd or 3rd if there is a worthy deal). Tua: There's two ways to look at this. Lions, even with Stafford, aren't going to be much better and we're getting our QBOTF. Fair point. No Tua: If that's your position, then a) the Lions will be firing Quinn/Patricia and a new regime is likely going to prefer to draft their own guy and b) next year has Lawrence and Fields. If this is a team that is as bad as people expect, we'll still have a rather high draft pick and begin rebuilding by the trade deadline, etc. Any move like that is a 2-3 year rebuild as the roster has been tailored to a Patriots style defense. I would rather bypass the QB myself unless we plan on moving Stafford this year. We should look at Stafford's trade market. Taking Tua at #3 could be interesting if we can add another 1st or high 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 1 minute ago, LionArkie said: What about drafting tua and trading Stafford this year? Would be interesting for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted April 2, 2020 Author Share Posted April 2, 2020 Just now, LionArkie said: What about drafting tua and trading Stafford this year? Oh boy. It's always an option, although it has been really, really hard to generate discussion on here with other teams. I also like the thought of keeping Stafford here to groom Tua (and to give him a year to fully recover and acclimate to the speed of the NFL). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 Just now, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Oh boy. It's always an option, although it has been really, really hard to generate discussion on here with other teams. I also like the thought of keeping Stafford here to groom Tua (and to give him a year to fully recover and acclimate to the speed of the NFL). We should look at the cap ramifications and then see what adding a veteran like Dalton would cost. I believe his cap hit is roughly $17M but then it'd be a 1 year deal and not sure how much Cincy would end up eating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionArkie Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 1 minute ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Oh boy. It's always an option, although it has been really, really hard to generate discussion on here with other teams. I also like the thought of keeping Stafford here to groom Tua (and to give him a year to fully recover and acclimate to the speed of the NFL). I like that idea, but I really like the idea of tua, ot, og, in this draft for the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionArkie Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 Stafford could give us a stud tackle in the draft for a return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted April 2, 2020 Author Share Posted April 2, 2020 Just now, Karnage84 said: We should look at the cap ramifications and then see what adding a veteran like Dalton would cost. I believe his cap hit is roughly $17M but then it'd be a 1 year deal and not sure how much Cincy would end up eating. We don't really have to worry about cap ramifications for FFMD II. (Of course, we can, just to try and make it as realistic as possible.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 Just for realism, Making Stafford a June 1st trade would leave us with $13M of dead cap and open up $8.3M. Add that to our current $31M for roughly $39.3M of cap space. Dalton would be $17.7M on a one year deal. For basically a similar cap hit of $20M, we're looking at either Stafford or Dalton + a 1st/2nd round pick with Tua as QBOTF. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted April 2, 2020 Author Share Posted April 2, 2020 Very interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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