1.26 - Jordan Love [QB; Utah State] - QB1

[MacReady]

30 minutes ago, smetana34 said:

People was also okay trading Rodgers for Moss back in 2007 too lol

I wasn’t.  

[Rainmaker90]

1 hour ago, pgwingman said:

This made me really excited for life a few years from now. I'd love to hear the scout that said that.

 

Found the article for you . https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/love-led-nation-in-ints-heres-why-to-not-worry
 

I re-read the beginning of this thread. And it really reminded me about all the stupid takes that we heard on this forum from people who talk the loudest. Who continue to think they know everything despite being incredibly wrong about things . I’ll give you 3 instances . 
 

1. The hate towards Aaron Rodgers. Just disgusting and juvenile takes. Far out stuff that would be laughed at. I still don’t think the people who headed the campaign ( they know who they are. ) have admitted how incredibly wrong they were. How they refused to believe that all the circumstances around Aaron had a massive impact on his play. Some compared him to Kirk Cousins 🤣🤣🤣 one said he was the “ 12th best QB in the league right now “ embarrassing.

 

2&3 are similar . Rashan Gary and Jordan Love. The hate on Gary from the beginning and through his rookie year was mind bottling . Just because the online draft community didn’t like him. Same with Jordan Love.

 

Listen, boom or bust it’s pretty simple to understand. Both play premium positions, have all the physical tools you can ask for, immeasurable ceilings and have coaches who RAVE about them. They’re the type of guys that you gamble on . 

[vegas492]

45 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

Found the article for you . https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/love-led-nation-in-ints-heres-why-to-not-worry
 

I re-read the beginning of this thread. And it really reminded me about all the stupid takes that we heard on this forum from people who talk the loudest. Who continue to think they know everything despite being incredibly wrong about things . I’ll give you 3 instances . 
 

1. The hate towards Aaron Rodgers. Just disgusting and juvenile takes. Far out stuff that would be laughed at. I still don’t think the people who headed the campaign ( they know who they are. ) have admitted how incredibly wrong they were. How they refused to believe that all the circumstances around Aaron had a massive impact on his play. Some compared him to Kirk Cousins 🤣🤣🤣 one said he was the “ 12th best QB in the league right now “ embarrassing.

What was disgusting and juvenile about Aaron Rodgers?  What should be laughed at?

That prior to this past year he was playing like a top 10ish QB?  Look at the numbers and the games, he was playing that way.  The trend wasn't getting any better.  And he was doing it with one of the richest contracts in the league.

Many of us were disappointed in his play, many of us knew he was capable of being better.  All he had to do was a few things.

• Buy in to the system completely.
• Work on his mechanics.
• Rely less on his feet and more on his brain and arm.

It expanded to having eyes for more than just Adams.

And I'll include on field body language.

The man has simply done a complete 180 from where he was 2 years ago and for much of last year.

Mechanics are much, much better.  Clearly he's bought into the new system under MLF.  He only extends a few key plays a game, he is not relying on it as the sole method of offense.

Some would say that he still has eyes for only Adams.  And why not.  But what I like is that he seems more forgiving of drops now, like he doesn't shut a guy out for weeks after a drop.

And his on field body language is light year's better.  It looks like he's having fun now.  He's celebrating not only touchdown passes, but also runs.

This is a very, very different QB than we had for the past 3 years, though I do think that he did start to turn things around last year, just not to the extent where he has this year.

I'm unsure how any of that is juvenile.

[vegas492]

2018 stats.

Player A: 425 completions, 606 attempts.  70.1% 4,298 yards.  30 TD.  10 INT.

Player B:  372 completions, 597 attempts.  62.5%.  4,442 yards.  25 TD.  2 INT.

______________________________________________________________________________________

2019 stats.

Player A: 307 completions, 444 attempts.  69.14%.  3603 yards.  26 TD.  6 INT.

Player B:  353 completions, 569 attempts.  62.5%.  4002 yards.  26 TD.  4 INT.

________________________________________________________________________________________

Player A totals over 2 years.  732 completions, 1050 attempts.  69.7%.  7901 yards. 56 TD's. 16 INT.

Player B totals over 2 years.  725 completions, 1166 attempts.  62.17%.  8444 yards.  51 TD's.  6 INT.

 

Player A is Cousins, Player B is Rodgers.

Now let's look at 2020 Rodgers.

372 completions, 526 attempts.  70.72%.  4,299 yards.  48 TD.  5 INT.

One of the sets of stats is not like the others.

Dude literally had 3 less passing TD's in this past season than he had the prior 2 seasons combined.

Increased his completion percentage by 8.6%.  

Clearly he got A LOT better this past year.

[Rainmaker90]

27 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

What was disgusting and juvenile about Aaron Rodgers?  What should be laughed at?

That prior to this past year he was playing like a top 10ish QB?  Look at the numbers and the games, he was playing that way.  The trend wasn't getting any better.  And he was doing it with one of the richest contracts in the league.

Many of us were disappointed in his play, many of us knew he was capable of being better.  All he had to do was a few things.

• Buy in to the system completely.
• Work on his mechanics.
• Rely less on his feet and more on his brain and arm.

It expanded to having eyes for more than just Adams.

And I'll include on field body language.

The man has simply done a complete 180 from where he was 2 years ago and for much of last year.

Mechanics are much, much better.  Clearly he's bought into the new system under MLF.  He only extends a few key plays a game, he is not relying on it as the sole method of offense.

Some would say that he still has eyes for only Adams.  And why not.  But what I like is that he seems more forgiving of drops now, like he doesn't shut a guy out for weeks after a drop.

And his on field body language is light year's better.  It looks like he's having fun now.  He's celebrating not only touchdown passes, but also runs.

This is a very, very different QB than we had for the past 3 years, though I do think that he did start to turn things around last year, just not to the extent where he has this year.

I'm unsure how any of that is juvenile.

Go look at what was said. Reading your post , you have bought the spin of it. 
 

He didn’t not buy in last year. It was a brand new system that took time . 
 

Aaron Rodgers never stopped being one of the best QBs in the game . Unfortunately he had a coach that refused to adapt and young/inexperienced players to throw to or over the hill players like Jimmy Graham to rely on

[Rainmaker90]

16 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

2018 stats.

Player A: 425 completions, 606 attempts.  70.1% 4,298 yards.  30 TD.  10 INT.

Player B:  372 completions, 597 attempts.  62.5%.  4,442 yards.  25 TD.  2 INT.

______________________________________________________________________________________

2019 stats.

Player A: 307 completions, 444 attempts.  69.14%.  3603 yards.  26 TD.  6 INT.

Player B:  353 completions, 569 attempts.  62.5%.  4002 yards.  26 TD.  4 INT.

________________________________________________________________________________________

Player A totals over 2 years.  732 completions, 1050 attempts.  69.7%.  7901 yards. 56 TD's. 16 INT.

Player B totals over 2 years.  725 completions, 1166 attempts.  62.17%.  8444 yards.  51 TD's.  6 INT.

 

Player A is Cousins, Player B is Rodgers.

Now let's look at 2020 Rodgers.

372 completions, 526 attempts.  70.72%.  4,299 yards.  48 TD.  5 INT.

One of the sets of stats is not like the others.

Dude literally had 3 less passing TD's in this past season than he had the prior 2 seasons combined.

Increased his completion percentage by 8.6%.  

Clearly he got A LOT better this past year.

Stats without context doesn’t really mean much to me . If you thought at any point Cousins was as good as Rodgers then again, I don’t know what to tell you. 

[pgwingman]

1 hour ago, Rainmaker90 said:

Found the article for you . https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/love-led-nation-in-ints-heres-why-to-not-worry
 

I re-read the beginning of this thread. And it really reminded me about all the stupid takes that we heard on this forum from people who talk the loudest. Who continue to think they know everything despite being incredibly wrong about things . I’ll give you 3 instances . 
 

1. The hate towards Aaron Rodgers. Just disgusting and juvenile takes. Far out stuff that would be laughed at. I still don’t think the people who headed the campaign ( they know who they are. ) have admitted how incredibly wrong they were. How they refused to believe that all the circumstances around Aaron had a massive impact on his play. Some compared him to Kirk Cousins 🤣🤣🤣 one said he was the “ 12th best QB in the league right now “ embarrassing.

 

2&3 are similar . Rashan Gary and Jordan Love. The hate on Gary from the beginning and through his rookie year was mind bottling . Just because the online draft community didn’t like him. Same with Jordan Love.

 

Listen, boom or bust it’s pretty simple to understand. Both play premium positions, have all the physical tools you can ask for, immeasurable ceilings and have coaches who RAVE about them. They’re the type of guys that you gamble on . 

Thanks for posting. I really hope Gute has painted us into an "embarrassment of riches" by finding another special franchise QB.

I don't think the criticism of Rodgers was unjustified, he's clearly having the best year of his career, which adds even more pressure on Gute to know what he has before pulling the trigger and moving on.

[vegas492]

6 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

Go look at what was said. Reading your post , you have bought the spin of it. 
 

He didn’t not buy in last year. It was a brand new system that took time . 
 

Aaron Rodgers never stopped being one of the best QBs in the game . Unfortunately he had a coach that refused to adapt and young/inexperienced players to throw to or over the hill players like Jimmy Graham to rely on

I get where you are going, but then we have to look at his last few years with Mac.

His mechanics were not as good then, as they were this year.

Nor was his body language.

I think it is very fair to admit that Rodgers wasn't playing to his potential for the past 2,3 or maybe 4 years.  And many of us knew he had it in him to be better.

This year, he worked on that core.  Got better fundamentals and as you said, really bought into the offense.  And it's been amazing.

I think it is what every one of us wanted, and knew we could get, despite not seeing it for years.

Personally, I wanted Rodgers to play the position with his brain and not his legs.  I wanted him to show leadership on the field and lead by example.  (Again, body language)  Dude has done all of that and then some this year.

He keeps training in the off-season like he did this year and this Aaron Rodgers can play at this levels for many years to come.

That wasn't what I thought even a year ago.  He changed my mind about everything this year.

Credit to Rodgers.  Credit to MLF.  Credit to the front office for finding MLF.

Guess I think it is okay to admit that he wasn't on a good career arc for the past few years and that he drastically turned that around this year.

[Rainmaker90]

6 minutes ago, pgwingman said:

Thanks for posting. I really hope Gute has painted us into an "embarrassment of riches" by finding another special franchise QB.

I don't think the criticism of Rodgers was unjustified, he's clearly having the best year of his career, which adds even more pressure on Gute to know what he has before pulling the trigger and moving on.

People were practically begging him to be traded. Making it seem it was all his fault. 
 

People continue to hold him to excellence . And when he wasn’t the last two years, people wanted him out. Truth is, it wouldn’t shock me if this was his final MVP type year, he’s what 37-38 years old? Father Time will eventually set in. Next year he may just be above average. Whenever he has the slightest decline, people will be calling for Love. 

[vegas492]

10 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

Stats without context doesn’t really mean much to me . If you thought at any point Cousins was as good as Rodgers then again, I don’t know what to tell you. 

How much more context do you need?  Look at the stats, both play in the division.  Common opponents.  

I'd say he was closer to #10 overall than he was #1.

The point is and was...Rodgers was playing at a Cousins like level.  (If you think Cousins is a top 10ish QB) And we knew he was much, much better.  Has or had a whole lot more talent.  It just wasn't being shown on the field back then.

That sure as heck changed this year.

 

[Rainmaker90]

3 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

I get where you are going, but then we have to look at his last few years with Mac.

His mechanics were not as good then, as they were this year.

Nor was his body language.

I think it is very fair to admit that Rodgers wasn't playing to his potential for the past 2,3 or maybe 4 years.  And many of us knew he had it in him to be better.

This year, he worked on that core.  Got better fundamentals and as you said, really bought into the offense.  And it's been amazing.

I think it is what every one of us wanted, and knew we could get, despite not seeing it for years.

Personally, I wanted Rodgers to play the position with his brain and not his legs.  I wanted him to show leadership on the field and lead by example.  (Again, body language)  Dude has done all of that and then some this year.

He keeps training in the off-season like he did this year and this Aaron Rodgers can play at this levels for many years to come.

That wasn't what I thought even a year ago.  He changed my mind about everything this year.

Credit to Rodgers.  Credit to MLF.  Credit to the front office for finding MLF.

Guess I think it is okay to admit that he wasn't on a good career arc for the past few years and that he drastically turned that around this year.

I def agree with you in those two counts . I HATED him sulking on the sidelines . And he certainly was more undisciplined mechanics wise . I’m not freeing him of all blame at all. I just believe he was put in a position where he couldn’t be the Aaron Rodgers we wanted him to be more so. 

[vegas492]

2 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

People were practically begging him to be traded. Making it seem it was all his fault. 
 

People continue to hold him to excellence . And when he wasn’t the last two years, people wanted him out. Truth is, it wouldn’t shock me if this was his final MVP type year, he’s what 37-38 years old? Father Time will eventually set in. Next year he may just be above average. Whenever he has the slightest decline, people will be calling for Love. 

Who was begging for him to be traded?  Many of us looked at his contract and when there was a decent "out".

Having a QB under a rookie deal is a great advantage in the NFL.  It was very natural to see when Rodgers could be traded so GB could gain that advantage.

And that was all contingent on him continuing on his, then, current career arc.  An arc that he completely smashed this year.

I've seen many posts from the same people who were looking at the right time to trade Rodgers now say that if he plays like this, it ain't ever going to happen.

It is okay to be critical of the past Rodgers, while praising the present Rodgers and believing that this is the QB we will see for the next few years.

[vegas492]

7 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

I def agree with you in those two counts . I HATED him sulking on the sidelines . And he certainly was more undisciplined mechanics wise . I’m not freeing him of all blame at all. I just believe he was put in a position where he couldn’t be the Aaron Rodgers we wanted him to be more so. 

I'm putting words in your mouth now, I apologize for that.

But are you saying that Mac's system wasn't going to allow for him to be a dominating force any longer?  (Because if so, I agree with you.)

And are you saying that MLF's system does?  (Because if so, I agree with you.)

Now is when it gets "grey".  Last year was also a MLF system.  Rodgers was still trying to extend too many plays.  He would give up on guys if they dropped a pass.  He wasn't celebrating TD runs that iced games.  He was pretty awful throwing deep.

I thought all of that was on Rodgers.  I was wrong.  Rodgers/MLF and others have come out and said that the offense last year was a hybrid offense put in to keep a little continuity.  This year?  It's all MLF's scheme.  Rodgers is "in" 100%.

I expect that to move forward next year with more MLF stuff.  

Edited January 20, 2021 by vegas492

[Rainmaker90]

7 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

I'm putting words in your mouth now, I apologize for that.

But are you saying that Mac's system wasn't going to allow for him to be a dominating force any longer?  (Because if so, I agree with you.)

And are you saying that MLF's system does?  (Because if so, I agree with you.)

Now is when it gets "grey".  Last year was also a MLF system.  Rodgers was still trying to extend too many plays.  He would give up on guys if they dropped a pass.  He wasn't celebrating TD runs that iced games.  He was pretty awful throwing deep.

I thought all of that was on Rodgers.  I was wrong.  Rodgers/MLF and others have come out and said that the offense last year was a hybrid offense put in to keep a little continuity.  This year?  It's all MLF's scheme.  Rodgers is "in" 100%.

I expect that to move forward next year with more MLF stuff.  

I agree with all of what is said here. I’m also not giving Rodgers all of the credit for his historic season. This system is very QB friendly . 

 

A lot wanted him traded. The Aaron Rodgers Depreciation thread has to be somewhere 

[vegas492]

22 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

I agree with all of what is said here. I’m also not giving Rodgers all of the credit for his historic season. This system is very QB friendly . 

 

A lot wanted him traded. The Aaron Rodgers Depreciation thread has to be somewhere 

Ah.  I am going to give all the credit to Rodgers.  He had to buy into the process, which included off season training.  MLF had a lot to do with it, no doubt.   But really, Aaron should rightfully be celebrated for what he did this season and for what he will continue to do in the playoffs.

The thread is out there.  Maybe I'll browse it again some time.  I know I'm on there saying that Rodgers won't simply "turn it around" because he hasn't for the past few years.  I'm pretty happy to eat that crow!  He proved me wrong.

And for those that wanted him traded....what if you were given 2 first round picks, after next year, for Rodgers?