BDL Discussion Thread 2022

[WFLukic]

21 minutes ago, Ragnarok said:

Last year, Buffalo played the Jets, Dolphins, and Pats twice.  They were all bad teams.  They also played the Broncos, 49ers, Raiders, Cardinals, and Chargers, none of whom made the playoffs.  The Steelers after they fell off the cliff.

Rams, Titans, Chiefs, Seahawks were the 4 playoff teams they faced and they went 2-2.

So let's not act like the Bills had some tough 2020 schedule.

Yep the 10-6 Dolphins were a "bad team". Of course all the teams with .500 records must suck too. Beating up on 4-12 and 5-11 teams are the true mark of an elite QB. 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/draft/2021/01/03/nfl-draft-2021-first-round-order-after-week-17/4123737001/

Buffalo SOS - .512 (only playoff team who had an SOS above .500, 10th highest in the league - majority of whom had a harder schedule were picking in the top 5/10)
Green Bay SOS - .428 (easiest in the league, next highest being Indianapolis at .443).

So you are factually incorrect (as usual). Buffalo had the hardest schedule of any team that made the playoffs. Green Bay had the easiest in the league. 

 

 

[MD4L]

1 hour ago, Blue said:

No, he was garbage for his first two years and was quite obviously coached up to the player he is today (which is still not the league MVP caliber player you and other people try to claim he is).

It’s fair to ask if we’re even watching the same game at this point.

[Ragnarok]

Just now, WFLukic said:

Yep the 10-6 Dolphins were a "bad team". Of course all the teams with .500 records must suck too. Beating up on 4-12 and 5-11 teams are the true mark of an elite QB. 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/draft/2021/01/03/nfl-draft-2021-first-round-order-after-week-17/4123737001/

Buffalo SOS - .512 (only playoff team who had an SOS above .500, 10th highest in the league - majority of whom had a harder schedule were picking in the top 5/10)
Green Bay SOS - .428 (easiest in the league, next highest being Indianapolis at .443).

So you are factually incorrect (as usual). Buffalo had the hardest schedule of any team that made the playoffs. Green Bay had the easiest in the league. 

Never said GB didn't have a pretty easy schedule in 2020.  

Blah blah blah...loking at the Bills schedule in 2020, and those teams just weren't very good.  The dolphins also got to beat up on the Jets and worst Pats team in two decades.  So thats inflated.

[MD4L]

Not a biggest fan of the rational being used here on both sides but I’ll chime in to say Lukic’s points about Josh Allen definitively beat the counterpoints against him.

Edited February 8, 2022 by MD4L

[Ragnarok]

I am one of those guys who thinks Josh Allen is at worst a top 5 QB.

But their schedule in 2020 was meh.

[Jlash]

Uh oh. Dougie P doing that thing again where he hires a very underwhelming staff.

[Jlash]

I believe that most playoff teams opponents records, on average, are below .500 so I think it's fair to look at that one way or the other to justify anything.

[MD4L]

1 hour ago, Jlash said:

Uh oh. Dougie P doing that thing again where he hires a very underwhelming staff.

I see what you’re saying. 

[Scoundrel]

Just a reminder I am willing to move down from 1.9. We can do a trade now or work out agreed compensation if your guy is there during the draft if we decide the move is beneficial for both parties. 

[Jlash]

Heading out somewhere else to get my car appraised by a different place. I'm ready to be hurt again first thing in the am.

[MWil23]

26 minutes ago, Jlash said:

Heading out somewhere else to get my car appraised by a different place. I'm ready to be hurt again first thing in the am.

[MWil23]

Here's my honest take on Josh Allen:

Year 1: Raw, not very good, probably the most simple playbook I've ever seen a rookie QB have

Year 2: Major improvement with an extremely simple playbook. Improved but still bad accuracy numbers, an incredible amount of fumbles, but a lot more efficient with TD to INT ratio

Year 3: Everything clicked. A bit more of a complex playbook but an acquisition in Diggs, with an increasingly more difficult playbook

Year 4: 85% of the offense runs through him with a guy who got better every week

You know what also helped Allen? Coaching continuity and largely the same coaches/coordinators/scheme. It's IMPOSSIBLE to know what he'd be if he were in another position, because you can't apply progression in a vacuum assuming that x/y/z happens anywhere else.

For example, while Baker Mayfield probably always is an average NFL QB no matter where he is, he had 4 different head coaches, coordinators, and schemes in 20 months. The same scheme argument could be said for guys like Alex Smith, Marcus Mariota, etc. 

Meanwhile, you have guys like Rodgers, Brady, Mahomes, Allen, Lamar Jackson, Burrow, etc. that have had multiple years of continuity and almost the same scheme(s) throughout their careers (minus Brady going to Tampa and Rodgers switching over under LaFleur).

IMO this was the biggest indictment of guys like Goff and Wentz who massively plateaued or regressed under their offensive guru coaches and scheme continuity. I suppose you could make a "Frank Reich" argument for Wentz, but that's tough to sell me for a lot of reasons.

Not only did Mayfield and Darnold get drafted to dumpster fire teams from a surrounding talent standpoint, the revolving doors and lack of continuity in the front office and coaching positions set them up for failure. Perhaps they bust regardless, but going to playoff teams (Allen in Buffalo, Lamar on a good Ravens squad) and having organizational stability set them up for patience and success and allowed them to develop and refine their skills.

MAYBE Josh Allen overcomes that in Cleveland or Denver, or maybe he gets absolutely abused behind those offensive lines and chewed up by a daunting AFC North and AFC West schedule and ends up getting gun-shy and never succeeding from the pocket because of bad habits he has to develop in order to just survive.

[MWil23]

Oooof Kamara and his entourage beat that guy down bigtime, and Kamara threw 8+ punches and 3+ while he was defenseless on the ground. Some dude stomped him 16+ times and the video shows that Kamara's claim of him "running" was wrong. He might do some legit time. They broke that guy's orbital bone and knocked him unconscious.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33238563/police-report-video-evidence-supports-allegations-new-orleans-saints-rb-alvin-kamara

Quote

 

Video surveillance shows New Orleans Saints running back Alvin Kamara punching a man approximately eight times before Kamara's associates proceeded to stomp on him several more times on the ground in a Las Vegas casino Saturday morning, according to the police report from the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department.

Kamara was later taken into custody inside Las Vegas' Allegiant Stadium on Sunday evening after he played in the Pro Bowl. He was interviewed by police and then arrested and charged with battery resulting in substantial bodily harm and booked at the Clark County Detention Center. Kamara was released after posting bail later Sunday night.

The man, who was knocked unconscious, sustained an orbital fracture to his right eye, among other injuries, according to the police report.

 

 

[MWil23]

4 hours ago, MWil23 said:

Here's my honest take on Josh Allen:

Year 1: Raw, not very good, probably the most simple playbook I've ever seen a rookie QB have

Year 2: Major improvement with an extremely simple playbook. Improved but still bad accuracy numbers, an incredible amount of fumbles, but a lot more efficient with TD to INT ratio

Year 3: Everything clicked. A bit more of a complex playbook but an acquisition in Diggs, with an increasingly more difficult playbook

Year 4: 85% of the offense runs through him with a guy who got better every week

You know what also helped Allen? Coaching continuity and largely the same coaches/coordinators/scheme. It's IMPOSSIBLE to know what he'd be if he were in another position, because you can't apply progression in a vacuum assuming that x/y/z happens anywhere else.

For example, while Baker Mayfield probably always is an average NFL QB no matter where he is, he had 4 different head coaches, coordinators, and schemes in 20 months. The same scheme argument could be said for guys like Alex Smith, Marcus Mariota, etc. 

Meanwhile, you have guys like Rodgers, Brady, Mahomes, Allen, Lamar Jackson, Burrow, etc. that have had multiple years of continuity and almost the same scheme(s) throughout their careers (minus Brady going to Tampa and Rodgers switching over under LaFleur).

IMO this was the biggest indictment of guys like Goff and Wentz who massively plateaued or regressed under their offensive guru coaches and scheme continuity. I suppose you could make a "Frank Reich" argument for Wentz, but that's tough to sell me for a lot of reasons.

Not only did Mayfield and Darnold get drafted to dumpster fire teams from a surrounding talent standpoint, the revolving doors and lack of continuity in the front office and coaching positions set them up for failure. Perhaps they bust regardless, but going to playoff teams (Allen in Buffalo, Lamar on a good Ravens squad) and having organizational stability set them up for patience and success and allowed them to develop and refine their skills.

MAYBE Josh Allen overcomes that in Cleveland or Denver, or maybe he gets absolutely abused behind those offensive lines and chewed up by a daunting AFC North and AFC West schedule and ends up getting gun-shy and never succeeding from the pocket because of bad habits he has to develop in order to just survive.

 

4 hours ago, MWil23 said:

Oooof Kamara and his entourage beat that guy down bigtime, and Kamara threw 8+ punches and 3+ while he was defenseless on the ground. Some dude stomped him 16+ times and the video shows that Kamara's claim of him "running" was wrong. He might do some legit time. They broke that guy's orbital bone and knocked him unconscious.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33238563/police-report-video-evidence-supports-allegations-new-orleans-saints-rb-alvin-kamara

 

[Ragnarok]

51 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

 

Didn't I already make that joke?