warfelg Posted May 30 Author Share Posted May 30 1 minute ago, MOSteelers56 said: I’m not too upset about the Daniels news. I think OG is pretty easy to replace. I’m also not infatuated with Daniels. I think he’s much better on paper. He never really wows me. If I’m paying top dollar for a G, he better be caving in DL’s and banishing second level defenders into the shadow realm. Nothing wrong with lighting a fire under him either. Let him play for a new contract. Plus, if he and Najee go elsewhere we could be in on some comp picks. 100%. Would I feel good if he were extended? Sure. But I’m also glad we aren’t operating it like that. Catch-up up on old Locked Ons and a good point was made: almost the entire offense is on a one year prove it deal. If it works, great we have the ability to keep you. If not we can move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warfelg Posted May 30 Author Share Posted May 30 10 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said: Makes sense. The only thing I don’t like about it is messing with continuity, but I trust the new regime. I think I care more about Jones-Frazier-Fautanu than others. If they becomes the 3 studs you can plug in guards easily IMO. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcash4 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 (edited) 25 minutes ago, warfelg said: If they become the 3 studs you can plug in guards easily IMO Not only is "if" part of the iceberg size question but also the matter of when. I don't think there is anyone who doesn't care about that triple team, but I would also think we would want them to be in the best position for development before ripping off the guardrails. Playing alongside vets Seumalo and Daniels another 2 years could be massive in terms of those guys development -- and A LOT is hinging on that development for this team. This is where I am going back to the "acting like a team against the cap". If we had $30M in cap space instead of $100M, making this decision to open a roster spot you believe you can replace for financial reasons is simple. But we are not in that position. We are talking the difference between spending 30-60% of the cap availability vs 9-18%, depending on how you wanna spend it. Until we reach a space where we need to start nickle and diming the roster, I am not sure why we are doing so. It's a search for roster perfection, IMO, in a league that's driven by imperfection. The decision to maintain a solid starter at age 27, keep continuity at a major unit, attribute to the development of our biggest draft investments, and allow us to skip the position group entirely for a season on a team that has other premier positional needs all has extreme value to me. I am very surprised they shut it down before it could even get started. They better have a rock solid plan for spending the money. Edited May 30 by Dcash4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warfelg Posted May 30 Author Share Posted May 30 Damn that Waddle extension is going to have major impacts for so many WRs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rivers Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, warfelg said: If I were Daniels agent I’d be targeting Robert Hunts or Chris Lindstrom real regardless of the fact it’s with the Panthers and Falcons. maybe he already is and the reason they aren't talking a new deal 1 hour ago, warfelg said: This is where my mind goes. Set the OL then worry about everything else because a good OL can just elevate so many other positions so easily. and it also helps the run game and keeps the defence fresh so we don't see as much of that dreaded 2nd string DL in the rotation 57 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said: I’m not too upset about the Daniels news. I think OG is pretty easy to replace. I’m also not infatuated with Daniels. I think he’s much better on paper. He never really wows me. If I’m paying top dollar for a G, he better be caving in DL’s and banishing second level defenders into the shadow realm. Nothing wrong with lighting a fire under him either. Let him play for a new contract. Plus, if he and Najee go elsewhere we could be in on some comp picks. what would they get if Daniels leaves via UFA? If they make a trade, I would hope it's for a round earlier anyways, if not, then keep him for the rest of this year anyways 55 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said: Makes sense. The only thing I don’t like about it is messing with continuity, but I trust the new regime. whats the UFA class like next year? Iwas thinking DL in RD1 and maybe RD2 or 3 but maybe OL still in RD1 next year for the best OG? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFF Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 3 hours ago, warfelg said: Who’s saying they’re against extending young solid starters? Youre literally saying by agreeing with it. This isn’t a team up against the cap…they’ll have roughly $90-$100 mill next offseason unless they do an extension or acquire someone of decent consequence….plus that’s not counting the roughly $10-12 mill of possible rollover from the thisnyears cap after the rookie contracts are signed. You talk of building up the OL when talking with Skywalker but then you don’t want to pay market price for one. Flexibility is great and all but after building up a position group, why would you allow a piece to get away…especially with one where they’re going to have 2 very young players at center and RT near that season vet in Daniels. Again…this isn’t a decline phase Cam Heyward at 35(who you want extended) or even a 1 year starter…this is a soon to be 27 year old proven solid to upper tier OG…counting on a 3rd rounder to automatically replace him is roll of the dice at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFF Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 Possible needs next year in no order… QB…WR2 and/or WR3…TE1…RG…RB…at least 2 DL(some combo of Heyward/Ogunjobi/Loudermilk/Leal/Lee gone)…ILB(Roberts FA and Holcomb health)…CB2 and/or slot…SS(depth at least and is Elliot good enough). Theyre going to have to spend some $$$ in FA next offseason…I would lock in RB and RG with Harris option and Daniels new deal at roughly combined 2025 cap hit of $18 mill but oh well. Hell let’s even say they give Fields a Love type extension and say 2025 is his chance and they draft … 1st)DL 2nd)RB 3rd)DL Thats still a lot of issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warfelg Posted May 30 Author Share Posted May 30 16 minutes ago, AFF said: Youre literally saying by agreeing with it. By agreeing to what exactly? That the reasons dcash said make sense? Care to quote where I directly said I’m for it rather than inferring what you want to infer? Just because I’ve agreed with the reasons posters apply logic to the situation doesn’t mean I think it’s a good idea not to extend him. Just because I agree to not overpay doesn’t mean I’m against extending him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSteelers56 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, Dcash4 said: Playing alongside vets Seumalo and Daniels another 2 years could be massive in terms of those guys development -- and A LOT is hinging on that development for this team. We also don't know what kind of teammate Daniels is. I've read a lot about Seumalo being a good locker room guy, but there's nothing saying Daniels is helping the development of our guys. I've not heard anything either way about him. I'm just speculating. Next year Jones will be going into his 3rd year in the league. Fautanu is supposed to be an advanced guy. So are Frazier and McCormick. Nate Herbig also looked a lot better in his second starting stint with us. The team seems to be high on Anderson. I think we're actually in a decent spot depth wise. I understand your point and see the validity to it. I'm ok on Daniels, I'd love to have him here long term. I still think he's got a little more meat on the bone in terms of talent. I just don't think it's a massive deal if he isn't. We might be looking at going big on FA at premier positions, while trying to keep positions like S, RB, OG affordable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSteelers56 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 58 minutes ago, 3rivers said: what would they get if Daniels leaves via UFA? Probably a lot. I'm not an expert on cap, though. We signed him to a pretty hefty deal when we brought him in and he hasn't done anything to make himself less money, plus the guard market is pretty hot. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSteelers56 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, 3rivers said: whats the UFA class like next year? Iwas thinking DL in RD1 and maybe RD2 or 3 but maybe OL still in RD1 next year for the best OG? I'm not really sure. It's hard to tell who is and isn't going to get a deal. We're one of the few teams that don't normally do contracts during the season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warfelg Posted May 30 Author Share Posted May 30 20 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said: Next year Jones will be going into his 3rd year in the league. Jones’s comments after Tuesdays workout sounded like a 10 year vet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcash4 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 33 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said: We also don't know what kind of teammate Daniels is. I've read a lot about Seumalo being a good locker room guy, but there's nothing saying Daniels is helping the development of our guys. I've not heard anything either way about him. I'm just speculating. This is fair, but I am also not talking about their hands on assistance with development of the young guys. There's value in not having to worry about what the guy is doing next to you so you can concentrate on yourself. Also value in coaches not having to worry about Daniels/Seumalu to the point where they can commit fully to the development of the young guys. Jones's flip flopping also has me very nervous about his development already. 35 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said: We might be looking at going big on FA at premier positions, while trying to keep positions like S, RB, OG affordable. I just don't understand the bold when we are not in a position to need savings. I understand those decisions for a team against the number, but not for one looking at 9 digit cap space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skywlker32 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 The cap space looks like a lot right now, but if you have to extend Pickens and/or sign another WR along with sign a QB to upper middle starting money, that cap number gets eaten up real quickly. ~65M per year for a QB and starting WR... we currently are paying those positions 11.9M (top 6 WR and top 2 QB). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcash4 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 45 minutes ago, skywlker32 said: The cap space looks like a lot right now, but if you have to extend Pickens and/or sign another WR along with sign a QB to upper middle starting money, that cap number gets eaten up real quickly. ~65M per year for a QB and starting WR... we currently are paying those positions 11.9M (top 6 WR and top 2 QB). You are right, but that goes to our cap flexibility. We can do whatever it is we want to do right now. Take Goffs $55M per contract as a guide to Dak. Year 1 of new money is a $32M hit for Jared. Prescott could get $60M with a year one hit if $30-35, which assumes he signs for half guaranteed and doesn’t add any void years (which I loath). Sign Aiyuk and get a $30M deal for a 2025 hit of $15M. The two biggest FAs on market and you could get them for a 2025 cap of $50M. So we get Dak and Aiyuk…what do you wanna do with the other $50M? So that’s where I am with daniels. If that scenario above happens and all of a sudden in 2026 we could use cap space, cut the guard to better fit the budget. But we aren’t there. We are a looooong way off of there. So I don’t understand acting like we are. To quote the greatest sports movie ever, the Pirates of the Carribean: “they are more guidelines than rules”. Right now we are not in a mode where the good “guideline” of not paying guards or RBs need to exist. We should be stacking as much team wide talent as possible to continue expanding that talent search in the areas that need it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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