Jeremy408 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 34 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: I don't have issues with Zeigler at all. We aren't talentless. We had some holes to fill. We filled some and some still need to get plugged. We've made good roster moves, imo. What's wrong is a coaching/scheming issue. That's all on McDaniels and Graham, both of whom are proven failures. Again, they didn't make moves like the roster didn't already have talent. That's for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 11 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said: Adams is not a good evaluator of talent and will never be a good GM. That is not a strong attribute of his 🤣 Neither is Mcdaniels/Ziegler apparently Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie2Gunz Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 2 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: Nope, they probably gel well. I figured McDaniels would be a failure because he was already a failure lol. Ditto for Graham. Zeigler may well be a fantastic GM as far as contracts and roster building goes. But he's not so good that we should be giving McDaniels free outs in fear of Zeigler walking too. I still feel like they have a long term game plan and need to get their type of players in place for it to be executed properly. They both inherited a team devoid of talent, especially younger talent to build around. the lack of young talent was because of the disaster known as Grudock and all of their failed draft picks and FA signings. JM/DZ were hamstrung inheriting a roster that is a dumpster fire overall and they tried to put lipstick on a pig by signing players to "win now" when this roster was not close to winning now. Any fan that really believed this team had a chance to contend for a SB birth was dillusional. I am not making excuses for JM as he has coached this team poorly and has looked outclassed multiple weeks now. The shutout today is unacceptable and is on JM. This could be the catalyst for the team completely giving up on the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 3 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said: I don't get this O scheme at all. We fail to exploit matchup mismatches. It's absolutely atrocious that's for certain. This far into the season and we're still running plays that have never worked. No exploiting mismatches. The list of issues goes on and on. And ya know, I get that offenses can be complicated. But of it's so damn complicated that guys aren't getting it half way through a season, then it's the scheme that's a problem. Judging by what we've seen, what's so complicated? The totally unnecessary trick plays where we toss the ball 3 times only to toss it back to Carr to throw? The blocking on poorly designed end arounds? Routes that hardly ever open anything up? It seems like it's just outright bad on the most fundamental of levels. Even when we've seen it look good (against terrible opponents), it's looked stilted and like everything is stuck in mud. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 7 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said: Offensive guru w/ 6 rings to prove it best play caller Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 1 minute ago, ronjon1990 said: It's absolutely atrocious that's for certain. This far into the season and we're still running plays that have never worked. No exploiting mismatches. The list of issues goes on and on. And ya know, I get that offenses can be complicated. But of it's so damn complicated that guys aren't getting it half way through a season, then it's the scheme that's a problem. Judging by what we've seen, what's so complicated? The totally unnecessary trick plays where we toss the ball 3 times only to toss it back to Carr to throw? The blocking on poorly designed end arounds? Routes that hardly ever open anything up? It seems like it's just outright bad on the most fundamental of levels. Even when we've seen it look good (against terrible opponents), it's looked stilted and like everything is stuck in mud. Worked for Brady Edelman and Gronk. Our guys just aren't talented enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 We have to learn how to win still seriously I wonder if he gets year 2 if we tank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie2Gunz Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 Just now, Jeremy408 said: Neither is Mcdaniels/Ziegler apparently I understand what they did when they came in here. No one wants to hear that a team is rebuilding and the last thing I would expect is for a new HC/GM to come in and state this. I do believe they made moves during the offseason in hopes they could contend for a playoff spot and not be a complete disaster. Would I have traded for Adams and signed Jones knowing how bad our talent level was... I would not and stated this many times. Those moves have not paid off and I would have rather went with my philosophy of looking for good young talent in the FA market as opposed to signing "splash" players in the twilight of their career. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 3 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said: I still feel like they have a long term game plan and need to get their type of players in place for it to be executed properly. They both inherited a team devoid of talent, especially younger talent to build around. the lack of young talent was because of the disaster known as Grudock and all of their failed draft picks and FA signings. JM/DZ were hamstrung inheriting a roster that is a dumpster fire overall and they tried to put lipstick on a pig by signing players to "win now" when this roster was not close to winning now. Any fan that really believed this team had a chance to contend for a SB birth was dillusional. I am not making excuses for JM as he has coached this team poorly and has looked outclassed multiple weeks now. The shutout today is unacceptable and is on JM. This could be the catalyst for the team completely giving up on the season. We weren't taking the division over, no, but we have enough individual talent at various positions (Miller, usually, Carr, Jacobs, Adams, Moreau, Waller when he actually plays, Renfrow when he's not injured, Crosby, Perryman, Averette, Ya-Sin, Harmon, Jones most notably) to field a team capable of being an 8-9 win squad with good coaching, especially with the schedule we had, and possibly more with a few gutsy luck wins. What McDaniels and Graham have done is made an ok team capable of competition look like, play like, and very much be a 4-5 win team needing all sorts of luck to even finish with less than 10 losses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie2Gunz Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 6 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: It's absolutely atrocious that's for certain. This far into the season and we're still running plays that have never worked. No exploiting mismatches. The list of issues goes on and on. And ya know, I get that offenses can be complicated. But of it's so damn complicated that guys aren't getting it half way through a season, then it's the scheme that's a problem. Judging by what we've seen, what's so complicated? The totally unnecessary trick plays where we toss the ball 3 times only to toss it back to Carr to throw? The blocking on poorly designed end arounds? Routes that hardly ever open anything up? It seems like it's just outright bad on the most fundamental of levels. Even when we've seen it look good (against terrible opponents), it's looked stilted and like everything is stuck in mud. This!!! Sweeps to Adams? That is not a strong attribute of his. Adams is not Tyreek Hill. That is on JM for not really knowing the talent/ skillset of the players on his roster. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 1 minute ago, Frankie2Gunz said: I understand what they did when they came in here. No one wants to hear that a team is rebuilding and the last thing I would expect is for a new HC/GM to come in and state this. I do believe they made moves during the offseason in hopes they could contend for a playoff spot and not be a complete disaster. Would I have traded for Adams and signed Jones knowing how bad our talent level was... I would not and stated this many times. Those moves have not paid off and I would have rather went with my philosophy of looking for good young talent in the FA market as opposed to signing "splash" players in the twilight of their career. Like I've said since they lost to the chargers it's either that Ziegler doesn't understand how do we evaluate a roster and tied up all the money to the point where we can't really rebuild or Ziegler built I'm last year's roster like he was supposed to and McDaniels can't coach(which his track record and evidence from his previous head-coaching stint suggests) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 6 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said: Worked for Brady Edelman and Gronk. Our guys just aren't talented enough Meh, I refuse to believe Bill let Josh go totally rogue. He and Brady spent too much time together going over tape for it to use ever fully been Josh's Show- which is a big reason I was skeptical from day one. And if you need the best QB and The and one of the best utility/slot guys in the last 20 years to make something work.....you don't have anything lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 1 minute ago, ronjon1990 said: Meh, I refuse to believe Bill let Josh go totally rogue. He and Brady spent too much time together going over tape for it to use ever fully been Josh's Show- which is a big reason I was skeptical from day one. And if you need the best QB and The and one of the best utility/slot guys in the last 20 years to make something work.....you don't have anything lol I mean what we're seeing right now is that Bill Belichick is putting his former defensive coordinator at offensive coordinator which shows you how important Josh McDaniels was 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dessie Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 Says it all really. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 3 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said: This!!! Sweeps to Adams? That is not a strong attribute of his. Adams is not Tyreek Hill. That is on JM for not really knowing the talent/ skillset of the players on his roster. This is why I cannot accept the "we lack talent" argument. We have some proven talent that is so clearly being misused that it simply cannot be a lack of talent holding us back. For Adams to be this impactless, he has to suck or Carr has to be an actual bottom tier QB- both of which are demonstrably not the case. Ergo, it's on McDaniels and his ideas. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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