CWood21 Posted October 5, 2017 Author Share Posted October 5, 2017 3 hours ago, holt_bruce81 said: Seems like the front office really dislikes Tommy Pham. At least, that's how I see it. Am i way off there? What are you basing this off of? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 12 hours ago, CWood21 said: What are you basing this off of? Yea I dont get that feeling. They were sure slow on the uptake with him (as he started in the Minors this year) but once he was hot, he has been playing (actually rare for Matheny to do) As I have said many times, I hope he is a big part of this franchise going forward. But I wouldnt put all my chips in his basket, and always have a safe guard 4th OF ready to take over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tttmikeb Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 16 hours ago, holt_bruce81 said: Seems like the front office really dislikes Tommy Pham. At least, that's how I see it. Am i way off there? I wouldn't say they "strongly dislike" him, but I think there's a couple issues there. On one hand, I think they've been forced to temper their expectations for him based on his health & injuries. That's no one's fault. I get it. I think they know what he's capable of and want to see him succeed, but they've been burned enough that they feel they need to have a backup plan in place. And I can see why Pham could interpret that as them not believing in him. Also, I think his personality rubs some in the clubhouse and especially the FO the wrong way. As fans, we generally find his bluntness and honesty refreshing. I thought his comment about not making the playoffs being "familiar" now was spot on, and I was glad he said it. Mo's comments in the press conference the other day showed he obviously didn't care for those comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 3 hours ago, tttmikeb said: Mo's comments in the press conference the other day showed he obviously didn't care for those comments. If Mo doesnt like his players to be honest, then its time to take another look at the "Cardinal Way". Im not saying they should be disrespectful or openly defying management, but to express true feelings of disappointment should be encouraged. We missed the playoffs for 2 straight years for the first time in almost a decade and we are starring down the barrel of 3 in a row since the turn of the Millennium This is just as much on Mo as anyone else, and if Yadi is allowed to get away with the childish crap he pulls, then what Pham said shouldn't even be acknowledged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 Quote The Cardinals have made the fewest trades overall of any team in baseball since 2011 From VEB . . . . . that makes me so frustrated. This organization has had Soooo many opportunities to both Improve by moving prospects, and even bigger missteps, chances to sell high on guys who we should have shed ourselves of but ended up just absorbing the downfall of their careers. Just this season; Jedd Gyorko Trevor Rosenthal Seung-Hwan Oh Randal Grichuck And on top of those we sold Matt Adams at his dirt basement price. Ive had Mo's back for a long time, but he really needs to show me something this offseason or Im going to have to start questioning what he is doing. Especially if we are on track to miss the playoffs for a 3rd straight season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tttmikeb Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 23 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said: If Mo doesnt like his players to be honest, then its time to take another look at the "Cardinal Way". Im not saying they should be disrespectful or openly defying management, but to express true feelings of disappointment should be encouraged. We missed the playoffs for 2 straight years for the first time in almost a decade and we are starring down the barrel of 3 in a row since the turn of the Millennium This is just as much on Mo as anyone else, and if Yadi is allowed to get away with the childish crap he pulls, then what Pham said shouldn't even be acknowledged I totally agree. He wasn't bad-mouthing management, complaining, or causing dissension. He was stating the facts and his displeasure with the situation. Nothing wrong with any of that in my book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSteelers56 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 25 minutes ago, tttmikeb said: I totally agree. He wasn't bad-mouthing management, complaining, or causing dissension. He was stating the facts and his displeasure with the situation. Nothing wrong with any of that in my book. What did Pham say? I must have missed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tttmikeb Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 1 minute ago, MOSteelers56 said: What did Pham say? I must have missed it. I don't remember the exact wording of the question or full answer, but it was basically: Reporter: How do you deal with this unfamiliar territory of this team missing the playoffs? Pham: Well, it's been two years in a row, so it's familiar now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSteelers56 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 19 minutes ago, tttmikeb said: I don't remember the exact wording of the question or full answer, but it was basically: Reporter: How do you deal with this unfamiliar territory of this team missing the playoffs? Pham: Well, it's been two years in a row, so it's familiar now. Yeah, MO can go kick rocks. Pham is telling the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSteelers56 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 18 minutes ago, tttmikeb said: I don't remember the exact wording of the question or full answer, but it was basically: Reporter: How do you deal with this unfamiliar territory of this team missing the playoffs? Pham: Well, it's been two years in a row, so it's familiar now. Yeah, MO can go kick rocks. Pham is telling the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted October 6, 2017 Author Share Posted October 6, 2017 5 hours ago, StLunatic88 said: From VEB . . . . . that makes me so frustrated. This organization has had Soooo many opportunities to both Improve by moving prospects, and even bigger missteps, chances to sell high on guys who we should have shed ourselves of but ended up just absorbing the downfall of their careers. Just this season; Jedd Gyorko Trevor Rosenthal Seung-Hwan Oh Randal Grichuck And on top of those we sold Matt Adams at his dirt basement price. Ive had Mo's back for a long time, but he really needs to show me something this offseason or Im going to have to start questioning what he is doing. Especially if we are on track to miss the playoffs for a 3rd straight season. First off, Matt Adams had his chances to take the 1B gig and he struggled. I'm not going to lose much sleep over him if we're being honest. He accumulated 1.6 WAR over 367 PA. Over 600 PA, that comes out to 2.6 WAR out of a 1B. That would rank 15th, right ahead of Yonder Alonso. As for the whole limited number of trades, that goes back to our affinity for our prospects. With the exception of the Matt Holliday, the Cardinals don't make these big deals dealing multiple prospects. And when they deal prospects, it's usually guys they viewed as guys who don't really have much room for development. They moved Kaminsky when they felt that his FB/CB wasn't going to go much further. They moved James Ramsey when it was clear he was AAAA player. You can keep going down the list, but they usually don't move prospects at their high points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted October 6, 2017 Author Share Posted October 6, 2017 7 hours ago, tttmikeb said: I totally agree. He wasn't bad-mouthing management, complaining, or causing dissension. He was stating the facts and his displeasure with the situation. Nothing wrong with any of that in my book. Not that I'm arguing one way or the other, but I'd imagine that Mozeliak would prefer his players showing their displeasure in person rather than through the media. I mean, Molina lost it when Matheny went through the media to call him out about being tired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 11 hours ago, CWood21 said: Not that I'm arguing one way or the other, but I'd imagine that Mozeliak would prefer his players showing their displeasure in person rather than through the media. I mean, Molina lost it when Matheny went through the media to call him out about being tired. By going though social media like a child? Bringing up Molina's reaction to compare him to Pham only shows that Tommy is the one capable of acting like an adult, unlike the "leader" of this team. The fact is Mo lost all high ground on matters of players talking to the media when he didnt come out an chastise Molina for his ridiculous reaction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted October 6, 2017 Author Share Posted October 6, 2017 21 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said: By going though social media like a child? Bringing up Molina's reaction to compare him to Pham only shows that Tommy is the one capable of acting like an adult, unlike the "leader" of this team. The fact is Mo lost all high ground on matters of players talking to the media when he didnt come out an chastise Molina for his ridiculous reaction. I'm not going to disagree with that one, but if he came out and chastise Molina than he had to do the same thing with Matheny. Neither one of them dealt with it through proper channels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted October 6, 2017 Author Share Posted October 6, 2017 I know we've discussed Josh Donaldson and to a lesser extent Evan Longoria, but does anyone think there are any legitimate middle of the order bats available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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