CWood21 Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 56 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said: First of all, we are still one Bat short in this lineup in order to reach its optimum construction. But with the hitters we do have (and the way that Matheny refuses to adapt from the old school lineup ideals) Tommy Pham should be hitting 3rd. In the newer (and better IMO) lineup strategy, then yes Pham should be Hitting 2nd. Desired lineup with another Bat; Matt Carpenter Thommy Pham Donaldson/Hosmer/Moustakas Marcell Ozuna Dexter Fowler Yadier Molina Paul DeJong Kolten Wong Pitcher I think Fowler is best suited to be sandwiched between the Power of Ozuna and the contact of Yadi. And honestly, If we cant pick up another bat, and DeJong keeps up last years output, I wouldn really like to see him and Pham in some 2/3 combination in the lineup. In an ideal world, I'd agree. As much as the Cardinals probably are pestering the Blue Jays about Donaldson, they're not going to deal him. They're still so damn intent on trying to be competitive, but they'll be out of the playoff race by the time the middle of summer rolls around. Probably could get him for significantly cheaper than right now. Gyorko plus something else might even get it done, if Gyroko is playing well. I want nothing to do with Moose. Moose is going to be significantly more expensive than Gyorko, and quite frankly I don't think he's going to outproduce him anyways. I'm not opposed to Hosmer as long as it's on a short deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 minute ago, CWood21 said: I want nothing to do with Moose. Moose is going to be significantly more expensive than Gyorko, and quite frankly I don't think he's going to outproduce him anyways. I'm not opposed to Hosmer as long as it's on a short deal. I understand not wanting to get in with Moose, but just like Hosmer, I would only do it for a short term deal (which I think this offseason is going to produce a bunch of). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said: I understand not wanting to get in with Moose, but just like Hosmer, I would only do it for a short term deal (which I think this offseason is going to produce a bunch of). And there's probably a real reluctance to do anything short term for Hosmer. I'd imagine he's got at least a pair of 5+ year offers in hand from the Royals and Padres. Is he going to take a 4 year, $100M deal over say a 5 year, $112.5M deal from the Royals? Probably not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, CWood21 said: And there's probably a real reluctance to do anything short term for Hosmer. I'd imagine he's got at least a pair of 5+ year offers in hand from the Royals and Padres. Is he going to take a 4 year, $100M deal over say a 5 year, $112.5M deal from the Royals? Probably not. Reports are that he has a 7 year deal in hand from both teams... Honestly, I think our line-up and bench are set at this point and I'm fine with that. Assuming Tommy Pham plays at a level anywhere near what he did last year and DeJong doesn't fall off a cliff ala Aledmys Diaz, I think we have a solid lineup from top to bottom and a pretty good bench with some good pop... It's the pitching staff that worries me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Quote Reed had three-year offers on the table at times this offseason, but his desire was to join a team in the Midwest, per Yahoo Sports’ Jeff Passan. This just miffs me that we couldn't get a deal done for him. I know we didn't view him as a closer, but still. He signed with the Twins to be the 8th inning guy and it was a VERY reasonable and shirt-term deal... Frustrating... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 minute ago, kgarrett12486 said: Reports are that he has a 7 year deal in hand from both teams... Honestly, I think our line-up and bench are set at this point and I'm fine with that. Assuming Tommy Pham plays at a level anywhere near what he did last year and DeJong doesn't fall off a cliff ala Aledmys Diaz, I think we have a solid lineup from top to bottom and a pretty good bench with some good pop... It's the pitching staff that worries me... Unless the Cubs' pitching staff blows itself up, we're not going to beat them for the division. They're just too good offensively, but I think we're a very capable WC team. I'm less concerned with the rotation, mainly because we didn't obliterate our SP depth. If one of those falters, you still have Jack Flaherty and Dakota Hudson in Memphis ready to go if need be. The bullpen is my bigger concern. I don't like Luke Gregerson as the closer, but it's better than what we were doing last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 minute ago, kgarrett12486 said: This just miffs me that we couldn't get a deal done for him. I know we didn't view him as a closer, but still. He signed with the Twins to be the 8th inning guy and it was a VERY reasonable and shirt-term deal... Frustrating... Honestly, at this point I'm not sure what the Cardinals are thinking in terms of the closer. Recent reports have said their interest in Colome was overstated. They missed out on Wade Davis, although there weren't any real substantial rumors on him. Seems like at this point it's Greg Holland or our internal options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Just now, CWood21 said: Unless the Cubs' pitching staff blows itself up, we're not going to beat them for the division. They're just too good offensively, but I think we're a very capable WC team. I'm less concerned with the rotation, mainly because we didn't obliterate our SP depth. If one of those falters, you still have Jack Flaherty and Dakota Hudson in Memphis ready to go if need be. The bullpen is my bigger concern. I don't like Luke Gregerson as the closer, but it's better than what we were doing last year. That's actually what I was referencing. Relying on Gregerson as the closer is a disaster waiting to happen. Add in the fact that they are counting on guys like Tuivalala, Gant and Brebbia to take that next step or not regress and I thin you're putting too many eggs into one basket. They need another veteran arm, preferably one ready to step into the 9th inning... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 Just now, kgarrett12486 said: That's actually what I was referencing. Relying on Gregerson as the closer is a disaster waiting to happen. Add in the fact that they are counting on guys like Tuivalala, Gant and Brebbia to take that next step or not regress and I thin you're putting too many eggs into one basket. They need another veteran arm, preferably one ready to step into the 9th inning... If Gregerson had been bad with the Astros during his entire stint there, I might be a bit worried. But he was a very effective closer for them in his first two years. Given the fickleness of relievers, I'm willing to believe that last year was the anomaly. He was really good his first two seasons. Is he an elite closer? No, but I think he's someone we can put him back there and not really worry about the position Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, CWood21 said: If Gregerson had been bad with the Astros during his entire stint there, I might be a bit worried. But he was a very effective closer for them in his first two years. Given the fickleness of relievers, I'm willing to believe that last year was the anomaly. He was really good his first two seasons. Is he an elite closer? No, but I think he's someone we can put him back there and not really worry about the position If he wasn't heading into his age 34 season and was a guy still throwing mid 90's I'd be less concerned. Just seems like we're trying to take a square peg and fit it into a round hole. Gregerson is better suited for the 7th or 8th inning IMO... I really think it could be ALex Reyes' job come May for 2018... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 hours ago, kgarrett12486 said: If he wasn't heading into his age 34 season and was a guy still throwing mid 90's I'd be less concerned. Just seems like we're trying to take a square peg and fit it into a round hole. Gregerson is better suited for the 7th or 8th inning IMO... I really think it could be ALex Reyes' job come May for 2018... It's not like we're seeing a huge velocity decrease. It was down about 1 MPH last year, which isn't unheard of. And he's not going to be a guy whose going to dominate on pure stuff. LIS, I hope they keep Alex Reyes away from the bullpen. I'd rather leave him in EST than put him in the bullpen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 hour ago, CWood21 said: It's not like we're seeing a huge velocity decrease. It was down about 1 MPH last year, which isn't unheard of. And he's not going to be a guy whose going to dominate on pure stuff. LIS, I hope they keep Alex Reyes away from the bullpen. I'd rather leave him in EST than put him in the bullpen. That 'range' though is a danger zone for majority of pitchers. He was sitting at 89.62 MPH average on his FB... He was lit up last year too on this pitch. Especially when he threw it inside... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, kgarrett12486 said: That 'range' though is a danger zone for majority of pitchers. He was sitting at 89.62 MPH average on his FB... He was lit up last year too on this pitch. Especially when he threw it inside... As long as he's keeping the ball down, it shouldn't be an issue. He's never been a guy whose reliant on velocity. If he was a guy who was pitching 95+ MPH in previous years, I'd be a bit more concerned but he's pitched mostly in that 90-92 MPH range. LIS, it's not ideal but I think it beats the alternative of throwing big money at Greg Holland AND giving up a pick. I'm still not sure why they weren't more in on Addison Reed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tttmikeb Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 I'm skeptical of this whole Gregerson-as-closer thing, too. I like him. I think it's cool we could bring him back to the organization. But counting on him as the closer? Yikes. I'm hoping this is sort of bluffing to maintain leverage in some negotiation, either for a FA or with Tampa Bay for Colome. But I'm also with you guys on Reed and his deal with MIN. We could/should have been able to beat that. Even if that set up a situation where Reed & Gregerson could duke it out for the closer role, that wouldn't be terrible. I like competition. But if we're serious about just sticking with what we've got right now, it feels like we're back to the same old, too-afraid-to-spend-money Cardinals. I hope it works, but it scares me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOSteelers56 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 2 hours ago, tttmikeb said: I'm skeptical of this whole Gregerson-as-closer thing, too. I like him. I think it's cool we could bring him back to the organization. But counting on him as the closer? Yikes. I'm hoping this is sort of bluffing to maintain leverage in some negotiation, either for a FA or with Tampa Bay for Colome. But I'm also with you guys on Reed and his deal with MIN. We could/should have been able to beat that. Even if that set up a situation where Reed & Gregerson could duke it out for the closer role, that wouldn't be terrible. I like competition. But if we're serious about just sticking with what we've got right now, it feels like we're back to the same old, too-afraid-to-spend-money Cardinals. I hope it works, but it scares me. It seems like we're also putting a lot of responsibility on young pitching and that scares me. Young pitching is volatile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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