Travis Hunter. WR or CB?

[Dcash4]

13 hours ago, armsteeld said:

most players run the same routes. 

Running routes and being a route runner are two vastly different things. 

14 hours ago, armsteeld said:

Saying a player is raw due to route running is a common misconception

But it's not. I have no clue if he can stack a corner. He didn't do it or didn't have to do it so far. I have no clue if he can set up a route with footwork. He never did. I have no clue how he will do against press. He got free release after free release. I have no idea if he can create late separation or have late hands or push a corner to the numbers to give a lane or slow play the route at the top. 

Can he? Maybe. Couldn't tell you though because it's not readily shown in his game so far. 

[armsteeld]

3 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

Running routes and being a route runner are two vastly different things. 

But it's not. I have no clue if he can stack a corner. He didn't do it or didn't have to do it so far. I have no clue if he can set up a route with footwork. He never did. I have no clue how he will do against press. He got free release after free release. I have no idea if he can create late separation or have late hands or push a corner to the numbers to give a lane or slow play the route at the top. 

Can he? Maybe. Couldn't tell you though because it's not readily shown in his game so far. 

I already elaborated on route running vs running routes. That's why I mentioned pacing and manipulation. 

You honestly haven't watched him if you have those questions about his game as a WR. He does all those and did them all in every game he played. Stacking a CB is something that most WRs don't do. Stacking is something Jerry Rice excelled at but nowadays receivers just run like hell to their benchmarks. 

Hunter is fast so most DBs were too afraid to jam while in press coverage. He show asked late separation vs USC or Colorado St while running a 9 route.

No disrespect but this is why I say the things I say because it's on film everything that you're questioning. 

[Dcash4]

1 hour ago, armsteeld said:

No disrespect but this is why I say the things I say because it's on film everything that you're questioning.

I have yet to see anything that makes me think he would be a quality route runner in the league. I’m not saying things for the sake of arguments. 

I won’t act like I’ve watched every snap, so I’ll gladly have you show me where I’m wrong. But I see chase Claypool right now via clips. Nice plays, but not repeatable circumstances around creating them at a high level. 

[rlon]

3 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

I have yet to see anything that makes me think he would be a quality route runner in the league. I’m not saying things for the sake of arguments. 

I won’t act like I’ve watched every snap, so I’ll gladly have you show me where I’m wrong. But I see chase Claypool right now via clips. Nice plays, but not repeatable circumstances around creating them at a high level. 

I definitely don’t see Claypool…I see this guy as more quick twitch and east west capable than the up and down Claypool. 

[Dcash4]

1 hour ago, rlon said:

I definitely don’t see Claypool…I see this guy as more quick twitch and east west capable than the up and down Claypool. 

I don’t mean in terms of comparable players. I mean the feeling I get from watching their games back.

I think Hunter is a much better football player, but Claypools college play was fairly unimpressive. Toasting a Navy ILB with no S over the top doesn’t sell me on much.

I think Hunter has a good feel for finding green against zone, strong hands at the catch point, and seems like a post-catch play maker… but honestly the lack of any sort of challenge he has from corners or defenses as a whole in-route and off the line concerns me. He just doesn’t have to do it based on what I have seen so that part of his game is complete projection. 

Quality NFL caliber receivers are becoming plentiful with the way the game is played. Dominators, though, are still hard to come by. But if I can’t trust him to win on his own, I’d shy away from Hunter in the early first as a receiver. 

[warfelg]

I like the way I heard one PFF guy put it:

You take Hunter high because he has the athletic traits to succeed at WR or CB. 

You count on him being a Contract 2 guy because he needs time to learn the position you put him at. 

You’re going to have to be willing to have growing pains with him. This guy said a fear teams will have if he doesn’t declare a particular side of the ball in the draft process is that his camp will push that he needs to do both once he’s in the building. In the NFL positional drills and meetings happen at the exact same time and no coach will change that for one guy. Add in a longer more physical season and it’s tougher to hold up doing both.

At best he may find a team who will play him at say CB with a WR package and KR/PR duties. but then that will mean 5-10 snaps a game on offense which the defense will be really aware of and after a year might make that package irrelevant. 

For NFL teams, they’ll likely scout his full game, ID which side of the ball his traits are more natural, and dive into his tape on that side of the ball. Given what @Dcash4 said about WRs in addition to how deep the position is becoming, he’s better at CB as the top one in this class. And the NFL being more pass friendly, his ball skills makes him the ideal what you want at CB. 

[jebrick]

39 minutes ago, warfelg said:

I like the way I heard one PFF guy put it:

You take Hunter high because he has the athletic traits to succeed at WR or CB. 

You count on him being a Contract 2 guy because he needs time to learn the position you put him at. 

You’re going to have to be willing to have growing pains with him. This guy said a fear teams will have if he doesn’t declare a particular side of the ball in the draft process is that his camp will push that he needs to do both once he’s in the building. In the NFL positional drills and meetings happen at the exact same time and no coach will change that for one guy. Add in a longer more physical season and it’s tougher to hold up doing both.

At best he may find a team who will play him at say CB with a WR package and KR/PR duties. but then that will mean 5-10 snaps a game on offense which the defense will be really aware of and after a year might make that package irrelevant. 

For NFL teams, they’ll likely scout his full game, ID which side of the ball his traits are more natural, and dive into his tape on that side of the ball. Given what @Dcash4 said about WRs in addition to how deep the position is becoming, he’s better at CB as the top one in this class. And the NFL being more pass friendly, his ball skills makes him the ideal what you want at CB. 

As i said, he is a boom-bust player.  Great athlete with speed.  You hope you can teach him the skills.  The NFL is littered with these types of guys.  Some learn and others do not.  He would last  longer as a CB then WR if he did not improve at all.  Those that totally rely on their athletics will not make it long in the NFL.

[armsteeld]

5 hours ago, jebrick said:

As i said, he is a boom-bust player.  Great athlete with speed.  You hope you can teach him the skills.  The NFL is littered with these types of guys.  Some learn and others do not.  He would last  longer as a CB then WR if he did not improve at all.  Those that totally rely on their athletics will not make it long in the NFL.

It's the reverse for me. Coach Prime himself said Hunter would be better at WR rather than CB. Everyone keeps saying he's raw or a work in progress so show me his struggles. Every player can have a bad rep or two but show me consistent inconsistencies within his game.

[skywlker32]

Ultimately he can push for a side of the ball and seeing the paydays of the WRs, I would expect him to go WR. That's assuming he feels his skills are approximately equivalent at both. You have to have the best CB contract in the league to have a chance to break into the top 15 in WR contracts

[rlon]

On 7/22/2024 at 2:42 PM, armsteeld said:

It's the reverse for me. Coach Prime himself said Hunter would be better at WR rather than CB. Everyone keeps saying he's raw or a work in progress so show me his struggles. Every player can have a bad rep or two but show me consistent inconsistencies within his game.

You lost me at Coach Prime…lol. Sorry, I just can’t…

Edited July 28 by rlon

[August4th]

won't be surprise if Hunter and Sanders are being mocked to the steelers during the season and offseason

[armsteeld]

Friendly reminder

 

 

 

[Dcash4]

5 hours ago, armsteeld said:

Friendly reminder

 

 

 

Tremendous ball skills. I still have no clue how good of a receiver he is though. 

[MOSteelers56]

17 hours ago, armsteeld said:

Friendly reminder

 

 

 

He reminds me of a shorter George Pickens. I’d like to see how he runs routes and how dedicated he is at working on that. He’s great with the ball in his hands and at combat catches. I’d like to see him create separation. I’m not sure a 6’1 185lbs WR can play like that in the league. 

[armsteeld]

52 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

He reminds me of a shorter George Pickens. I’d like to see how he runs routes and how dedicated he is at working on that. He’s great with the ball in his hands and at combat catches. I’d like to see him create separation. I’m not sure a 6’1 185lbs WR can play like that in the league. 

The average size of the better WRs is around that height and weight. Hunter is a high IQ WR similar to Devonta Smith. He has sneaky speed due to his long strides. Everything you guys are questioning is already on film. He is an elite WR but an average CB with poor footwork who relies more on being a better athlete and using his IQ in coverage. On defense, he reminds me of a faster Cam Sutton but his technique needs much refinement.