MKnight82 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 I have serious doubts about his ability to play Safety in the NFL. He's too slow. Our coaching staff was trying to force him to MLB because he simply doesn't have the speed to play in coverage all the time. He's at best a situational hybrid linebacker. I wouldn't be surprised to see him out of football in a year or two because he doesn't have a real position, and his attitude issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 49 minutes ago, HTTRG3Dynasty said: Are you going to play him as a true SS, or a Dime/Nickel LB? I hope you have a role for him as a true starting SS; otherwise, expect a lot of whinging and threats of retirement. That might not even help, since there was a lot of whinging and threats of retirement even when we moved him to the position he wanted to play since being drafted. We're probably going to play him a hybrid position, with him getting 50-60 percent floor, 70+ percent ceiling of snaps. Todd Davis literally couldn't cover a Pop Warner receiver, and Brandon Marshall's shoulder/knee issues have robbed him of his ability to cover. We have 3 very good safeties (specifically 1 very good vet Stewart, and 2 up and coming 3rd year guys in Parks and Simmons), Cravens is coming in to play the ILB role - and frankly, other than short-yardage, I expect there to be a lot of PT for him, given where our ILB's are at (we really should have addressed ILB at the draft last year, we got cornered into re-signing Davis, which I suspect we'll regret in a big way). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, AkronsWitness said: Sounds about right, but Schefter just tweeted that the trade basically went through because he still does want to play. Maybe a chance in scenery could breath some new life into him in that regard? I think so. But, as a Skins fan, I am generally a pessimist. Fool me once... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, Broncofan said: We're probably going to play him a hybrid position, with him getting 50-60 percent floor, 70+ percent ceiling of snaps. Todd Davis literally couldn't cover a Pop Warner receiver, and Brandon Marshall's shoulder/knee issues have robbed him of his ability to cover. We have 3 very good safeties (specifically 1 very good vet Stewart, and 2 up and coming 3rd year guys in Parks and Simmons), Cravens is coming in to play the ILB role - and frankly, other than short-yardage, I expect there to be a lot of PT for him, given where our ILB's are at (we really should have addressed ILB at the draft last year, we got cornered into re-signing Davis, which I suspect we'll regret in a big way). That's definitely his best role. He can be a very good player in that role. The problem is... he hates that role. I hope his mindset has changed about that or he won't last very long in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footy_29 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Just now, HTTRG3Dynasty said: That's definitely his best role. He can be a very good player in that role. The problem is... he hates that role. I hope his mindset has changed about that or he won't last very long in this league. Seems evident he needs the money - may have realized that he'll have to do what is asked of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 5 minutes ago, Broncofan said: We're probably going to play him a hybrid position, with him getting 50-60 percent floor, 70+ percent ceiling of snaps. The problem is he threw a tantrum when our coaching staff had him playing this role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 minute ago, footy_29 said: Seems evident he needs the money - may have realized that he'll have to do what is asked of him. That or maybe he was really dealing with some serious post concussion issues. Anyways, he's young I hope he figures it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 minute ago, HTTRG3Dynasty said: That's definitely his best role. He can be a very good player in that role. The problem is... he hates that role. I hope his mindset has changed about that or he won't last very long in this league. No offense to your team, but I think DEN's D is well-suited to taking on guys like Cravens. Even with Talib gone, they've really been able to take guys with supposed character concerns and keep them on the straight and narrow, and focused on football. Ray & Roby out of the draft, Von and his issues, and yes, even Talib (not a good human being, but I thank him for his elite play). I think almost ALL of Cravens' problems are on Cravens - so I'm not throwing shade on your team. But much like OAK in the Davis days used to be able to squeeze life out of aging vets, and we see that with the Pats, our ability to mine value from D players and get them to buy in is really good. Don't get me wrong, WAS did well to get the value they did - Cravens has a TON of risk. But given our ability to make these guys work, and the fact we desperately need cheap, young cost-controlled talent (again, in 2019 we are 30th out of 32 teams cap-wise), and we also need someone to address pass-coverage right away (and still be cheap), it made a ton of sense. Remember, we don't have any 6th/7th rd picks, so this was our last pick (well technically it was ATL's pick, so I guess it's not, but you get the idea lol) and the move-down. It's often seen as spin when it's said both teams are happy - but truly, I suspect that's the case here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, MKnight82 said: The problem is he threw a tantrum when our coaching staff had him playing this role. See above reply. Let's face it, his risk is why WAS was willing to walk away after investing the 2nd round pick before - and rightfully so. There is no lock here. It's just given our cap situation, this absolutely the type of risk Elway has to take. 3 years of cost control probably was just as important as the 2018 impact, to be perfectly honest. And while it's no guarantee, even if Cravens can be just OK in that role (and stay on the team lol), for the salary, it will be well worth the 5.163 and 11-spot move-down with the other picks for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 minute ago, Broncofan said: No offense to your team, but I think DEN's D is well-suited to taking on guys like Cravens. Even with Talib gone, they've really been able to take guys with supposed character concerns and keep them on the straight and narrow, and focused on football. Ray & Roby out of the draft, Von and his issues, and yes, even Talib (not a good human being, but I thank him for his elite play). I think almost ALL of Cravens' problems are on Cravens - so I'm not throwing shade on your team. But much like OAK in the Davis days used to be able to squeeze life out of aging vets, and we see that with the Pats, our ability to mine value from D players and get them to buy in is really good. Don't get me wrong, WAS did well to get the value they did - Cravens has a TON of risk. But given our ability to make these guys work, and the fact we desperately need cheap, young cost-controlled talent (again, in 2019 we are 30th out of 32 teams cap-wise), and we also need someone to address pass-coverage right away (and still be cheap), it made a ton of sense. Remember, we don't have any 6th/7th rd picks, so this was our last pick (well technically it was ATL's pick, so I guess it's not, but you get the idea lol) and the move-down. It's often seen as spin when it's said both teams are happy - but truly, I suspect that's the case here. The difference between those guys and Cravens is that I really don't think Cravens likes football. You can tell that guys like Von, and even Talib, love to play the game. Craven's actions over the past few years leave a lot of doubt about whether that's the case with him. But I'm not trying to rain on your parade here. There have been plenty of good players in the NFL who didn't like the game of football (though rarely do those players retire then try to come back a month later). And I think you guys took an acceptable risk on a 22 year-old player who may just be dealing with immaturity issues. So I agree that this is a win/win for both teams, with the potential to be a huge win for you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, HTTRG3Dynasty said: The difference between those guys and Cravens is that I really don't think Cravens likes football. You can tell that guys like Von, and even Talib, love to play the game. Craven's actions over the past few years leave a lot of doubt about whether that's the case with him. That's a fair assessment of the risk. If he's a player who's just immature, there's a good chance we'll fix that. If he's a guy who doesn't even like to play...well, there are cases who still succeed, but they are a lot fewer. Brandon Albert (and that whole "I'm retiring...wait I'm not if you'll pay.. oops" routine lol) is one, but I'm sure there are 20x others who've failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 23 minutes ago, Broncofan said: We're probably going to play him a hybrid position, with him getting 50-60 percent floor, 70+ percent ceiling of snaps. Todd Davis literally couldn't cover a Pop Warner receiver, and Brandon Marshall's shoulder/knee issues have robbed him of his ability to cover. We have 3 very good safeties (specifically 1 very good vet Stewart, and 2 up and coming 3rd year guys in Parks and Simmons), Cravens is coming in to play the ILB role - and frankly, other than short-yardage, I expect there to be a lot of PT for him, given where our ILB's are at (we really should have addressed ILB at the draft last year, we got cornered into re-signing Davis, which I suspect we'll regret in a big way). According to Rapoport, he's going to be a safety. That would make Sua happy, but... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, HTTRG3Dynasty said: According to Rapoport, he's going to be a safety. That would make Sua happy, but... They can call it S in name only, but he probably plays when we have 3 safeties on the field (Simmons and Stewart aren't coming off the field). That's truly semantics there by RapSheet - basically, he's our 3rd safety, or cover-LB. Whatever makes Su'a happy label-wise lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Just now, Broncofan said: They can call it S in name only, but he probably plays when we have 3 safeties on the field (Simmons and Stewart aren't coming off the field). That's truly semantics there by RapSheet. I hope so. I'll definitely be watching a few more Broncos games this year than usual. I'm interested to see how he plays for you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibucsfan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Can someone fill me in what the deal with this guy is? You guys keep talking about him mentally showing up. Can anyone elaborate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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