O...B...J... IS A CLEVELAND BROWN

[buno67]

1 hour ago, dawgpound1816 said:

Let me say the JGordon bid was pretty terrible, but it just goes to show....Even the Patriots do it since multiple people kept bringing up...What would the Patriots do?

Buy a handy...

[CBrownsman]

On 2/23/2019 at 9:08 AM, dawgpound1816 said:

As for his cap numbers....the Browns currently have $79 mil

But we don't.

We are only 27.5 million dollars under the cap right now, which puts us as the 17th most cap space in the NFL (middle of the pack).

We have 52 million in carry over from last year, but that is a spend it once and you lose it. 

We have a stellar pass rusher and a QB who are going to need a contract in 3-4 years.

If we trade for Odell we are essentially giving all that carry over to him over the next 3 years and then would need to be legitimately under the cap to sign the QB pass rusher and all our other guys.

We do need to be smart with our money, we don't have the unlimited amount to spend that the media is portraying...

[BleedTheClock]

10 minutes ago, CBrownsman said:

But we don't.

We are only 27.5 million dollars under the cap right now, which puts us as the 17th most cap space in the NFL (middle of the pack).

We have 52 million in carry over from last year, but that is a spend it once and you lose it. 

We have a stellar pass rusher and a QB who are going to need a contract in 3-4 years.

If we trade for Odell we are essentially giving all that carry over to him over the next 3 years and then would need to be legitimately under the cap to sign the QB pass rusher and all our other guys.

We do need to be smart with our money, we don't have the unlimited amount to spend that the media is portraying...

I agree, but a lot of our fat contracts will be coming off the books by then.

Collins
Kirksey
Zeitler

 

are all likely to be gone by then. Those are 3 of the 4 highest paid Browns right now.

 

 

We absolutely could bring OBJ in and have enough cap space to keep this thing together. Money would be tight, but it'd more than doable.

[CBrownsman]

10 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

I agree, but a lot of our fat contracts will be coming off the books by then.

Collins
Kirksey
Zeitler

 

are all likely to be gone by then. Those are 3 of the 4 highest paid Browns right now.

 

 

We absolutely could bring OBJ in and have enough cap space to keep this thing together. Money would be tight, but it'd more than doable.

I understand that Collins, Kirksey and Zeitler look like fat contracts, but at 11.75 Million for Collins, 12.4 for Zeitler, and 8.2 for Kirksey (adding up to will barely cover the amount we are going to spend on Baker alone.

I understand that we have cap space but it seems like right now we have a much bigger need at making our defense better with that cap space than we do improving an already incredibly potent offense.

I have a hard time wrapping up over 33 million dollars, almost 20% of the current salary cap for two wide receivers in an era where it doesn't seem like paying for wide receivers wins football games.

All that being said I think with how the season started last year, we are undervaluing what we have in Antonio Callaway IMO.  Everyone would agree that receivers tend to take a little bit of time to adjust to the NFL level of play.  It would be that much harder to do if you had a year off of football.  Most would agree that if Callaway didn't have off the field issues he would be a 1st round receiver last year.  I can easily see him becoming a #1 receiver, and pairing very well with Landry. I think adding OBJ would give us the best receiving core in the NFL, but worth the cost?  I would much prefer to spend that money elsewhere and not be tight on money for a QB who throws to whos open, not to the best receiver.

[BleedTheClock]

1 minute ago, CBrownsman said:

improving an already incredibly potent offense.

I wouldn't call our offense "incredibly potent." It's certainly good, but we aren't elite offensively. We still need more pieces.

That being said, I'm still very much on the fence about OBJ. I'd love to have him for the short term, but it might bite us in the long run. Although I'm 100% confident NOTHING would stop us from being able to keep Baker and Garrett long-term. They're locks to be in Cleveland for a long time...especially Baker. We'd cut the entire team before losing those two.

[CBrownsman]

9 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

I wouldn't call our offense "incredibly potent." It's certainly good, but we aren't elite offensively. We still need more pieces.

That being said, I'm still very much on the fence about OBJ. I'd love to have him for the short term, but it might bite us in the long run. Although I'm 100% confident NOTHING would stop us from being able to keep Baker and Garrett long-term. They're locks to be in Cleveland for a long time...especially Baker. We'd cut the entire team before losing those two.

So I understand but in the second half of last year, after Kitchens and Baker really took over, we had the 3rd best offensive DVOA in the NFL?

Now I understand that there can be some adjustment by the league and it may not be as good, but we were playing VERY well at the end of last season.

I agree Garrett and Baker are locks in cleveland for a long time, but I'm worried about the other guys.  I'm worried about our ability to afford Ogunjobi, and Peppers, and Ward, guys who are more expendable.  We are drafting well now, I don't want one great player in OBJ to cost us more than 1 starter because he makes us unable to spend the money.

I'm just saying if Baker continues the way he is playing into the next few years, WR's seem less of a priority than the defense because Baker can put up great numbers with Damian Ratley as a starting WR :-P.

[BleedTheClock]

3 minutes ago, CBrownsman said:

I'm just saying if Baker continues the way he is playing into the next few years, WR's seem less of a priority than the defense because Baker can put up great numbers with Damian Ratley as a starting WR :-P.

This is where I'm conflicted. I agree with you that Baker makes those around him better. I guess the thought of OBJ here is just so juicy. I feel like he would draw doubles every play and keep safeties out of the box for Chubb to feast.

 

But yeah, that's a major investment to upgrade an A- offense to an A+ one.

[CBrownsman]

9 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

This is where I'm conflicted. I agree with you that Baker makes those around him better. I guess the thought of OBJ here is just so juicy. I feel like he would draw doubles every play and keep safeties out of the box for Chubb to feast.

 

But yeah, that's a major investment to upgrade an A- offense to an A+ one.

I understand your hesitation.  To think of what a player like that could do for the offense.  Certainly to play devils advocate putting Beckham and Callaway outside with Landry in the slot with the combination of the Air Raid and Air Coryell offenses would use the pass to set up the run and open up the field like CRAZY.  There is no way to cover that many talented players with both Chubb and Hunt in the backfield, there would be SOOOOO many options of how to attack people.

The good news is it wouldn't kill us if we made the trade, but just talking about the salary is one thing, giving up a first round pick + is another....

[Kiwibrown]

Obj doesnt make sense on so many levels. 

He costs a ton. Putting pressure on future contracts of our own guys. 

He has had 1-2 full seasons, he is often injured and I dont think he has fully recovered from his fractured ankle. 

It would cost a 1st and more in a draft that we can use to get bpa at a position of need DT DE or OT. 

He has hof talent but not a HOF attitude, he partied hard a week before a playoff game and played an egg in that game costing his team a shot at the conf round. 

I dont think his persona would help the team. 

I'd trade a 2nd for him of he agrees to take a pay cut. That is all. 

Julian edlmen was the mvp of the superbowl because they attacked the rams weakness with a player who has great hands and can do a  couple of things. I want a bunch of guys who can catch and do 1-2 things great without being all round studs. It makes sense financially and doesnt tie the team to 1 player. 

Edited February 25, 2019 by Kiwibrown

[AkronsWitness]

On 2/13/2019 at 9:33 PM, Kiwibrown said:

We have 5 1st rounders I want to resign in the coming years, 

Mg 22py
Peppers 10 py
Njoku 11py

Baker 30py
Denzel 17py

that is a lot of change to spend

At the same time its the reason why spending now while Baker/Myles are on their rookie contracts is so important. Its not going be nearly as easy to get all of these impact FAs when Baker/Myles are eating a quarter of the cap space in a few years. Need to go on a LA Rams type of spending spree this and next season.

[Kiwibrown]

36 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

At the same time its the reason why spending now while Baker/Myles are on their rookie contracts is so important. Its not going be nearly as easy to get all of these impact FAs when Baker/Myles are eating a quarter of the cap space in a few years. Need to go on a LA Rams type of spending spree this and next season.

If we dont spend a certain amount for 2-3 years prior we can build up capital for their signing bonuses. We could drop 60 million year 1 across 3 guys lowering their average to keep us good for the future. 

[AkronsWitness]

9 minutes ago, Kiwibrown said:

If we dont spend a certain amount for 2-3 years prior we can build up capital for their signing bonuses. We could drop 60 million year 1 across 3 guys lowering their average to keep us good for the future. 

True, plus I dont think Schobert/Peppers will come with near the pricetag people are expecting.

With so many high round draft picks in the past few years its going to be real interesting to see how they navigate a bunch of 'cant lose' guys all coming up in the same 1-2 year stretch

[Kiwibrown]

4 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

True, plus I dont think Schobert/Peppers will come with near the pricetag people are expecting.

With so many high round draft picks in the past few years its going to be real interesting to see how they navigate a bunch of 'cant lose' guys all coming up in the same 1-2 year stretch

We are going to have to offload a lot dead weight. 

Collins, kirksey. 

Also we may have to get out of juices contract in year 3, and it wouldn't surprise me if we build Randall's contract in a similar way. 2 years guaranteed, cut or tradable in year 3. 

 

[hornbybrown]

8 hours ago, CBrownsman said:

But we don't.

We are only 27.5 million dollars under the cap right now, which puts us as the 17th most cap space in the NFL (middle of the pack).

We have 52 million in carry over from last year, but that is a spend it once and you lose it. 

We have a stellar pass rusher and a QB who are going to need a contract in 3-4 years.

If we trade for Odell we are essentially giving all that carry over to him over the next 3 years and then would need to be legitimately under the cap to sign the QB pass rusher and all our other guys.

We do need to be smart with our money, we don't have the unlimited amount to spend that the media is portraying...

Thanks for commenting on this. I have said this on twitter a few times but not in here. The carry over effectively means we can front load contracts which helps us in the future but contracts can only be front loading to a certain perecentage. We can easily get ourselves in cap trouble real fast if we are not careful. With that in mind I just don't see us paying two WR's top dollar.

[Kiwibrown]

11 minutes ago, hornbybrown said:

Thanks for commenting on this. I have said this on twitter a few times but not in here. The carry over effectively means we can front load contracts which helps us in the future but contracts can only be front loading to a certain perecentage. We can easily get ourselves in cap trouble real fast if we are not careful. With that in mind I just don't see us paying two WR's top dollar.

It would be interesting if we could nab some like Suggs or wake on a one  year deal, they fill a gap, our 4th de and get to ride off into the sunset on an ascending team and make bank.