Draft Day Thread: Day 2

[NYRaider]

17 minutes ago, Chali21 said:

I’m fine with not drafting another speed guy. Get me a guy with strong hands and can get RAC. 

Henry Ruggs dropped 1 pass the last two seasons and averaged 10.5 RAC last year. 

[RaidersAreOne]

 

[massraider]

4 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Posted in the other thread but I'll post here as well. 

For all of the mid-round WR truthers on the forum. 

There were 28 WR's selected in the 3rd/4th round between 2016-2018. Only 5 of those 28 (17%) have become productive starters within their first 2-4 seasons. 

Those 5 are Michael Gallup, Cooper Kupp, Chris Godwin, Kenny Golladay, and DeDe Westbrook. 4 of those 5 went to teams with prolific passing attacks Gallup in Dallas, Kupp in Los Angeles, Godwin in Tampa Bay, and Golladay in Detroit

 

Let's DB now:

    14    3    4    68    Justin Reid    Texans    Stanford
     15    3    18    82    Tracy Walker    Lions    Louisiana-Lafayette
     16    3    21    85    Rashaan Gaulden    Panthers    Tennessee
     17    3    29    93    Ronnie Harrison    Jaguars    Alabama
     18    3    31    95    Tarvarius Moore    49ers    Southern Mississippi
     19    3    35    99    Isaac Yiadom    Broncos    Boston College
     20    4    9    109    Troy Apke    redskins    Penn State
     21    4    10    110    Nick Nelson    Raiders    Wisconsin
     22    4    17    117    Jordan Whitehead    Buccaneers    Pittsburgh
     23    4    18    118    Anthony Averett    Ravens    Alabama
     24    4    19    119    Kyzir White    Chargers    West Virginia
     25    4    21    121    Taron Johnson    Bills    Weber State
     26    4    24    124    Armani Watts    Chiefs    Texas A&M
     27    4    25    125    Avonte Maddox    Eagles    Pittsburgh

    20    3    2    66    Ahkello Witherspoon    49ers    Colorado
     21    3    17    81    Fabian Moreau    Redskins    UCLA
     22    3    26    90    Shaquill Griffin    Seahawks    Central Florida
     23    3    27    91    John Johnson    Rams    Boston College
     24    3    28    92    Jourdan Lewis    Cowboys    Michigan
     25    3    30    94    Cameron Sutton    Steelers    Tennessee
     26    3    31    95    Delano Hill    Seahawks    Michigan
     27    3    33    97    Cordrea Tankersley    Dolphins    Clemson
     28    3    35    99    Rasul Douglas    Eagles    West Virginia
     29    3    37    101    Brendan Langley    Broncos    Lamar
     30    4    4    111    Tedric Thompson    Seahawks    Colorado
     31    4    5    112    Eddie Jackson    Bears    Alabama
     32    4    6    113    Rayshawn Jenkins    Chargers    Miami (FL)
     33    4    17    123    Montae Nicholson    Redskins    Michigan State
     34    4    20    126    Howard Wilson    Browns    Houston
        3    1    64    Kevin Byard    Titans    Middle Tennessee State

     16    3    5    68    Will Redmond    49ers    Mississippi State
     17    3    8    71    Darian Thompson    Giants    Boise State
     18    3    11    74    KeiVarae Russell    Chiefs    Notre Dame
     19    3    14    77    Daryl Worley    Panthers    West Virginia
     20    3    21    84    Kendall Fuller    Redskins    Virginia Tech
     21    3    30    92    Brandon Williams    Cardinals    Texas A&M
     22    3    36    98    Justin Simmons    Broncos    Boston College
     23    4    6    104    Tavon Young    Ravens    Temple
     24    4    8    106    Eric Murray    Chiefs    Minnesota
     25    4    10    108    Ryan Smith    Buccaneers    North Carolina Central
     26    4    13    111    Miles Killebrew    Lions    Southern Utah
     27    4    20    118    Juston Burris    Jets    North Carolina State
     28    4    26    124    Deon Bush    Bears    Miami (FL)
     29    4    29    127    Deiondre' Hall    Bears    Northern Iowa
     30    4    31    129    Derrick Kindred    Browns    Texas Christian
     31    4    35    133    Rashard Robinson    49ers    Louisiana State

I mean............

[Geezy]

1 hour ago, RaidersAreOne said:

Pretty bad. Davis was a total flop other than 1 good run. Jones is still TBD and has potential but wouldn't be surprised if he's cut. I just hope with the Ruggs and potential 3rd rounder, we'll stop wasting picks on quick WR fixes. 

the desperation will subside as we fill out the roster. Ill never be mad at the organization for being aggressive. 

[Geezy]

8 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Henry Ruggs dropped 1 pass the last two seasons and averaged 10.5 RAC last year. 

hes fast though, so hes just a speed guy.

[NYRaider]

3 minutes ago, massraider said:

Let's DB now:

I mean............

I see some solid names on that list. Either way though expecting a mid-round guy to be able to produce at a high level within his first two seasons isn't realistic. 

[Geezy]

8 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said:

 

everyone is tired of watching Family Feud

[massraider]

Just now, NYRaider said:

I see some solid names on that list. Either way though expecting a mid-round guy to be able to produce at a high level within his first two seasons isn't realistic. 

No it's not, but it's not like WR is more prone to failure than another.  

Recent history would suggest WRs in later rounds are gonna blow the 1st rounders out of the water. 

[NYRaider]

2 minutes ago, massraider said:

Recent history would suggest WRs in later rounds are gonna blow the 1st rounders out of the water. 

Meh. I mean when you look at the WR's that have produced early as mid-round picks 4/5 of them went into really productive passing offenses with veteran QBs. A 3rd/4th round pick at WR is likely #5/#6 on the depth chart as a rookie.

Edited April 24, 2020 by NYRaider

[massraider]

12 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Meh. I mean when you look at the WR's that have produced early as mid-round picks 4/5 of them went into really productive passing offenses with veteran QBs. A 3rd/4th round pick at WR is likely #5/#6 on the depth chart as a rookie.

Other names from 3rd/4th round since 2016:

Josh Reynolds

Tre'Quan Smith

Diontae Johnson

Terry McLaurin. 

 

And none of those drafts were considered this deep at WR.

 

I think you just convinced me WR is a good call.  

[NYRaider]

12 minutes ago, massraider said:

Other names from 3rd/4th round since 2016:

Josh Reynolds

Tre'Quan Smith

Diontae Johnson

Terry McLaurin. 

And none of those drafts were considered this deep at WR.

I think you just convinced me WR is a good call.  

The same Josh Reynolds that has averaged 17.3 yards per game through 3 NFL seasons and the same Tre'Quan Smith that has averaged 25.4 yards per game through 2 NFL seasons?

Diontae Johnson and Terry McLaurin both looked really good last season. I will say though that both of those guys also came into pretty favorable situations in terms of being on rosters with limited WR production and a role that they could immediately step into. Pittsburgh didn't have much of anything at WR other than JuJu coming into the year. Washington's #2 WR last year was 6th round rookie Kelvin Harmon. 

Will a 3rd/4th round rookie have that same opportunity here? It looks like the top 3 WR's are basically locked in with Ruggs/Williams/Renfrow. Plus we have two young veterans behind those 3 that were former high draft picks and have shown they can produce at a #3 WR level. 

Again, if you're looking at things based purely on data, the chances of finding a WR that has #1/#2 ability in the third round, especially by year 2, just isn't even close to being realistic. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by NYRaider

[massraider]

1 minute ago, NYRaider said:

The same Josh Reynolds that has averaged 17.3 yards per game through 3 NFL seasons and the same Tre'Quan Smith that has averaged 25.4 yards per game through 2 NFL seasons?

Diontae Johnson and Terry McLaurin both looked really good last season. I will say though that both of those guys also came into pretty favorable situations in terms of being on rosters with limited WR production and a role that they could immediately step into. Pittsburgh didn't have much of anything at WR other than JuJu coming into the year. Washington's #2 WR last year was 6th round rookie Kelvin Harmon. 

Will a 3rd/4th round rookie have that same opportunity here? It looks like the top 3 WR's are basically locked in with Ruggs/Williams/Renfrow. Plus we have two young veterans behind those 3 that were former high draft picks and have shown they can produce at a #3 WR level. 

Again, if you're looking at things based purely on data, the chances of finding a WR that has #1/#2 ability in the third round, especially by year 2, just isn't even close to being realistic. 

No one here is claiming the chances are good.

You are cherry-picking data to knock down one position, but unless you have data that says the position you are advocating for is a much better option, why does one position matter over another?

[NYRaider]

3 minutes ago, massraider said:

No one here is claiming the chances are good.

You are cherry-picking data to knock down one position, but unless you have data that says the position you are advocating for is a much better option, why does one position matter over another?

Yes they are. Numerous people on this forum have said things like "we'll probably get a WR in the 3rd that will outproduce Ruggs," " we'll be able to find a WR that can replace Williams as a starter in year 2," and "WR in round 3 is better value over another CB because a starting WR is harder to find in free agency." Implying that it's just so easy to find productive WR's in the middle rounds, which isn't the case at all. 

I'm not advocating for any other position. I just personally don't think spending another top 100 pick on a WR is great value when our current group is already solid and fairly deep. 

 

[NYRaider]

According to Vic Cotto 3 names to watch today: 

• Jordan Elliot | DT | Missouri

• Nick Harris | C | Washington

• Ashtyn Davis | FS | California

[massraider]

2 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

I just personally don't think spending another top 100 pick on a WR is great value when our current group is already solid and fairly deep. 

 

Ahh.  Here's the difference. I think only Ruggs and Renfrow are gonna be part of any solution, long term. Every other guy there is replaceable. Zay? Agholor? I mean, who cares?