Good Arguments on Both Sides

[soulman]

Good Arguments on Both Sides

Originally posted on FanNation Bear Digest
By Gene Chamberlain  |  Last updated 4/23/21

The debate will rage over the upcoming days leading into the draft.

It already has, but it's going to intensify.

Should the Bears trade up for one of the first-round quarterback?

When the offseason began we explored the pros and the cons an trading up, but it was so long ago and much has changed in relation to the quarterback position itself and the draft order.

Here are the reasons the Bears should trade up. And also the reasons why they shouldn't. se ...

Stick to Round 2 or Wait Until 2022

 

It's Basically Only Two QBs

San Francisco is taking the third quarterback. It's only leaving two QBs to choose from, and Trey Lance is really a risk for a team if they think he's playing before his second season. His lack of experience in general, and specifically against Football Bowl Series opponents, is alarming. If it's Mac Jones falling, he really isn't a special quarterback. He's a sharp decision maker with a decent arm who doesn't offer the extra weapon of scrambling. The special quarterbacks in terms of mobility, experience and arm are Trevor Lawrence, Zach Wilson and Fields. Someone worth trading up into the top 10 to acquire might not even be available to the Bears.

Draft

 

@PFF_College

Trey Lance had a 44.1% accurate pass rate beyond the line of scrimmage in 2019 & 2020 That would be the worst % by a 1st RD QB since 2017

Too Costly

Thanks to the 49ers overpaying to move up from 12 to No. 3, the demands of teams trying to trade down are going to be steep. The Bears have three glaring weaknesses besides quarterback and not enough picks in Rounds 1-4 to address them. Those include tackle, slot receiver and maybe two cornerbacks. Moving up from 20 into the top five or even top 10 would require giving up too many draft picks.

 

Matt Nagy and Ryan Pace

This might be the worst drawback. There is no way they bring in Lance with the idea of playing him immediately. He's way too green. With Pace and Nagy facing their final seasons, for them what good is a quarterback who isn't playing this year? As for Jones or Justin Fields, they could play this year. However, if they did it would be because Dalton and/or Nick Foles failed. And if they failed, the team would be tank-bound. Nagy and Pace would be strapped on for the ride out of town.

Supply and Demand

When a stock is hot, it's not the time to buy. You buy on the decline. With quarterback a hot position this year, plenty of teams are taking them and it means the supply of top players at other positions is larger than normal. The Bears would be smarter to invest in tackles, cornerbacks and wide receivers this year while everyone else is wetting themselves over the quarterbacks. Also, the talent level for the wide receivers and tackles, in particular, is higher than normal this year.

 

You're Getting Russell Wilson in 2022

Don't mock this option. He's far more tradeable for Seattle next year in terms of cap hit. He only will be as old then as Matthew Stafford was this past February and, let's face it: The complaints he had about the Seahawks aren't going away in this offseason. They were 12-4 last year and the changes they've made were not great enough to put them over the top. In fact, it would be easy to argue they've become worse this offseason.

 Make the Trade Up

 

It's a Rare Opportunity for a Top QB

Although there are quarterbacks in Round 1 every year, it's rare when you have five who personnel people view as capable of being drafted in the top 15. The talent level is high, almost like the famed 1983 draft when the first round included John Elway, Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, Ken O'Brien, Tony Eason and Todd Blackledge. By the way, if you didn't remember, Marino was the last of those selected. How anyone could look at that delivery and pick him behind the others — including Elway and Kelly — is stunning. The ball was out of his hand so fast and on target.

 

They've Already Built the Bridge

They signed Andy Dalton for a year, so obviously the idea is to get a quarterback in place for the future. You don't sign a bridge quarterback like Dalton and then wait a year to connect the bridge. They need the young quarterback now so he is ready to go by 2022, or even later in 2021 if this whole thing falls to pieces and the entire regime is getting blown to pieces.

It's a Cheaper Route

If they wait and have a chance to trade for Russell Wilson again next year the cost will be great in terms of personnel and if they go the free agent route they could really wind up disappointed. The biggest names on the list now are Josh Allen and Baker Mayfield but there is more of a chance that Wilson demands a trade on draft day and comes to the Bears for this season than there is of Allen and Mayfield ever becoming free agents. Sam Darnold could be there, too, if things don't work out for Carolina. But if they don't work out, then why would someone want to sign him? The rest of the free agent class is comprised of recycled passers from this past free agency and 40-year-old Ben Roethlisberger.

 

Trade Targets Exist

The difficult part of moving up is often finding teams willing to accomodate a trade partner. You can search all over but teams up and down the line might be wed to a particular pick. Maybe they don't want to move. In this case, Atlanta at No. 4, Miami at No. 6 and Dallas at No. 10 already have been reported to be considering a trade out of their spots. There are others, too, in case a quarterback slides and the Bears wanted to pounce without risking Washington taking him first at No. 19.

Weak QB Class Coming

There are early projections the 2022 quarterback class will include only one in the top 25. If that's the case, strike while opportunity exists.

Bears Fan Flames Need Fanning

Signing Andy Dalton and labeling him "QB1" in a tweet didn't quite hit the spot with Bears fans. They need something to get excited about and a tackle, a cornerback or even a fast receiver just won't do. After the disappointment of Mitchell Trubisky, failure to complete a deal for Russell Wilson, flirtation with Carson Wentz and signing of Dalton, Bears fans need the rapid injection of adrenalin a young, hot-shot quarterback supplies.

Why Is There a Question?

It's only been 36 years since they had a quarterback who was good enough to win a Super Bowl. Of course you trade up and you keep trading up in drafts to get one until you have one who is good.

Edited April 24, 2021 by soulman

[soulman]

I only gave this it's own thread because I believe the author summarizes all of our debates on drafting a QB very well and I didn't want it buried elsewhere.  IMHO members here are very clearly on one side of this debate or the other.  So.....where do you stand?

[Bowler1215]

IMO trading up for a QB is an act of desperation by Pace.  He's giving up future picks for a guy who may not pan out.  We traded for Cutler, Trubisy and Mack.  How did those work out?  Cutler was 51-51, Trubisky was 29-22(I do think Nagy was partially why he failed)  Making trades, giving up future picks hasn't really worked in our favor.  Our first pick or two should be to help Dalton.  Draft a QB in the 3rd, maybe 2nd to be the guy for next year.  What good does drafting a QB in round 1 do for us if he isn't even going to start?  Not to mention, likely 2 of the 5 top QBs will be a bust(not sounding like a jerk, or wishing those guys ill, but a couple of those guys won't pan out, we all know that)  If Pace really thinks we can win this year, then our first pick needs to be a guy who can start right away.  The more i think about it, I'd rather draft a defensive player in round 1 over a QB.   Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder, Dak was a 4th.  Don't tell me it's either first round or nothing, especially when a lot of first round QBs end up being a bust. 

1) OT Cosmi

2) WR Brown

3) QB Mond

would be ideal to me.  The first two guys can play right away, while Mond can learn and play next year. 

[Heinz D.]

1 hour ago, soulman said:

I only gave this it's own thread because I believe the author summarizes all of our debates on drafting a QB very well and I didn't want it buried elsewhere.  IMHO members here are very clearly on one side of this debate or the other.  So.....where do you stand?

It's an interesting article, but you can't really make any sort of argument that MAYBE getting Russell Wilson next year is any sort of option to consider moving forward. If it happens, great, but it's not a strategy. It's a hope.

Obviously, they should trade up if they can. I wouldn't trade up for Lance, though. But many would disagree with me on that. Odds are a trade up will be out of the question. 

1 hour ago, Bowler1215 said:

1) OT Cosmi

2) WR Brown

3) QB Mond

would be ideal to me.  The first two guys can play right away, while Mond can learn and play next year. 

I see where you're coming from, but I don't think you can wait until the third to go QB. For me, it would be more like:

1) OT Cosmi/Jenkins  (I think Jenkins can definitely play LT in the league)

2) QB Mills/Mond

3) WR Eskridge/Smith-Marsette

[WindyCity]

2 hours ago, Bowler1215 said:

IMO trading up for a QB is an act of desperation by Pace.  He's giving up future picks for a guy who may not pan out.  We traded for Cutler, Trubisy and Mack.  How did those work out?  Cutler was 51-51, Trubisky was 29-22(I do think Nagy was partially why he failed)  Making trades, giving up future picks hasn't really worked in our favor.  Our first pick or two should be to help Dalton.  Draft a QB in the 3rd, maybe 2nd to be the guy for next year.  What good does drafting a QB in round 1 do for us if he isn't even going to start?  Not to mention, likely 2 of the 5 top QBs will be a bust(not sounding like a jerk, or wishing those guys ill, but a couple of those guys won't pan out, we all know that)  If Pace really thinks we can win this year, then our first pick needs to be a guy who can start right away.  The more i think about it, I'd rather draft a defensive player in round 1 over a QB.   Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder, Dak was a 4th.  Don't tell me it's either first round or nothing, especially when a lot of first round QBs end up being a bust. 

1) OT Cosmi

2) WR Brown

3) QB Mond

would be ideal to me.  The first two guys can play right away, while Mond can learn and play next year. 

Your plan has them going 8-9 with a long shot of having a future QB in place.

How is that any different then right now.

We would be punting on 2021 and likely this regime would be punting itself

[WindyCity]

How many years does Pace get to dangle “maybe getting Russell” before he is fired?

[WindyCity]

The stance for George and Fans should be

”show us some legitimate hope for the future at QB or get out”.

I know Pace can build a solid roster that gets let down by mediocre QB play,  I don’t need to see that again 

Edited April 24, 2021 by WindyCity

[Madmike90]

I just feel right now a Round 2 QB is a waste of a pick for this season and handcuffs us next...trading up to get a Fields or even Jones is going to cost way too much and both still have limitations...

Build the roster this offseason and hope Dalton gives you enough...if he doesn't clear house and go all in on getting Wilson or drafting a top QB prospect next offseason...I would rather take 1 terrible year to set up 10 quality ones than put a rookie on the bench this season...or worse...in a terrible position with not enough talent around him then we end up with David Carr. 

[WindyCity]

6 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

I just feel right now a Round 2 QB is a waste of a pick for this season and handcuffs us next...trading up to get a Fields or even Jones is going to cost way too much and both still have limitations...

Build the roster this offseason and hope Dalton gives you enough...if he doesn't clear house and go all in on getting Wilson or drafting a top QB prospect next offseason...I would rather take 1 terrible year to set up 10 quality ones than put a rookie on the bench this season...or worse...in a terrible position with not enough talent around him then we end up with David Carr. 

Why would Pace do this? This disciplined ship sailed when George didn’t fire anyone.

Next year they will be in the exact same spot. Picking in the late teens and needing to make a massive trade up to secure a top QB.

A 2nd round QB is likely a waste, but they aren’t leaving this draft with their jobs in the hands of Andy Dalton with no other option.

[WindyCity]

If you can’t trust Pace to make a move at QB why do we trust him to make moves at other positions?

Why would we keep a GM that needs training wheels and parameters on his job?

If this is how people felt, they should have fired Pace and Nagy and gave the new guys an extra year to clean stuff up and build up the roster. Why does the new GM want to inherit a bunch of Pace picks QB or other positions?

If you were okay with Pace not being fired it is just weird that you don’t trust him to do the full job.

[Madmike90]

23 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Why would Pace do this? This disciplined ship sailed when George didn’t fire anyone.

Next year they will be in the exact same spot. Picking in the late teens and needing to make a massive trade up to secure a top QB.

A 2nd round QB is likely a waste, but they aren’t leaving this draft with their jobs in the hands of Andy Dalton with no other option.

Pace isn't the only factor here...maybe George didn't fire Pace and sanctioned a move for Dalton as a bridge...we don't know...what we do know is the leash is as short as it will ever be and I can no see a reason to take a 2nd round QB.

[WindyCity]

25 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

Pace isn't the only factor here...maybe George didn't fire Pace and sanctioned a move for Dalton as a bridge...we don't know...what we do know is the leash is as short as it will ever be and I can no see a reason to take a 2nd round QB.

Why would you keep a GM who you have to put on a leash?

I don’t even think that George is dumb enough to keep a GM and not allow him to do the job.

You supported keeping Pace, but now want to neuter him in the draft?

Edited April 24, 2021 by WindyCity

[WindyCity]

Keeping Pace and Nagy and only allowing them Andy Dalton as a QB move is accepting 8 wins again before the season starts.

Ted Phillips said we haven’t gotten the QB spot right or won enough games... Andy Dalton fixes neither.

Edited April 24, 2021 by WindyCity

[WindyCity]

The only way Pace and Nagy punt on the season with Dalton is if they have extensions and long leashes.

No one makes their last stand with Dalton

[AZBearsFan]

1 hour ago, WindyCity said:

Why would Pace do this? This disciplined ship sailed when George didn’t fire anyone.

This is, IMO, the biggest reason I don’t see us going the route of building everything else to prep for a new QB in 2022. Pace and Nagy may not be here. It’s the same reason Pace shouldn’t care if he burns future draft capital in 2021 to get a QB now. It’s his *** on the line in 2021. If he’s gone after this year, what does he care if we’re short picks?