Is Belichick a lock for coach of the year if the Patriots are the AFC’s 1-seed?

[DannyB]

Should be.

Kliff has an electric QB that a ton of people were calling the MVP for the first half-ish of the season.

MLF has Rodgers.

Bill has mediocre overall talent on offense, "good" (not great) talent on defense that only really started locking teams down after he took a larger role in the play calling/in-game coaching.

[Apparition]

6 minutes ago, DannyB said:

Bill has mediocre overall talent on offense, "good" (not great) talent on defense that only really started locking teams down after he took a larger role in the play calling/in-game coaching.

question: What teams do you consider to have "great" talent on defense?

[DannyB]

3 hours ago, Apparition said:

question: What teams do you consider to have "great" talent on defense?

I won't pretend to have encyclopedic knowledge of every player on every defense, but off the top of my head I think the overall TALENT (not including coaching, and that's the big thing), on the following teams is more than the talent on the Patriots: Colts, Bucs, Rams, Arizona, Steelers, Browns, maybe the Bears and Niners?

I think Belichick is able to field really good defenses because he has them playing really well as a unit, and just doesn't want any of them to massively f-up (he's always had a bit of a bend-don't-break philosophy). I know Judon is having an outstanding year, and I do think he's probably the most talented player currently (Gilmore was before), but I think BB has just as much to do with getting a great year out of him.

I have a lot of disclaimers going on in my head but to keep it simple, one big one is this: A lot of players on the defense are relatively young/unproven. Some, like Duggar and Barmore and maybe Godchaux look promising but I think it's just a little too early to cement them. We may look back in 5 years and say damn, there was a lot of talent here.

[biggie.]

3 hours ago, DannyB said:

Should be.

Kliff has an electric QB that a ton of people were calling the MVP for the first half-ish of the season.

MLF has Rodgers.

Bill has mediocre overall talent on offense, "good" (not great) talent on defense that only really started locking teams down after he took a larger role in the play calling/in-game coaching.

JC Jackson is a master thief like Trevon Diggs.

Judon is a DPOY candidate.

Barmore has been an absolute steal.

Collins/Van Noy aren't flashy but they always make plays for us.

McCourry/Hightower are shells of their former selves, but they provide leadership.

[Apparition]

2 minutes ago, biggie. said:

JC Jackson is a master thief like Trevon Diggs.

Judon is a DPOY candidate.

Barmore has been an absolute steal.

Collins/Van Noy aren't flashy but they always make plays for us.

McCourry/Hightower are shells of their former selves, but they provide leadership.

Adrian Phillips has been one of the 3 or 4 best safeties in the league this year, too.

[biggie.]

1 minute ago, Apparition said:

Adrian Phillips has been one of the 3 or 4 best safeties in the league this year, too.

Forgot about Dugger too.

[DannyB]

2 minutes ago, biggie. said:

JC Jackson is a master thief like Trevon Diggs.

Judon is a DPOY candidate.

Barmore has been an absolute steal.

Collins/Van Noy aren't flashy but they always make plays for us.

McCourry/Hightower are shells of their former selves, but they provide leadership.

Jackson is fine but not a #1, shutdown corner. I like him as a 2 though. Some poor third rate team is gonna pay him way too much.

Judon has been fantastic this year. Best player on the defense. How much of that is his pure singular talent vs. the scheme and position that Bill puts him in? He's coming from a franchise well-known for bringing along good defensive players, and he was successful there, but this year he's already blown past his previous career-best in sacks? Hmm

Barmore looks good so far, as I mentioned in a follow up post. I think it's just a little too early to proclaim him as a perennial top defensive player.

Collins is decent. Van Noy is whatever, fine.

You yourself are saying that McCourty and Hightower aren't talented on the field anymore. Cool.

[Apparition]

1 minute ago, DannyB said:

Jackson is fine but not a #1, shutdown corner.

Imma stop you right there, chief.

How has he not been exactly that this season? He's given up something like 5 catches for 40 yards over the past 7 games. 

[Zalixar]

Lmao @ this thread.

[DannyB]

17 minutes ago, Apparition said:

Imma stop you right there, chief.

How has he not been exactly that this season? He's given up something like 5 catches for 40 yards over the past 7 games. 

Holy S. I can't with you people. Fine, JC Jackson is an elite shutdown, put him on an island, #1 corner. Darrelle Revis was a pansy. Ty Law was a ******. Long live JC Jackson supremacy. If they don't lock him up at $25 million per year for 8 years, what an awful move that would be.

And screw Bill Belichick as coach of that year. You've all convinced me. That Patriots roster is so overflowing with massive blue-chip can't-miss straight up unfiltered talent, Bill is just a passenger. Nay! He is actually a hinderance to what would be an even better defense! Screw me for actually trying to give Belichick credit, he's a schmuck and anybody could do what he's doing, even his half-wit, slack-jawed, bemulleted offspring.

Patriots fans are literally a different species.

[Apparition]

1 minute ago, DannyB said:

Holy S. I can't with you people. Fine, JC Jackson is an elite shutdown, put him on an island, #1 corner. Darrelle Revis was a pansy. Ty Law was a ******. Long live JC Jackson supremacy. If they don't lock him up at $25 million per year for 8 years, what an awful move that would be.

Thank you. That's all I ask. 

[MagicMT]

9 minutes ago, DannyB said:

Holy S. I can't with you people. Fine, JC Jackson is an elite shutdown, put him on an island, #1 corner. Darrelle Revis was a pansy. Ty Law was a ******. Long live JC Jackson supremacy. If they don't lock him up at $25 million per year for 8 years, what an awful move that would be.

And screw Bill Belichick as coach of that year. You've all convinced me. That Patriots roster is so overflowing with massive blue-chip can't-miss straight up unfiltered talent, Bill is just a passenger. Nay! He is actually a hinderance to what would be an even better defense! Screw me for actually trying to give Belichick credit, he's a schmuck and anybody could do what he's doing, even his half-wit, slack-jawed, bemulleted offspring.

Patriots fans are literally a different species.

Man talk about overreacting... 
JC Jackson is a top 5 corner in NFL, simple as that. 
Patriots has an awesome coach that is able to get the best out every player it seems, but he's not coaching a defense full of bums. 
That's all they were pointing out. 

Also yes, Belichick should be the front-runner for COY of the year right now. But depending on how many the team loses vs Arizona or GB I could see the other two candidates leap-frogging him at the end of the season, even if the Pats are AFC #1. 

[DannyB]

1 hour ago, MagicMT said:

Patriots has an awesome coach that is able to get the best out every player it seems, but he's not coaching a defense full of bums. 
That's all they were pointing out.

I literally said it's a good defense.

And I promise you there are more than 5 CBs who would be better than JC Jackson if they were here. You can stat me to death all you want, doesn't change a thing. Also I would go ahead and look at the caliber of WR that the Patriots have faced on this little run where Jackson hasn't been allowing many yards (and don't bring up Diggs from last night, that was in a cyclone, and Diggs has proven he can steal Jackson's lunch money)

[Soko]

2 hours ago, DannyB said:

Jackson is fine but not a #1, shutdown corner. I like him as a 2 though.

At the risk of getting a paragraph or two of sarcasm for a simple question, how many #1s do you think there are in the league? Just wondering because it’s interesting to see the other fans’ opinions on Jackson. UDFA that has had a ton of takeaways (not going to look, but have to think that he has some sort of record for interceptions from an UDFA in their first few years) but only recently took over the #1 role that NE’s liked to run with. 

Prior to this season, everyone would be on board with you. Seemed to be greatly benefiting from not having to be the main corner and letting Gilmore work. This year’s Jackson’s playing spectacularly in that role, although I wouldn’t call him shutdown in the Gilmore, Ramsey, Jaire sense. You don’t throw him on Diggs and expect Diggs to be quiet, the way you did with Gilmore. But I’d definitely view him as a high end corner, certainly #1 on most teams. 

[Dr A W Niloc]

Paradoxically, Belichick will never be named Coach of the Year because he's the best coach every year.  It's like the Gretzky Rule in hockey pools.  Or when you ask people who the best English language poet is.  Respondents give various answers until you ask "What about Shakespeare?"

"Well, yes, Shakespeare, of course, but we assume you meant other than Shakespeare.  Otherwise, why ask the question?"