Sllim Pickens Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 15 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: This is something that I don't know the answer to and I don't know if we would get a straight answer - are the PFF ratings based on an overall, broad system or position specific? Is a 77 something Rush Defense based on their position as a CB, as a S or as a general defensive player. Because the expectations of a corner in run support vs a box safety aren't the same thing. So if they're calling him a corner then it makes me wonder if he's being treated as a corner or as a defensive back (general). He actually played very little at S. All of his splits are at slot CB and LB. Which sort of makes him a safety, or at least has the skill set to be one. Sounds more like a really solid slot CB that likes to play the run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 1 minute ago, Sllim Pickens said: He actually played very little at S. All of his splits are at slot CB and LB. Which sort of makes him a safety, or at least has the skill set to be one. Sounds more like a really solid slot CB that likes to play the run. Yes - that's understood (just by the snap counts alone). What I'm wondering is if his rankings are as a CB, a S or as a DB (broad and general). You expect a Safety to be strong in run support while it's a 'nice to have' if you have a Corner who is good in that area. Does the grading just account for him as a defender, as a DB or more position specific? Does a 92.7 RDEF score (for Pitre) translate from CB to S (even if what he does on the field really doesn't change much). Is he a 92.7 DB? Is he a 92.7 CB? Is he a 92.7 S? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 1 minute ago, Karnage84 said: Yes - that's understood (just by the snap counts alone). What I'm wondering is if his rankings are as a CB, a S or as a DB (broad and general). You expect a Safety to be strong in run support while it's a 'nice to have' if you have a Corner who is good in that area. Does the grading just account for him as a defender, as a DB or more position specific? Does a 92.7 RDEF score (for Pitre) translate from CB to S (even if what he does on the field really doesn't change much). Is he a 92.7 DB? Is he a 92.7 CB? Is he a 92.7 S? I thought the grades were play specific, based on what the grader was interpreting their assignment to be. So if he is playing in the slot or LB, and his job is to fill a gap on run plays, then he would get a high grade for doing it correctly. The higher the run and pass grades to me shows he can diagnose a play and is smart enough and athletic enough to do what he is intended to do. Guys who lean one way or the other to me show they aren't as strong reading the play and reacting. Like if he was in the slot, and it was a run play, and he went streaking with his WR down the field and wasn't involved in stopping the run, that would be a low run grade play. Even if he had great coverage on the WR he wasn't peeling off and reading run to make the play. I could be wrong but that is sort of how I have always interpreted PFF grades. I could be way off but given they track how they line up on each play, it would seem to me they are taking into account what their intentions are on each play from their given position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 WCB SCB LB FS SS 1 D. Mathis (631) D. Hill (531) Brisker (274) Kerby Joseph (440) Blankenship (214) 2 N. Grant (130) Jalen Pitre (481) Jalen Pitre (233) Lewis Cine (410) Brisker (187) 3 N. Cross (24) D.Belton (449) Weatherford (179) Nick Cross (400) J.Thomas (167) 4 T. Anderson (279) B. Cook (158) Weatherford (354) B. Cook (166) 5 K. Hamilton (227) N. Cross (154) J. Thomas (343) D. Belton (160) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 OVR RDEF COV 1 Joseph (90.4) Pitre (92.7) K. Joseph (90.6) 2 Cook (87.6) Mathis (87.5) Brisker (89.5) 3 Pitre (86.0) Cine (83.4) Cook (88.8) 4 Cine (82.4) Cook (82.1) Belton (82.3) 5 Brisker (82.4) J. Thomas (78.3) Cine (81.4) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 Trying to get an idea on how guys might fit (and who we're going to try and replace) Harris: Jalen Pitre Jaquon Brisker Bryan Cook Walker: Kerby Joseph Lewis Cine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 Kyle "The Unicorn" Hamilton WCB - 2021 - 6; 2020 - 4 SCB - 2021 - 227; 2020 - 88 LB - 2021 - 43; 2020 - 59 FS - 2021 - 114; 2020 - 263 SS - 2021 - 48; 2020 - 65 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 14, 2022 Share Posted February 14, 2022 On 2/11/2022 at 4:51 PM, Sllim Pickens said: I thought the grades were play specific, based on what the grader was interpreting their assignment to be. So if he is playing in the slot or LB, and his job is to fill a gap on run plays, then he would get a high grade for doing it correctly. The higher the run and pass grades to me shows he can diagnose a play and is smart enough and athletic enough to do what he is intended to do. Guys who lean one way or the other to me show they aren't as strong reading the play and reacting. Like if he was in the slot, and it was a run play, and he went streaking with his WR down the field and wasn't involved in stopping the run, that would be a low run grade play. Even if he had great coverage on the WR he wasn't peeling off and reading run to make the play. I could be wrong but that is sort of how I have always interpreted PFF grades. I could be way off but given they track how they line up on each play, it would seem to me they are taking into account what their intentions are on each play from their given position. Added about 10 more guys in that excel sheet if you want to take a look @Sllim Pickens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 @Karnage84 you should do LBs next. Some guys I am interested in are Chenal, Brandon Smith, Damone Clarke, Chad Muma, Micah McFadden. Chenal intrigues me but he is more of a thumper and would likely struggle in coverage. He is huge so fits that 3-4 ILB frame and is great against the run which would greatly help us. Not saying he will be a TJ Watt, but in that mold of athlete/player. Smith seems like the great athlete that still needs to work on his mental game. Clark is a poor mans Micah Parsons as a prospect. Can rush the passer and cover pretty well but not great at either. Muma I dont know much about but have heard his name a lot. McFadden stood out to me while watchin IU this year but seems low on boards. Could be a late round target. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 20 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: @Karnage84 you should do LBs next. Some guys I am interested in are Chenal, Brandon Smith, Damone Clarke, Chad Muma, Micah McFadden. Chenal intrigues me but he is more of a thumper and would likely struggle in coverage. He is huge so fits that 3-4 ILB frame and is great against the run which would greatly help us. Not saying he will be a TJ Watt, but in that mold of athlete/player. Smith seems like the great athlete that still needs to work on his mental game. Clark is a poor mans Micah Parsons as a prospect. Can rush the passer and cover pretty well but not great at either. Muma I dont know much about but have heard his name a lot. McFadden stood out to me while watchin IU this year but seems low on boards. Could be a late round target. This is a good suggestion and has been on the list. I strongly believe that we need to find a 3 down guy who is good in coverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 5 hours ago, Sllim Pickens said: @Karnage84 you should do LBs next. Some guys I am interested in are Chenal, Brandon Smith, Damone Clarke, Chad Muma, Micah McFadden. Chenal intrigues me but he is more of a thumper and would likely struggle in coverage. He is huge so fits that 3-4 ILB frame and is great against the run which would greatly help us. Not saying he will be a TJ Watt, but in that mold of athlete/player. Smith seems like the great athlete that still needs to work on his mental game. Clark is a poor mans Micah Parsons as a prospect. Can rush the passer and cover pretty well but not great at either. Muma I dont know much about but have heard his name a lot. McFadden stood out to me while watchin IU this year but seems low on boards. Could be a late round target. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/10cigTzedg1W3TKxftDhyNkasTC-Z8Atn_MwKxbvbtWc/edit?usp=sharing Partially done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 23 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/10cigTzedg1W3TKxftDhyNkasTC-Z8Atn_MwKxbvbtWc/edit?usp=sharing Partially done Solid. Leo Chenal is as I expected. Extremely good against the run and pass rush and eh against the pass. Sounds like he is more of an edge/OLB in our system than an ILB. I like him but not sure he is a fit with our needs unless we go Hamilton at 2/trade down. Brandon Smith is the exact opposite. Better in coverage than I expected but not good against the run/pass rush. Muma looks great but has small school inflation. Dean and Lloyd seem to have earned their first round grades. I would love to add Lloyd but not sure it will be in the cards without a trade up or down. Troy Brown is intriguing and deserves more research. He looks like a glorified S but if he could be that LB/S hybrid that would be useful. Also will have to look more into JoJo Domann and D'Marco Jackson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: Solid. Leo Chenal is as I expected. Extremely good against the run and pass rush and eh against the pass. Sounds like he is more of an edge/OLB in our system than an ILB. I like him but not sure he is a fit with our needs unless we go Hamilton at 2/trade down. Brandon Smith is the exact opposite. Better in coverage than I expected but not good against the run/pass rush. Muma looks great but has small school inflation. Dean and Lloyd seem to have earned their first round grades. I would love to add Lloyd but not sure it will be in the cards without a trade up or down. Troy Brown is intriguing and deserves more research. He looks like a glorified S but if he could be that LB/S hybrid that would be useful. Also will have to look more into JoJo Domann and D'Marco Jackson. I'm filling out the rest of the worksheet. Jojo is listed as a CB in PFF, funny enough. There's two guys with 200+ snaps at SCB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 Just now, Karnage84 said: I'm filling out the rest of the worksheet. Jojo is listed as a CB in PFF, funny enough. There's two guys with 200+ snaps at SCB. 6'1" 230 is a thick CB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 Just now, Sllim Pickens said: 6'1" 230 is a thick CB Iowa State's Mike Rose had 208 snaps at SCB at 240 lbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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