StatKing Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 13 hours ago, CWood21 said: Which is? Lance has flashed. Yes, the Niners invested substantially more into Lance then we did Love but atleast they will get some return on their investment by him actually seeing the field. We used a first round pick on a guy who barring injury will never see the field when the year prior we locked up our veteran QB to a 4 year extension that made him the highest paid player in the league. The Jordan Love pick made no sense then and it makes even less sense now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemike778 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 2 hours ago, StatKing said: Lance has flashed. Yes, the Niners invested substantially more into Lance then we did Love but atleast they will get some return on their investment by him actually seeing the field. We used a first round pick on a guy who barring injury will never see the field when the year prior we locked up our veteran QB to a 4 year extension that made him the highest paid player in the league. The Jordan Love pick made no sense then and it makes even less sense now. I hated the Love pick but at the time Rodgers looked like he may be in decline and it seemed like the plan was Love to take over in 2022. Things change and two straight MVP calibre seasons from Rodgers causes a bit of a rethink. Like I said, I hated the pick and would rather we drafted a QB to start year 2 at the very latest to benefit from rookie contract. But there was some logic and sense behind it whether you agreed with that logic or otherwise. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 6 hours ago, StatKing said: Lance has flashed. Yes, the Niners invested substantially more into Lance then we did Love but atleast they will get some return on their investment by him actually seeing the field. We used a first round pick on a guy who barring injury will never see the field when the year prior we locked up our veteran QB to a 4 year extension that made him the highest paid player in the league. The Jordan Love pick made no sense then and it makes even less sense now. Rodgers did look like his best days were behind him so I can see why Gute made a move for Love. All he did was move up 4 spots and a gave Miami a 4th. IMO Gute didn't give up the farm for that move. Back in 2005 folks were howling because TT took Rodgers in the first round instead of 'helping' Favre at that spot (Rodgers was #24 and Love was #26). AR didn't look ready to take over for Favre until we saw him come in for Brett against Dallas in his 3rd season. Love is going into his 3rd this year. This is a big year for him no matter if Rodgers returns or not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatKing Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 4 hours ago, mikemike778 said: I hated the Love pick but at the time Rodgers looked like he may be in decline and it seemed like the plan was Love to take over in 2022. Things change and two straight MVP calibre seasons from Rodgers causes a bit of a rethink. Like I said, I hated the pick and would rather we drafted a QB to start year 2 at the very latest to benefit from rookie contract. But there was some logic and sense behind it whether you agreed with that logic or otherwise. I don't see the logic behind the pick whatsoever. It was just the Packers meme BPA draft philosophy at its finest. I'll admit I never thought Rodgers would be an MVP candidate again, then why sign him to a 4 year extension the year prior? Why not just let him play out the last 2 years of his deal if they were so worried about his decline? Rookie first round contracts are arguably the most important reason you draft a QB in the first round and we willingly drafted a guy knowing he was going to sit a minimum of 3 years on the bench. It was a dumb move then and in hindsight it looks even dumber. Now we are in a situation where if Love is decent we have to sign him to a 45+ million a year deal after only one year of starting. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 8 minutes ago, StatKing said: I don't see the logic behind the pick whatsoever. It was just the Packers meme BPA draft philosophy at its finest. I'll admit I never thought Rodgers would be an MVP candidate again, then why sign him to a 4 year extension the year prior? Why not just let him play out the last 2 years of his deal if they were so worried about his decline? Rookie first round contracts are arguably the most important reason you draft a QB in the first round and we willingly drafted a guy knowing he was going to sit a minimum of 3 years on the bench. It was a dumb move then and in hindsight it looks even dumber. Now we are in a situation where if Love is decent we have to sign him to a 45+ million a year deal after only one year of starting. Rodgers extension was August of 2018. 2 seasons prior. The timing of the extension and the following 2 years of play is not the best look. I thought based on the length of Rodgers deal, the love pick was a year early, but if you have a chance to get a QBotf, can see the reasoning. The transformation of Rodgers uptick in play is noteworthy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatKing Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 10 minutes ago, squire12 said: Rodgers extension was August of 2018. 2 seasons prior. The timing of the extension and the following 2 years of play is not the best look. I thought based on the length of Rodgers deal, the love pick was a year early, but if you have a chance to get a QBotf, can see the reasoning. The transformation of Rodgers uptick in play is noteworthy Point still stands. It isn't 2005 anymore. You don't waste a first round pick on a developmental QB you know wont play for atleast half his rookie deal. I can't think of any other team in the league over the last 10 years since the new CBA that has sat a QB drafted in the first round multiple years like we have. If they can play you throw them out there, if not you cut bait before you have to sign them to an extension. This isn't that complicated. Now we are stuck in complete no mans land, where if we get rid of Rodgers and Love sucks, we wasted a Super Bowl window. If Love is good then we wasted his rookie deal. Worst case scenario is Love ends up being just okay and we still have to sign him to a massive deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 3 minutes ago, StatKing said: Point still stands. It isn't 2005 anymore. You don't waste a first round pick on a developmental QB you know wont play for atleast half his rookie deal. I can't think of any other team in the league over the last 10 years since the new CBA that has sat a QB drafted in the first round multiple years like we have. If they can play you throw them out there, if not you cut bait before you have to sign them to an extension. This isn't that complicated. Now we are stuck in complete no mans land, where if we get rid of Rodgers and Love sucks, we wasted a Super Bowl window. If Love is good then we wasted his rookie deal. Worst case scenario is Love ends up being just okay and we still have to sign him to a massive deal. I wouldn't have done the Rodgers extension. Coming off an injury. I get once that was done, combined with the 2018 and 2019 play, looking for that next QB is reasonable. 2020 draft vs 2021 draft timeline factors in. If you have the opportunity in 2020 that you can't assume would be there in 2021, I get the idea of Love being selected. The events since that pick certainly are not ideal, but that is using hindsight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatKing Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 21 minutes ago, squire12 said: I wouldn't have done the Rodgers extension. Coming off an injury. I get once that was done, combined with the 2018 and 2019 play, looking for that next QB is reasonable. 2020 draft vs 2021 draft timeline factors in. If you have the opportunity in 2020 that you can't assume would be there in 2021, I get the idea of Love being selected. The events since that pick certainly are not ideal, but that is using hindsight. Even if Rodgers play completely dropped off a cliff I still think its dumb to take a QB in 2020 or 2021 when Rodgers contract dictates he's going to be on the team until at least 2022. This is just another example of GB front office being paralyzed by fear. They've been too scared to go all in and too scared to go full rebuild. Guys are more worried about job security than actually winning rings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 8 hours ago, StatKing said: Lance has flashed. Yes, the Niners invested substantially more into Lance then we did Love but atleast they will get some return on their investment by him actually seeing the field. We used a first round pick on a guy who barring injury will never see the field when the year prior we locked up our veteran QB to a 4 year extension that made him the highest paid player in the league. The Jordan Love pick made no sense then and it makes even less sense now. Let me guess, you're using his 1 game against *check notes* the Texans to justify this. Just admit you want Love to fail. It'd be easier for us all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) 8 hours ago, StatKing said: Point still stands. It isn't 2005 anymore. You don't waste a first round pick on a developmental QB you know wont play for at least half his rookie deal. I can't think of any other team in the league over the last 10 years since the new CBA that has sat a QB drafted in the first round multiple years like we have. If they can play you throw them out there, if not you cut bait before you have to sign them to an extension. This isn't that complicated. Now we are stuck in complete no mans land, where if we get rid of Rodgers and Love sucks, we wasted a Super Bowl window. If Love is good then we wasted his rookie deal. Worst case scenario is Love ends up being just okay and we still have to sign him to a massive deal. Why not ? Just because Green Bay has done things differently than most other teams, doesn't mean they are wrong. There is no command from above that forces you play a QB immediately. Condemning the Packers decision out of hand is failing to take account of individual cases, each of which is unique. Individual decisions, depend on a whole host of factors besides the jump in salary they will enjoy if they DO play well after a period of sitting (and their 1st contract doesn't have long to run). If you find a QB you think can be the next face of the franchise, then it pretty much trumps everything. Wasted years (as a backup), high draft picks, losing the cheap years of a first contract are as nothing, if you end up with a good QB. Even if you fail, the chance of a good QB is worth the gamble, they are that important......and by good I mean in the top say, 8-9 in the league. In other words, I applaud the decision of Gutekunst to draft Love in the first round, it was a bold move. It was maybe a year or two early to get a QB like Love but I will repeat what I said earlier, when you think you have a chance at a good QB and your starter is 38years old, there is plenty to feel good about, taking a QB because the rewards for getting it right are so high. Good QBs are RARE. Edited February 20, 2022 by OneTwoSixFive 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatKing Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Just now, CWood21 said: Let me guess, you're using his 1 game against *check notes* the Texans to justify this. Just admit you want Love to fail. It'd be easier for us all. Just because I think he's going to fail doesn't mean I want him to fail. Unlike you guys I try to judge a player on what he's actually done instead of blindly putting faith into our front office. Love is a turnover machine that struggles with accuracy and in 2 years still has a limited grasp on the offense. If he was any good Lafleur and Gute wouldnt be trying to do everything short of sucking Rodgers off publicly to get him to come back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Just now, StatKing said: Just because I think he's going to fail doesn't mean I want him to fail. Unlike you guys I try to judge a player on what he's actually done instead of blindly putting faith into our front office. Love is a turnover machine that struggles with accuracy and in 2 years still has a limited grasp on the offense. If he was any good Lafleur and Gute wouldnt be trying to do everything short of sucking Rodgers off publicly to get him to come back. Except for the fact that 90% of this forum has said it's too early to make an opinion. Unlike you, we're waiting to see what happens. You've already written him off as a bust. You look strictly at the turnovers, and say he's a bust. And when others (myself included) ask you to defend your stance, you circle the wagon and repeat yourself over and over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 3 minutes ago, StatKing said: Just because I think he's going to fail doesn't mean I want him to fail. Unlike you guys I try to judge a player on what he's actually done instead of blindly putting faith into our front office. Wrong. You are judging him with too little to go on. Give him a year as starter and if he cannot be a starting level QB, THEN you can rag on him. As it stands now, all you are doing is guessing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 25 minutes ago, StatKing said: Even if Rodgers play completely dropped off a cliff I still think its dumb to take a QB in 2020 or 2021 when Rodgers contract dictates he's going to be on the team until at least 2022. This is just another example of GB front office being paralyzed by fear. They've been too scared to go all in and too scared to go full rebuild. Guys are more worried about job security than actually winning rings. If Rodgers play had continued to drop, having a QB in the fold would be a better option than not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatKing Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Just now, CWood21 said: Except for the fact that 90% of this forum has said it's too early to make an opinion. Unlike you, we're waiting to see what happens. You've already written him off as a bust. You look strictly at the turnovers, and say he's a bust. And when others (myself included) ask you to defend your stance, you circle the wagon and repeat yourself over and over again. I'm fairly positive he is a bust. I can easily be wrong but I doubt it. I dont know how the front office can make it any clearer he can't play besides outright cutting him. If they give Rodgers a 3 year extension, which by all indications they plan on doing, they are effectively declaring the kid isn't starter material. They see him in practice and we dont. If he struggles in practice, which he has, why would they have faith in him to start a full season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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