What players on your team do you predict will be in the Hall of Fame?

[StatKing]

4 hours ago, SkippyX said:

If people think Philip Rivers is a HoF QB then Carr is on a Rivers kind of pace.

He's got 31,700 and 193 already after his age 30 season.

He's 48th and 57th all-time respectively already, is only 31 and will have his best offenses going forward.

No idea how much he wins in the next 10 years but I'd lean likely on HoF for Carr if he plays 9 more years and stays healthy.

(yes to deserving, no accounting for the whims of the fools who elect players)

 

Winning matters. In 8 seasons Carr already has more losing seasons than Rivers did in 17. He's 31 and still hasnt won a playoff game and has only played in ONE playoff game his entire career. Carr isn't playing until he's 40 either.

[Daniel]

Even debating Carr is silly, short of him having the best season of his career AND winning a Super Bowl.

And as I, and several others, have said, that logic makes just about anyone possible.

[SkippyX]

1 hour ago, StatKing said:

Winning matters. In 8 seasons Carr already has more losing seasons than Rivers did in 17. He's 31 and still hasnt won a playoff game and has only played in ONE playoff game his entire career. Carr isn't playing until he's 40 either.

Rivers was invisible for about 8 years. (8 years in a row his prime without a 10 win seasons)

134-106 with a 5-7 playoff record is not really winning.

You have no idea how long Carr will play. Its goofy to pretend you do.

You have no idea how successful Carr will be with the best WR he's had literally since college.

 

FYI, Rivers spent 2 seasons in a playpen so you mean 15 seasons.

Its amazing how rookie QBs who don't play don't have losing rookie seasons.

Wow, Rivers had a bunch of 8-8 and 9-7 seasons. So much winning!

 

I like Carr's chances to be a better QB overall than Rivers. It does not mean he will. Its just that the legacy Rivers left behind is pretty much meh. HoF or HoVG stat accumulation meh, but still meh.

Edited June 16, 2022 by SkippyX

[SkippyX]

I know the Eagles won the SB in 2017 but what I really hold onto were those 9 win seasons in '18, '19, and '21. Those were the really good old non-losing season days.

 

What really gets lost in the jokes about the 2011 Dream Team was that they had a non-losing season, baby!

8-8. Take that, haters!

[StatKing]

14 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

Rivers was invisible for about 8 years. (8 years in a row his prime without a 10 win seasons)

134-106 with a 5-7 playoff record is not really winning.

You have no idea how long Carr will play. Its goofy to pretend you do.

You have no idea how successful Carr will be with the best WR he's had literally since college.

 

FYI, Rivers spent 2 seasons in a playpen so you mean 15 seasons.

Its amazing how rookie QBs who don't play don't have losing rookie seasons.

Wow, Rivers had a bunch of 8-8 and 9-7 seasons. So much winning!

 

I like Carr's chances to be a better QB overall than Rivers. It does not mean he will. Its just that the legacy Rivers left behind is pretty much meh. HoF or HoVG stat accumulation meh, but still meh.

Derek Carr has been invisible his entire career lmfao. You're making it out like I'm some sort of Rivers advocate. I don't think he belongs in the HoF either but if its between him or Carr it isn't even close.

28 games over .500 is definitely better than 13 games under .500 and nothing Carr has done in his entire career indicates he's all of a sudden going to go on some insane win streak. 

[rob_shadows]

For Carr I look at the Stafford debates this off-season... Stafford is almost certainly going to end up top 5 in passing yards and TDs and already has a ring... If he's debatable Carr has no chance.

[SkippyX]

1 hour ago, Daniel said:

Even debating Carr is silly, short of him having the best season of his career AND winning a Super Bowl.

And as I, and several others, have said, that logic makes just about anyone possible.

Anyone that has his stats at age 31, yes.

This was a rebuttal to someone basically saying Carr was a joke and how dare anyone talk about him.

Its not a HoF recommendation at age 31. Its a comparison to an undewhelming stats guy who many consider to be HoF worthy.

 

Edited June 17, 2022 by SkippyX

[SkippyX]

If Stafford gets to 70k and 400 TDs and gets to a few more pro bowls then yes, he will be on the short list and get some votes. I can't tell you who they will randomly decide to enshrine though.

 

Both Stafford 91.1 and Carr 92.4 are a little low in the passer rating category so they will need to boost that up some.

I am here to predict that both will over the next 4 or 5 years.

They are 17th and 20th all-time on that list but you have to adjust a bit for era when considering that.

[SkippyX]

1 hour ago, StatKing said:

Derek Carr has been invisible his entire career lmfao. You're making it out like I'm some sort of Rivers advocate. I don't think he belongs in the HoF either but if its between him or Carr it isn't even close.

28 games over .500 is definitely better than 13 games under .500 and nothing Carr has done in his entire career indicates he's all of a sudden going to go on some insane win streak. 

So 12-3 with 28 TDs 6 picks 3937 yards a 96.5 rating and 7 game winning drives in 2016 is nothing?

I will take 6 nothings from Jalen Hurts for the next 6 years please. 

Edited June 17, 2022 by SkippyX

[Daniel]

27 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

Anyone that has his stats at age 31, yes.

This was a rebuttal to someone basically saying Carr was a joke and how dare anyone talk about him.

Its not a HoF recommendation at age 31. Its a comparison to an undewhelming stats guy who many consider to be HoF worthy.

 

Ah. Rivers is HOVG in my opinion too.

[Soggust]

23 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

Anyone that has his stats at age 31, yes.

This was a rebuttal to someone basically saying Carr was a joke and how dare anyone talk about him.

Its not a HoF recommendation at age 31. Its a comparison to an undewhelming stats guy who many consider to be HoF worthy.

 

Not sure poor man's Philip Rivers is really a great HoF argument though, right (some argue he isn't a HoFer)?

It's actually not a bad comparison imo, but the forest from the trees is that:

1) Carr won't finish top 5 in most statistical categories when he retires

2) Carr won't be remembered as a top 5 QB the majority of his career

These are the two biggest selling points for ignoring Rivers lack of accolades.

Kirk Cousins has a better HoF argument currently than Derek Carr.

[SkippyX]

Just now, Soggust said:

Not sure poor man's Philip Rivers is really a great HoF argument though, right (some argue he isn't a HoFer)?

It's actually not a bad comparison imo, but the forest from the trees is that:

1) Carr won't finish top 5 in most statistical categories when he retires

2) Carr won't be remembered as a top 5 QB the majority of his career

These are the two biggest selling points for ignoring Rivers lack of accolades.

Kirk Cousins has a better HoF argument currently than Derek Carr.

You make lots of valid points but the Cousins angle is not quite right IMO.

Its about the projection of where they will be at age 39/40/retirement.

Cousins did not really play for 3 years. He was a 20.5 k 129 TD guy after age 30.

Where will Carr be after his age 33 season?

 

Cousins has great WRs going for him but he is seen as the loser on that team and he might not be there long. Are you predicting lots of success the next place he goes? Are you predicting he finally delivers for Minnesota and stays?

 

You have to consider the projections. Otherwise its pretty much just Rodgers and Brady at QB who are HoF guys now.

 

If Matt Ryan has 4 very good years in Indy he's probably going in. I can't project that now. I don't like the receiving core and they have been changing QBs like underwear in Indy.

To be fair, if we did this after 2018 I would be very high on Ryan and the HoF. Then he had 3 mostly miserable years.

[StatKing]

42 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

So 12-3 with 28 TDs 6 picks 3937 yards a 96.5 rating and 7 game winning drives in 2016 is nothing?

I will take 6 nothings from Jalen Hurts for the next 6 years please. 

That is what we call an outlier season. Bulk stats are not what get QBs into the HoF. Iconic moments and narratives do, none of which Carr has.

[SkippyX]

I get that stats = Hall is much more of a baseball / basketball / hockey thing than football.

Its still a big factor though.

 

Obviously if Carr has good numbers for the next 10 years on a bunch of 5-12 teams then he's probably going nowhere.

Its also possible that 70k passing yards and 400 TDs is not all that special come 2031.

There are only 4 and 8 QBs that high now but lots are closing in.

[Soggust]

1 hour ago, SkippyX said:

Cousins has great WRs going for him but he is seen as the loser on that team and he might not be there long. Are you predicting lots of success the next place he goes? Are you predicting he finally delivers for Minnesota and stays?

Cousins has played 2 games less than Carr (5 he didn't start). Cousins has 900 more yards and 30 more TD (6 more picks) on ~220 less attempts. He's also ran marginally better. He's just simply been better to this point. He has all the weapons that Carr does, so I don't think team will play into it too much.

Cousins is more of a winner than Carr. Cousins is a career .500 qb (59-59-2). Carr is a career .449 qb (57-70).

Cousins will be playing in a softer NFC, competing for accolades (pro bowls, easier path to SBs, etc) against lesser competition than Carr. This should be especially true as Brady, Rodgers, and Stafford move on over the next 10 years. Carr will be the worst QB in his division for the forseeable future. 

----

So, to answer your question - I don't think Cousins wins a SB or MVP etc, or has 'lots of success' (in HoF terms) no. I don't think Carr will either. I do think Cousins is much more likely to be successful going forward than Carr given the circumstances, but I want to be clear - I don't consider either in the HoF discussion. I'd be using Carr as the example if a Vikings fan was making a Kirk Cousins HoF case lol.