• 2024 Draft Prospects •

[MaddHatter]

T'Vondre Sweat ran the 3rd fastest 40 time for a guy over 350 pounds at the combine in the last 20 years

[MaddHatter]

 

[MaddHatter]

 

[Dallas94Ware]

15 hours ago, plan9misfit said:

I completely agree with you that Colson is the most physical of the LBs in this class, but I don’t see him going in the 1st round. And, we should never pass on superior talent just to fill a need. That’s a terrible draft strategy. We did that from 1996-2003 (and worse in 2008 when we deliberately drafted backups from start to finish), and we paid dearly for it. Just because he’d be a good fit doesn’t mean you sacrifice the talent ahead of him. 

I wasn't saying at all the team should pass on superior talent for need. I've been pretty beat-the-desk about that on this forum for years. And it's why we have swung and missed on some guys previously, reaching for need.

The concern for me is that the opportunity to draft a better player that still fits what we need and more importantly, what fits the system or the play designs, may be gone by 24. And if you're in a situation where you can roll the dice on, for example, the fourth or fifth best OL, the fourth or fifth best receiver, or pick the best pure linebacker in the entire draft... It's a hard choice but you go with the backer. It's still a position of need, and you're getting the pick of the litter vs skimming through the slimmer pickings of higher 1st round priority positions. Ideally you'd prefer to select the better player, but how much better is a fourth best at his position vs the first best at another?

This is mostly how the team has drafted to great success in this range before, going back to Travis Frederick. LVE, Zach Martin, Byron Jones, all were higher up on their position list vs the perceived overall rank of other players available at the time. But all ended up being at least moderately successful with Byron Jones being the biggest toss up of them.

So selecting the linebacker at 24, depending on how the board falls.. Would actually fit the usual narrative of the Dallas Cowboys on draft night. 

And then fit even more when everyone yells, cries, complains, says how stupid it is, then eats their words when Junior Colson is a rookie all pro.

[Dallas94Ware]

3 hours ago, MaddHatter said:

 

If JPJ makes it to 17, 18, 19 and Dallas isn't grinding the phones begging for a trade, then Jerry has seriously lost his business mojo.

He was dominant in college. The film shows no flaws whatsoever. He plays a very undervalued but important position, that also happens to be a big need for this team. And now all the reports are that he is a high character guy with tremendous football acumen on top of all his on the field play?

This young man as future hall of famer written on every angle you look at him from. If he lasts to the late teens you absolutely must make that call.

 

Edit: well maybe not show any flaws whatsoever. He isn't flawless. He could definitely get stronger in his lower body and improve his drive off the line. Maybe work on his hand placement. But overall he is a finished product ready to go.

Edited March 1 by Dallas94Ware

[plan9misfit]

Nate Wiggins ran an unofficial 4.29

[quiller]

1 hour ago, Dallas94Ware said:

I wasn't saying at all the team should pass on superior talent for need. I've been pretty beat-the-desk about that on this forum for years. And it's why we have swung and missed on some guys previously, reaching for need.

The concern for me is that the opportunity to draft a better player that still fits what we need and more importantly, what fits the system or the play designs, may be gone by 24. And if you're in a situation where you can roll the dice on, for example, the fourth or fifth best OL, the fourth or fifth best receiver, or pick the best pure linebacker in the entire draft... It's a hard choice but you go with the backer. It's still a position of need, and you're getting the pick of the litter vs skimming through the slimmer pickings of higher 1st round priority positions. Ideally you'd prefer to select the better player, but how much better is a fourth best at his position vs the first best at another?

This is mostly how the team has drafted to great success in this range before, going back to Travis Frederick. LVE, Zach Martin, Byron Jones, all were higher up on their position list vs the perceived overall rank of other players available at the time. But all ended up being at least moderately successful with Byron Jones being the biggest toss up of them.

So selecting the linebacker at 24, depending on how the board falls.. Would actually fit the usual narrative of the Dallas Cowboys on draft night. 

And then fit even more when everyone yells, cries, complains, says how stupid it is, then eats their words when Junior Colson is a rookie all pro.

This thinking is probably what lead to Maxi last season.   I personally would rather have a day 1 ready WR who can impact it red zone game in the first over adding at LB.   But I would t complain too much if they get a HQ LB instead.  

[MaddHatter]

32 minutes ago, plan9misfit said:

Nate Wiggins ran an unofficial 4.29

Pulled his groin in the process

[plan9misfit]

14 minutes ago, MaddHatter said:

Pulled his groin in the process

Yep. He sure did.

[Northland]

3 hours ago, Dallas94Ware said:

If JPJ makes it to 17, 18, 19 and Dallas isn't grinding the phones begging for a trade, then Jerry has seriously lost his business mojo.

He was dominant in college. The film shows no flaws whatsoever. He plays a very undervalued but important position, that also happens to be a big need for this team. And now all the reports are that he is a high character guy with tremendous football acumen on top of all his on the field play?

This young man as future hall of famer written on every angle you look at him from. If he lasts to the late teens you absolutely must make that call.

 

Edit: well maybe not show any flaws whatsoever. He isn't flawless. He could definitely get stronger in his lower body and improve his drive off the line. Maybe work on his hand placement. But overall he is a finished product ready to go.

I love JPJ but getting him will require trading up.  He'd look good in a Dallas uniform.  I see the Steelers and Dolphins as big threats for his services.

I was really impressed with Payton Wilson as well.  Smart and very athletic LB.  He's going to make some team very happy.

[textaz03]

1 hour ago, Northland said:

I love JPJ but getting him will require trading up.  He'd look good in a Dallas uniform.  I see the Steelers and Dolphins as big threats for his services.

I was really impressed with Payton Wilson as well.  Smart and very athletic LB.  He's going to make some team very happy.

If JPJ doesn’t make it to us at 24, I’d be looking for Georgia’s Van Pran in the 3-4 range

[Dallas94Ware]

4 hours ago, quiller said:

This thinking is probably what lead to Maxi last season.   I personally would rather have a day 1 ready WR who can impact it red zone game in the first over adding at LB.   But I would t complain too much if they get a HQ LB instead.  

Need overwhelming the opportunity is what led Mazi. There were better prospects overall available by a wide margin. Even at his position of interior DL there were better options. The team just really wanted the oversized NT idea to work. But that is not Quinn's style and never really has been.

He should improve in year 2, in a system that makes use of a classic NT. However, he's still not worth the pick used that I said when he was picked and stand.by firmly 

But Parcells said it best. Need needs to meet opportunity. If you select solely on opportunity, you don't fill your needs. If you select solely on need, you bypass great players. Thete needs to be a happy medium.

And it's unlikely they will view a fourth or fifth best anything in this draft class as on par with the first best LB. The margin between say. Junior Colson and Keon Coleman, isn't that large talent wise. But in that instance you'd have to give the edge to getting the premier pick of the litter at one position instead of the leftovers at another.

Now if you're looking at a second best OT or something still there. Then you'd have to favor the OT because it's a higher value position and passing on Colson now still should leave you with decent opportunity for a LB later on.

This kind of thinking, as you put it, is what led the team to selecting Frederick, Martin, LVE and other good solid hits late in round 1. 

It's just the narrative the team has drafted by. Mazi was not in that narrative, he was way outside of it. They bypassed better players overall, even at other positions of need, because they felt they had to have something specific. That broke the trend they had been following since that Frederick pick many years back. The Charlton selection was the same.thing. they felt they had to have something and bypassed better players even at his position, selecting solely need and fit and not talent. 

The key here is the happy medium between all 3. That's what's worked for this team and why they have picked so well in round 1 for well over a decade now.

[Dallas94Ware]

1 hour ago, Northland said:

I love JPJ but getting him will require trading up.  He'd look good in a Dallas uniform.  I see the Steelers and Dolphins as big threats for his services.

I was really impressed with Payton Wilson as well.  Smart and very athletic LB.  He's going to make some team very happy.

Yeah that was my.point. that if he lasts until the late teens. It would solely be because he is viewed as a center and center is typically a low value position in terms of draft capital; and if he does last til that range, Jerry would be foolish to not look to make that deal!

Sometimes I miss the old days of Jerry making moves to get the guys he wants. We make much better choices now, with McClay running the scouting department and Stephen anchoring Jerry's eagerness to some realism.

But when you love a guy and the fit is fantastic on top of the talent itself, and the risk of missing out on that guy is very high even if it's only by 4, 5, 6 selections. Then you need to be on the phone testing the waters of what it would cost to get him.

Drafting is itself such an ultimate crap shoot. And more darts to throw is always nice. As it increases your chances of a bullseye. But if there is a clear (as clear as an unproven rookie can be, anyway) bullseye staring you in the face, sometimes giving up a couple of those extra darts to nail that bullseye is worth it. Jerry used to just surrender his darts willy nilly and I'm glad he doesn't anymore. But not surrendering them AT ALL I think sometimes holds the team back from something spectacular.

The last real attempt at a first round trade up was back in the 2016 draft when they tried to trade back up into late round 1 to get Paxton Lynch. I'm glad that didn't pan out, but that is a very long time to go without pushing the chips in and really trying to make a move for the guy you want.

[MaddHatter]

Quinyon Michell made a strong case to be CB1 and top 5 pick

[Dallas94Ware]

Anyone have a list of who Dallas has spent time with? I saw something on X but now I can't find it