Jesse James TD that got called back

[TXsteeler]

2 minutes ago, lancerman said:

You are confusing control of the ball and possession. Just having the ball in your hands for a few seconds and being able to turn it is only one feature of a catch 

AS STATED by the terrible rule of the NFL. There is a reason every single player saying it wasn't a TD prefaced it by calling it a terrible rule. You can easily change the rule.

[TXsteeler]

2 minutes ago, lancerman said:

There's about a dozen plays every game where a receiver catches the ball and moves his arms enough where by your definition it would be a catch and then it either comes out a split second later or an immediate impact dislodges it before he's able to move. All of those become fumbles. 

Teams wont want to pass as much anymore 

There are nowhere near as many plays similar to the Dez catch or this one that happen in regular games that would become fumbles. A player catching the ball in midair before being immediately hit and having it pop out is not the same as a player catching the ball and lunging for a TD or first down and having this happen. 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/pass_att_single_game.htm

The rules didn't use to work like this and yet most of the highest passing attempts in a game happened before 10 years ago. It will not significantly effect the game like you claim it will.

[lancerman]

4 minutes ago, TXsteeler said:

AS STATED by the terrible rule of the NFL. There is a reason every single player saying it wasn't a TD prefaced it by calling it a terrible rule. You can easily change the rule.

You can't easily change the rule with any consistency without dramatically increasing the amount of fumbles on what once would have been incomplete passes. It's impossible unless you want to have two seperate standards for what a catch is at the goal line and in the field of play. 

Saying something is bad doesn't mean there is an easy fix to it. 

[TXsteeler]

1 minute ago, lancerman said:

You can't easily change the rule with any consistency without dramatically increasing the amount of fumbles on what once would have been incomplete passes. It's impossible unless you want to have two seperate standards for what a catch is at the goal line and in the field of play. 

Saying something is bad doesn't mean there is an easy fix to it. 

You are continuing to ignore that the NFL did not use to have this catch rule issue and there were not 5 fumbles a game per team.

[lancerman]

2 minutes ago, TXsteeler said:

There are nowhere near as many plays similar to the Dez catch or this one that happen in regular games that would become fumbles. A player catching the ball in midair before being immediately hit and having it pop out is not the same as a player catching the ball and lunging for a TD or first down and having this happen. 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/pass_att_single_game.htm

The rules didn't use to work like this and yet most of the highest passing attempts in a game happened before 10 years ago. It will not significantly effect the game like you claim it will.

You're thinking of it in the micro. The way you would have to change the rule to make Dez's catch an incompletion. A lot of times it isn't a player simply catching the ball mid air and having it pop out right away. A lot of times it's a guy with both hands on the ball trying to turn his body or lunging or moving the ball with his arms before it comes out. Which would all be fumbles. 

[lancerman]

1 minute ago, TXsteeler said:

You are continuing to ignore that the NFL did not use to have this catch rule issue and there were not 5 fumbles a game per team.

Thats because there used to be massive inconsistencies on what constituted a catch. 

[lancerman]

10 minutes ago, sammymvpknight said:

There is a big problem when the rules defy very basic logic. Let’s make the games more simple. What happened to the good old days of football when the refs made the call based on their own best judgement. They got 95% of the calls right without the high end technology. That’s about the same percentage they do now with instant replay. I say just get rid of it and let the refs earn their paychecks. 

The fans wanted instant replay. 

[CKSteeler]

The NCAA somehow manages to have a simpler catch rule that doesn't result in endless fumbles and a more efficient instant replay system that doesn't produce anywhere near this controversy on a near weekly basis.

Even by the rule, it's not clear this wasn't a catch at all. Nor is it something that the refs in this league consistently would call an incomplete pass even after replay despite the NFL having centralized the process.

[CKSteeler]

And for all the talk on this catch, there's still the matter of the bogus DPI on Burns. When there's only one phantom DPI called a game, we consider it a good day for the officials in this league.

[Hunter2_1]

1 hour ago, sammymvpknight said:

Rules should not defy common sense. If 19 out of 20 call it a catch (and the one that doesn’t happens to be a Pats fan)...the rules should work in the favor of 19 and not 1.

I've never known salt like Bill fans. Unreal.

[CKSteeler]

Here's what I know. The Pats had 2 penalties all game for 5 yards. Not a single judgement call went against them throughout that entire contest. In the final minutes, we saw a phantom DPI on Burns, a no-call on Eli Rogers being held on the game's final real play, and the overturned TD.

I can go through just yesterday's games and find examples of similar plays being called TD's. We already saw the example of Cook's catch where he clearly falls to the ground with it moving underneath him. The letter of the rule is not anywhere near as clear as some want to claim nor is this something we consistently see enforced. Nor, for that matter, can anyone actually show that James didn't keep his hand underneath that football. But it was overturned, nonetheless.

And let's say this rule is as clear as some here want it to be. What the hell does it say for the NFL that its diehard fans can't keep up with something as basic to the game as what is or isn't a catch?

EDIT: This play, as in the case of so many other key plays we see every week, is another instant of the NFL making something a judgement call. An inevitably, judgement calls will lead to controversy because your refs can't and won't enforce them consistently. Then you factor in replay and you end up with even more of a mess.

[Hunter2_1]

8 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

Here's what I know. The Pats had 2 penalties all game for 5 yards. Not a single judgement call went against them throughout that entire contest. In the final minutes, we saw a phantom DPI on Burns, a no-call on Eli Rogers being held on the game's final real play, and the overturned TD.

Well that makes a change because we've been whistled off the park throughout the season. We had a 15 to 2 in favour of opposition against CAR I believe. Refs are brutal, we know this

Quote

I can go through just yesterday's games and find examples of similar plays being called TD's. We already saw the example of Cook's catch where he clearly falls to the ground with it moving underneath him. The letter of the rule is not anywhere near as clear as some want to claim nor is this something we consistently see enforced. Nor, for that matter, can anyone actually show that James didn't keep his hand underneath that football. But it was overturned, nonetheless.

The refs are inconsistent

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And let's say this rule is as clear as some here want it to be. What the hell does it say for the NFL that its diehard fans can't keep up with something as basic to the game as what is or isn't a catch?

Crazy rule, but they had to think of a way of being consistent. They decided to go down the route of ridiculous complexities.

Quote

EDIT: This play, as in the case of so many other key plays we see every week, is another instant of the NFL making something a judgement call. An inevitably, judgement calls will lead to controversy because your refs can't and won't enforce them consistently. Then you factor in replay and you end up with even more of a mess.

I don't think this is a judgement call. I think it's letter of the law (which I don't like). They said the ball hit the ground, based on video replay. Not a judgement call - an evidence based call

[lancerman]

It wasn't a judgment call. There's a clear a clear angle where the nose of the ball touches the ground and the ball pops resulting in the player having one hand on top of the ball and another on its side it is literally impossible for anything else to have occurred. You'd have to assume that gravity ceased to exist in that moment to think the ball didn't hit the ground.

[TXsteeler]

23 minutes ago, lancerman said:

It wasn't a judgment call. There's a clear a clear angle where the nose of the ball touches the ground and the ball pops resulting in the player having one hand on top of the ball and another on its side it is literally impossible for anything else to have occurred. You'd have to assume that gravity ceased to exist in that moment to think the ball didn't hit the ground.

You cannot prove it wasn't the ground hitting his left hand which popped the ball up.

[TXsteeler]

31 minutes ago, Hunter2_1 said:

The refs are inconsistent

Crazy rule, but they had to think of a way of being consistent.

lmao.