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Three McCarthy questions


OneTwoSixFive

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The central player in the upheavel at the Packers is MikeMcCarthy. He will determine his coordinators and orchestrate, or at least maintain overwatch on, his position coach hires. He is likely to at least have some effect on the new GM hire. Here are three questions to answer, that I hope will help us all understand where we are, on this polarising head coach.

1) Is Mike McCarthy a good head coach, let down by the quality of his coaching hires ?

2) Is McCarthy's playbook in need of a large scale overhaul (by himself - or with help from other sharp offensive minds) ?

3) Is McCarthy let down by the quality of his team ?

 

These three questions contain within them many more questions that feed into them. Depending on the answers you give, it should clarify how you(we) view him, going forward. This is all about what changes need to be made to make the Packers better, and this upheavel would not have happened if the organisation didn't feel SOME change was required.

 

Wherever the main fault lies, THAT is where things need to be fixed. It may be that it will turn out that the changes needed have already been made, it may not. I won't give my own opinions yet as I want fans to come at this from a viewpoint not coloured by my own thoughts. So..........the man himself, the other coaches/coordinators, the playbook, the players - what do you think ?

 

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McCarthy is a good head coach and a great leader of men. This team has been very consistent with him.

The issue is their player acquisition philosophy and defensive system philosophy were not aligned. 

As far as offense goes... his scheme could be better (like a McVay’s) but his offense is proven. Pieces have just gotten older and the hit rate on talent has dipped a bit.

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My conjecture is that MM is a very good head coach.  By that I mean he's strong at teaching, leading, locker room presence, keeping the team steady and focused in face of adversity. 

A weakness and strength of MM is that he's stuck with his coaching staff through good and bad when another coach may have been quicker to fire people.  I think this was very true with special teams coaching - way too long to get a new coach there.  It could be true that Capers should have been let go sooner; this to me is murkier -- decimated by injuries esp in the d-backfield the last 2 years have hurt that side of the ball.  It also seems like high defensive picks have been a wash -- Jones, Thorton, Worthy, Neal, (and Sherrod on the O line).  None of these guys have played like top tier players on other teams since leaving GB.  That, to me, is a TT draft problem, not a Capers coaching problem.

I think being the sole/prime play caller may have been leading him to be less creative - guessing that the majority of ideas of what plays actually get run and schemes run come from him with only some input from others.  In this regard, the O playbook can stand for refreshing and new blood; not necessarily overhaul.  If TT has properly assessed the value of Nelson, Cobb and now Adams as being worthy of 10M each/year, if they can't get open, then MM's offensive plays are sub-par and need to be upgraded.  I think this is true.  All too often, AR is forced to thread the needle as his WRs get no separation.  Is this sub-par route running, bad routes?  I think it's lack of creative pass plays.  I often see other teams have wide open receivers by running (mis-direction) plays GB never runs...just the same old, same old.

MM somewhat let down by team quality.  GB needs more quality across the board with the linebackers.  A TE and stud RB would help too.  WR depends on answer to above paragraph.

 

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Mac is a great players coach and a great offensive mind. 

Mac's biggest enemy has been that his team can't stay healthy. He's shaken up the S&C staff, focused on analytics, added new age nutritionists, changed practice schedules, nothing's worked. I'm convinced it's just bad luck at this point.

My biggest thing I hope he changes is a quick death to his Lacy/Starks era one RB per drive. If the defense and down and distance call for it use all 3 RBs in a matter of 3 downs. I think we could have something special with that group, but it's far less appealing if Mac plays one of them at a time.

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The only legitimate flaws I would point out about MM:

  1. He is not very good at in-game clock management, or handling of the "game operations".  We frequently call TOs in bad situations, and sometimes make bone-headed decisions to challenge plays of minimal impact.  He has improved slightly, but only slightly in the challenge department.
  2. He has not trained and successfully offloaded any of his responsibilities.  He still operates as a glorified OC despite attempts to relieve himself of some of his responsibility.  McCarthy has the potential to positively impact other areas of the football team (like defense and STs) but his staff has failed to allow him the freedom to do that.  Which is a failure on his part.
  3. He stubbornly stuck with Capers and other assistants (that STs guy before zook) for a little bit too long (1-2 extra seasons). 
    1. Contrasting that there's really only one example I can remember where his loyalty was justified and rewarded: Mason Crosby.  Most would have cut Mason and moved on.  Mac didn't, and he was rewarded.  Capers outweighs Crosby.

Some positives (adding on to what's already been covered here):

He's an exceptional playcaller and his offensive schemes are valid in today's NFL.

His offensive philosphy and during the week game plan have won us many regular season games, and a few playoff games (Atlanta) as well.

Many of his offensive assistants have consistently trained average-below average draft capital into above average talent.

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McCarthy....Pros...

Top 10 NFL coach, regardless of who is under center.  Team responds to him.  Even when outgunned, they appears well prepared for games.  Teams generally do not make dumb penalties.  Was a top offensive mind with different schemes.  Much credit needs to be given to him for developing an offense around Aaron Rodgers and his unique skills set, run pass options, shotgun running sets, up tempo gameplans...etc.

McCarthy...Cons...

Much of his credit can be directly linked to two HOF quarterbacks.  Cannot deny that.  Generally a poor in-game offensive coach.  Bad challenges, poor communication can lead to burned time outs.  Highly complex offensive system depends on QB and WR's reading defenses together.  Could say that he doesn't scheme players open.  Can be described as being overly loyal to assistant coaches.

That's how I see it.  I think much of where Mac is weak can be helped out with Philbin.  In-game stuff.  Game management.  

Can GB move on from him?  Absolutely.  With Rodgers, any head coach is going to have success.  Should they?  I don't think so.  And if GB does move on, Mac will be unemployed for exactly as long as he wants to be unemployed...he's that good.  His defensive coordinator hire is a big one.  If he can lock that down I think the club is setup nicely.

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@Vegas492

That almost perfectly describes how I feel. The only thing worth adding is that i thought MM was forced to plug in UDFAs and rookies more than he should have. That is on Ted's activity in vet free agency.............And no, I'm not suggesting the Packers should turn into the Redskins of a few years back, just be a bit more active in hole-plugging with vets, a road they already seem to be travelling down.

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No denying that statement, OneTwoSixFive.  I understood why it had to happen, early on in TT's tenure.  But lately it seemed a little, uh, a lot ridiculous.  I still do not forgive TT for not finding a corner two years ago the moment that Shields went down.  He sat on his hands and that team suffered for it.

You need some of those mid tier vets to round out the roster.  

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2 hours ago, IBleedGreen&Gold said:

So MM reports to Murphy. Not sure I am excited about that. 

That is a disaster in the making. MM should report to BG. Anything elses is asking for a future of toxic relations between the two (MM, BG).

I can understand (from Murphy's viewpoint) the temptation to play the top dog who plays two guys off each other, someone who is only too willing to hear the dirt on the other guy. It is NOT a good way to manage. Not saying Murphy shouldn't talk to MM, he should, but if BG is Mike's boss, they should be the ones talking every day.

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On 1/8/2018 at 10:28 AM, vegas492 said:

No denying that statement, OneTwoSixFive.  I understood why it had to happen, early on in TT's tenure.  But lately it seemed a little, uh, a lot ridiculous.  I still do not forgive TT for not finding a corner two years ago the moment that Shields went down.  He sat on his hands and that team suffered for it.

You need some of those mid tier vets to round out the roster.  

Nor I for him not locking down Randy Moss between draft day 1 and 2 a number of years back...letting him escape to New England

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On 1/6/2018 at 3:57 PM, OneTwoSixFive said:

1) Is Mike McCarthy a good head coach, let down by the quality of his coaching hires ?

2) Is McCarthy's playbook in need of a large scale overhaul (by himself - or with help from other sharp offensive minds) ?

3) Is McCarthy let down by the quality of his team ?

I kinda want to say "yes" to all three questions.  

I definitely feel like the quality of the 52 guys not named Aaron Rodgers has been short, particularly when further compromised by injuries.  Most of the time, I feel like the Packers are out-talented....  apart from #12.  

Also feel like some of the coaching has been mediocre.  

I think MM is a good coach, in leading men and keeping them going.  I admit it's always hard to evaluate:  is he a good coach, or just a guy who happens to be riding a great QB?  Not sure I can tell.  But yeah, I think some of the offense is stale and could use some fresh ideas to help somehow scheme guys open who don't have the speed or quickness to get very open on their own.  

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