Mid Iowa Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 With the uncertainty of Okafor, and the clear lack of required talent at DE, I like the move. Can you imagine what would have happened last season had Jordan gone down, or not have played 93.29% of the snaps? Okafor was the next closest DE at 45.94% Only Ramczyk, Unger, and Brees played more snaps than Jordan. The guy needs help!! No matter how you shake it, we NEEEEEDED depth at DE, bigtime. And yes, we'll all agree that Davenport likely would have been there at 27, or even 19... yet, what if he wasn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 39 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said: With the uncertainty of Okafor, and the clear lack of required talent at DE, I like the move. Can you imagine what would have happened last season had Jordan gone down, or not have played 93.29% of the snaps? Okafor was the next closest DE at 45.94% Only Ramczyk, Unger, and Brees played more snaps than Jordan. The guy needs help!! No matter how you shake it, we NEEEEEDED depth at DE, bigtime. And yes, we'll all agree that Davenport likely would have been there at 27, or even 19... yet, what if he wasn't? It's crazy how many snaps Ramczyk played. I love last year's draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted May 1, 2018 Author Share Posted May 1, 2018 2 hours ago, Jlowe22 said: It's crazy how many snaps Ramczyk played. Didn’t miss an offensive snap all season. Playing with a hip injury starting multiple positions still beasted kamara and Lattimore playing like all pros really made it hard for people to realize how well Ramy and Williams played Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted May 1, 2018 Author Share Posted May 1, 2018 If we took Ramy in Lattimores spot and Williams in Ramy spot and never drafted Kamara or Lattimore it still would’ve been a good draft remove our 2 best players and it’s still a good draft. Let that sink in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckoz24 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 I really believe Ireland know what's he's doing. Even if it was a bad draft, he's still had two epic drafts compared to one. The only thing that will cause the fan base problems is the quantity of quality picks, obviously we won't hit that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodatworm23 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 5 hours ago, ckoz24 said: I really believe Ireland know what's he's doing. Even if it was a bad draft, he's still had two epic drafts compared to one. The only thing that will cause the fan base problems is the quantity of quality picks, obviously we won't hit that. We can look at this Davenport selection one of two ways... Ireland drafted (traded up for) Dion Jordan while GM in Miami. Jordan largly considered a bust mainly due to substance abuse issues but appears to be turning his life around in Seattle. When Ireland drafted Jordan he wasn't the head of scouting and was in a position where he leaned in his scouting dept. He clearly missed on Jordans character but his talent was clear. The other camp is that Ireland was instrumental in 2005 with the Cowboys drafting Demarcus Ware 11th overall. Ireland was the new director of college scouting and convinced Jerry Jones that Ware would not be availabe with their other 1st rounder that year (20). Jones sided with Ireland and drafted Ware 11th overall. HC Bill Parcells wanted LSU DE Marcus Spears with that selection but eventually got Spears at 20. So the question is... Where will Davenport trend towards? Like with both Ware and Jordan the talent is evident and worth the selection but character and commitment is what seprated the two. I think Ireland learned a valuable lesson from the Jordan pick and that's why we heard Payton glow over Davenports mental make up and character. This is just my opinion but I truly believe that Davenport will be the best selection of the Ireland era and when you consider our draft haul last year thats saying something. Davenport will have 10+ sacks as a rookie and Jeff Ireland will be running another franchise in 2019. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Iowa Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 3 hours ago, whodatworm23 said: The other camp is that Ireland was instrumental in 2005 with the Cowboys drafting Demarcus Ware 11th overall. Ireland was the new director of college scouting and convinced Jerry Jones that Ware would not be availabe with their other 1st rounder that year (20). So the question is... Where will Davenport trend towards? Like with both Ware and Jordan the talent is evident and worth the selection but character and commitment is what seprated the two. I think Ireland learned a valuable lesson from the Jordan pick and that's why we heard Payton glow over Davenports mental make up and character. From everything I've read, Davenport will have zero character issues. He's a very modest, humble person. Go watch his highlight reel. He doesn't showboat or jabber jaw, he just goes out and makes plays. I watched some film on him yesterday. I'd say his only fault was been that he leans in too much, so a good QB will step up in the pocket and he'll blow right by them in the Pro level. Fortunately, that issue can be fixed. It's not a physical thing, it's a practice and learning thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodatworm23 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 So Raves, JT Barrett has decided to try out with the Saints and not the Colts. I believe we spoke about him a while back and his fit here. I know hes a conservative QB with development needed as a passer but I like his athleticism, leadership and Character. I know it might be wishful thinking but id rather see Taysom Hill win the backup job and Barrett the 3rd string over Savage being on the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 19 minutes ago, whodatworm23 said: So Raves, JT Barrett has decided to try out with the Saints and not the Colts. I believe we spoke about him a while back and his fit here. I know hes a conservative QB with development needed as a passer but I like his athleticism, leadership and Character. I know it might be wishful thinking but id rather see Taysom Hill win the backup job and Barrett the 3rd string over Savage being on the roster. I'm still sticking to my guns on him. I think he's a good back-up QB option that can come in and finish a game for a starter, but won't be the guy you plan to build your future around. After his first year starting something made him go ultra-conservative so he never tried to throw guys open and normally waited for them to get open completely before throwing. I think he has the arm to make all the throws this offense requires, but not the mentality. So I guess that's where I disagree wit you. I would prefer Barrett to be the #2 QB, the guy you expect to come in and finish a game, but have Hill still as the #3 as we develop him into a player ready to be a starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckoz24 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 4 hours ago, whodatworm23 said: We can look at this Davenport selection one of two ways... Ireland drafted (traded up for) Dion Jordan while GM in Miami. Jordan largly considered a bust mainly due to substance abuse issues but appears to be turning his life around in Seattle. When Ireland drafted Jordan he wasn't the head of scouting and was in a position where he leaned in his scouting dept. He clearly missed on Jordans character but his talent was clear. The other camp is that Ireland was instrumental in 2005 with the Cowboys drafting Demarcus Ware 11th overall. Ireland was the new director of college scouting and convinced Jerry Jones that Ware would not be availabe with their other 1st rounder that year (20). Jones sided with Ireland and drafted Ware 11th overall. HC Bill Parcells wanted LSU DE Marcus Spears with that selection but eventually got Spears at 20. So the question is... Where will Davenport trend towards? Like with both Ware and Jordan the talent is evident and worth the selection but character and commitment is what seprated the two. I think Ireland learned a valuable lesson from the Jordan pick and that's why we heard Payton glow over Davenports mental make up and character. This is just my opinion but I truly believe that Davenport will be the best selection of the Ireland era and when you consider our draft haul last year thats saying something. Davenport will have 10+ sacks as a rookie and Jeff Ireland will be running another franchise in 2019. If this is the case, I hope they promote Loomis to President of the Saints Organization and promote Ireland into his role. We can't let the guy go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodatworm23 Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 16 hours ago, Raves said: I'm still sticking to my guns on him. I think he's a good back-up QB option that can come in and finish a game for a starter, but won't be the guy you plan to build your future around. After his first year starting something made him go ultra-conservative so he never tried to throw guys open and normally waited for them to get open completely before throwing. I think he has the arm to make all the throws this offense requires, but not the mentality. So I guess that's where I disagree wit you. I would prefer Barrett to be the #2 QB, the guy you expect to come in and finish a game, but have Hill still as the #3 as we develop him into a player ready to be a starter. I hear what your saying... My report on him was a 6th round grade and a logical fit in Payton's offense like we spoke on weeks ago so getting him on a 3 year URFA deal has mr excited. Hes a prospect I feel can pay dividends down the road even if that means developing into just a really good backup but i do believe there is a chance he can be more than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Iowa Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 On 5/1/2018 at 7:18 AM, Raves said: I'm still sticking to my guns on him. I think he's a good back-up QB option that can come in and finish a game for a starter, but won't be the guy you plan to build your future around. After his first year starting something made him go ultra-conservative so he never tried to throw guys open and normally waited for them to get open completely before throwing. I think he has the arm to make all the throws this offense requires, but not the mentality. So I guess that's where I disagree wit you. I would prefer Barrett to be the #2 QB, the guy you expect to come in and finish a game, but have Hill still as the #3 as we develop him into a player ready to be a starter. I can't make a call on #2 or #3 at this point due to lack of film on Hill. Frankly, at this point I'm not sold on either as an NFL starter. I don't think Hill will ever be "the guy". I do think Barrett could be in time. Taysom Hill: Has happy feet and is a read option QB, he's not a pocket passer at all. Generally looks to run rather than pass, although he slowed that role after his 4th year Senior injury. Rarely throws a deep ball, but he's fairly accurate, especially on crossing routes, but he throws a lot of picks. He's injury prone, but also recovers well. The guy has wheels, and he's got great vision, especially when fining an open hole to run through, and open receivers when the field is busy. JT Barrett: Pocket passer with really good accuracy. Protects the ball/possession, and knows where everyone is supposed to be. Is very, very good at throwing his receivers open - back shoulder and low & outside throws. Often under throws receivers past 30 yards telling me his deep ball is not there. Is a good scrambler. Doesn't have the Hill type vision, but darn good anyway. Very good in the red zone, which is what the Saints are built for. He's small, so like Drew Brees, he'll never amount to anything, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 9 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said: I can't make a call on #2 or #3 at this point due to lack of film on Hill. Frankly, at this point I'm not sold on either as an NFL starter. I don't think Hill will ever be "the guy". I do think Barrett could be in time. I guess the way I see it, is that your #2 guy is who you think can come in and finish a game for you if your starter goes down. He doesn't have to be your QB of the future or even a guy you would want to play for multiple games, just someone that can get you out of a game with a lead if you already have one. Now if your #2 QB also is the guy you are grooming to be the future, even better as you already have trust that he can come in and play for the starter if need be. The #3 guy I often think of as a guy that you want to see if they can develop into your #1 QB down the line but they just might not be ready to come in and play right away, granted most teams don't carry more than 2 QBs on the roster in the NFL so it's seen less often. This actually is a direct reflection based on JT while at Ohio State. He was actually slated as the #3 QB with Cardale Jones as the #2 QB. When Braxton Miller went down with the injury prior to the season, instead of Urban Meyer just slotting his #2 QB as the starter, who was more experienced and familiar with the playbook, he went with JT Barrett who had the more upside in the long term than Jones. I put the same situation with JT in the position of a #2 QB for the NFL, he'll take over midgame/few games in a season, but if we were needing a QB for the entire season it'd be better to go with Hill and see what he has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodatworm23 Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 17 hours ago, Raves said: I guess the way I see it, is that your #2 guy is who you think can come in and finish a game for you if your starter goes down. He doesn't have to be your QB of the future or even a guy you would want to play for multiple games, just someone that can get you out of a game with a lead if you already have one. Now if your #2 QB also is the guy you are grooming to be the future, even better as you already have trust that he can come in and play for the starter if need be. The #3 guy I often think of as a guy that you want to see if they can develop into your #1 QB down the line but they just might not be ready to come in and play right away, granted most teams don't carry more than 2 QBs on the roster in the NFL so it's seen less often. This actually is a direct reflection based on JT while at Ohio State. He was actually slated as the #3 QB with Cardale Jones as the #2 QB. When Braxton Miller went down with the injury prior to the season, instead of Urban Meyer just slotting his #2 QB as the starter, who was more experienced and familiar with the playbook, he went with JT Barrett who had the more upside in the long term than Jones. I put the same situation with JT in the position of a #2 QB for the NFL, he'll take over midgame/few games in a season, but if we were needing a QB for the entire season it'd be better to go with Hill and see what he has. I think Barrett has the potential to develop and carve out a career similar to that of Tyrod Taylor. The things i ask myself is how much better would Taylor be had he groomed under Payton and Brees for the 1st 2-3 years of his career? See where im going here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Iowa Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 5 hours ago, whodatworm23 said: See where im going here... Yup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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