MookieMonstah Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Pastor Dillon said: That still requires a team to take on 15 million in HIlls deal. A team would try and make it work for Love, but not for Hill Yeah Hills deal is brutal, so is TTs. Lebron definitely has options if Cleveland is willing to work with him though, if not it's basically LA, CLE or Philly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Dillon Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Just now, kempus said: Kevin Durant will never, ever be considered a better player than Lebron James. Regardless of how many rings or Finals MVPs he wins with the Warriors. That's because Lebron has been hyped up more than any player in history. People take it as a personal offense if someone even brings up the idea of someone passing the great Lebron James. Durant could average 35 a game for the next 5 years, win 7 straight rings, 7 striaght finals MVPs, 5 straight regular season MVPs and people would still say "nope, he just isnt lebron" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Dillon Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Just now, MookieMonster said: Yeah Hills deal is brutal, so is TTs. Lebron definitely has options if Cleveland is willing to work with him though, if not it's basically LA, CLE or Philly. They might as well flip Lebron and hill to Houston for the entire roster. THey would actually save money and have some guys they could move in other deals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kempus Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Pastor Dillon said: That's because Lebron has been hyped up more than any player in history. People take it as a personal offense if someone even brings up the idea of someone passing the great Lebron James. Durant could average 35 a game for the next 5 years, win 7 straight rings, 7 striaght finals MVPs, 5 straight regular season MVPs and people would still say "nope, he just isnt lebron" It's nothing to do with that. Lebron is simply a better player. Don't try to make up a narative to support your ridiculous argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookieMonstah Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Raves said: The bare minimum NO would have to trade just to match salaries would be Nirotic, Diallo, Moore, and Ajinca. Then all the Cavs are getting are expiring contracts and a potential flip in Moore to a team looking for a 3+D guy. The first pick the Cavs coudl get, outside of 2nd round picks, would be a 2020 1st round pick. Mirotic and Moore could both be flipped for picks. Diallo is a good, young piece. Pelicans would give them 2020,2022,2024 and 2026 if it got the deal done I bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookieMonstah Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, Pastor Dillon said: That's because Lebron has been hyped up more than any player in history. People take it as a personal offense if someone even brings up the idea of someone passing the great Lebron James. Durant could average 35 a game for the next 5 years, win 7 straight rings, 7 striaght finals MVPs, 5 straight regular season MVPs and people would still say "nope, he just isnt lebron" No, Lebron is just a better player. Lebron is the most scrutinized athlete of all time and the only mistake the man has made was a PR blunder. MJ was generally a ****** but people put him up on this great pedestal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, MWil23 said: If LeBron gives them an ultimatum that the only way he stays is if they do exactly that, which I think will most likely happen to be honest. I wholeheartedly disagree. They're resetting in 2019-2020 either way, so making one last desperate run isn't out of the question. On paper, yes. But banking on a 21 year old rookie, not drafted in the top 5, to come in and be a legitimate championship caliber limelight player is unrealistic at best. I think that they could do a lot of those things already after trading the #8 pick for a player/packaging some of those guys. I wouldn't be surprised if/when they deal KLove either. Kyle Korver has some value as a sharp-shooter off of the bench as well. TT's deal is an absolute KILLER on this team right now and I said so two years ago. Then the Cavs would likely say no unless the ultimatum came with a contract extension. Keeping LeBron for one year and trading the #8 pick + whatever relief they would have for a player that mgiht not even be with the team in 2019-2020 as well, jsut doesn't make sense. If LeBron signs an actual extension, 100% make the trade, if not, don't bother. If they are resetting in 2019-2020 why are they goign to trade assets that would help that for a chance to lose to the Warriors again. There is no trade that the #8 pick and expiring salaries will create to allow the Cavs to stand a chance against the Warriors. Adding the #8 and Love will likely just end up in an overall downgrade for the team. Where was Klay Thompson drafted? How about Kawhi Leonard? This draft is deeper than in years past of players that can make an immediate impact. I think the top 9 guys could all make immediate impact on teams both contending and rebuilding. I think Love ends up getting dealt as well, but it won't end up being a trade that is meant to get them to compete as Love won't bring in an upgrade due to his ability to opt-out after next season and attaching assets to Love means they are mortgaging a rebuild for make a 5th straight finals. Korver has some value true, but not amazing. TT I think so probably has more value than people think, his deal is an overpay but his ability to help a contender is there. It's not like Deng or Parsons' contracts where you have to attach a premium pick to get rid of it, but it's not going to be moved easily. Also I agreed it was an overpay and if it wasn't for LeBron saying he wanted TT I think they would've just let him walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 7 minutes ago, MookieMonster said: Yeah Hills deal is brutal, so is TTs. Lebron definitely has options if Cleveland is willing to work with him though, if not it's basically LA, CLE or Philly. George Hills contract is actually very good. It's 20 million next year and then only $1 million guaranteed in 2020 so virtually an expiring $20 million contract. Definitely a valuable trade piece for teams wanting to clear space to make a run at the 2019 FA class that will likely contain Klay, LeBron, and possibly PG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 5 minutes ago, MookieMonster said: No, Lebron is just a better player. Lebron is the most scrutinized athlete of all time and the only mistake the man has made was a PR blunder. MJ was generally a ****** but people put him up on this great pedestal. Honestly if LeBron didn't make that ridiculous "The Decision" mistake people in Cleveland would've just accepted him leaving to try and win a championship with no hard feelings. At the time I actually said that I though Chicago was the best destination for him, Rose coming off MVP season, Boozer, Deng, Butler etc, but obviously that was before people knew of the Bosh plan to Miami as well. No one thought he would go on national television to announce his decision just to leave Cleveland, that was what hurt. If he just went through the FA process like everyone else and decided to leave, it would've sucked but we would've moved on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookieMonstah Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Guy made a bad PR move but donated all the money to charity and people still salty. MJ was a borderline scum bag his entire playing career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Raves said: Then the Cavs would likely say no unless the ultimatum came with a contract extension. Keeping LeBron for one year and trading the #8 pick + whatever relief they would have for a player that mgiht not even be with the team in 2019-2020 as well, jsut doesn't make sense. If LeBron signs an actual extension, 100% make the trade, if not, don't bother. Yes and No. I mean, if that player puts them over the edge and keeps them competitive and a legitimate NBA Finals contender (unlike the last year or two), that's probably enough for LeBron to stay and sign long term. If you don't do this, then you risk losing LeBron, end up drafting a "pretty good" talent at #8, but likely not a superstar (obviously there are exceptions), and live in NBA draft lottery/barely missing the lottery purgatory for the next 2-5 years. I'd rather trade pick 8, move other players, and get LeBron for a year, and then if he bolts, hit the hard reset button earlier than go that route. 1 minute ago, Raves said: If they are resetting in 2019-2020 why are they goign to trade assets that would help that for a chance to lose to the Warriors again. There is no trade that the #8 pick and expiring salaries will create to allow the Cavs to stand a chance against the Warriors. Adding the #8 and Love will likely just end up in an overall downgrade for the team. See the above. You avoid purgatory and go straight to full tank mode without making it look like it. 1 minute ago, Raves said: Where was Klay Thompson drafted? How about Kawhi Leonard? This draft is deeper than in years past of players that can make an immediate impact. I think the top 9 guys could all make immediate impact on teams both contending and rebuilding. Where was Aminu Al-Farouq? Brandon Knight? Jimmer Fredette? Caldwell Pope? Ben McLemore? Trey Burke? Nik Stauskas? See, I can play that game too. 1 minute ago, Raves said: I think Love ends up getting dealt as well, but it won't end up being a trade that is meant to get them to compete as Love won't bring in an upgrade due to his ability to opt-out after next season and attaching assets to Love means they are mortgaging a rebuild for make a 5th straight finals. Korver has some value true, but not amazing. TT I think so probably has more value than people think, his deal is an overpay but his ability to help a contender is there. It's not like Deng or Parsons' contracts where you have to attach a premium pick to get rid of it, but it's not going to be moved easily. Also I agreed it was an overpay and if it wasn't for LeBron saying he wanted TT I think they would've just let him walk. I guess we'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 @MWil23 1. Name a player that the Cavs can get for Love and the #8 pick that will put them over the top. I'll wait. Also this draft isn't like previous years draft where #8 will get you pretty good. This draft has 9 legit players in it that have All-Star or better potential. Ayton/Bagley/JJJr/Doncic/Young/MPJ/Mikal Bridges/Carter/Sexton all have the potential to be big time players in the NBA and the Cavs would be guaranteed a chance at one of them at #8. Also whether LeBron leaves this year, or he leaves next year, they're going to end up taking a big step back. Any team that loses LeBron will unless they didn't completely cave into his demands for winning now. If Irving hadn't forced his way out of town the Cavs would be in a much different situation as they would still have Irving + Love to build around, though obviously no #8 pick. 2. The Cavs are going into purgatory regardless. Although they could potentially make the playoffs with Hill/JR/(Mikal Bridges)/Love/TT, at least competing for the 8th seed, they'll end up needing to make moves as Love has the ability to leave in 2020 if he chooses as well. For all Love has done for the Cavs I would ask him if he wanted to be a part of a rebuild, if he said yes then I keep him around else I would trade him to a playoff team looking to win as he deserves it. 3. Jahlil Okafor, Dante Exum, Aaron Gordon, Cody Zeller, Alex Len, Anthony Bennet (lulz) and i can continue to name average or worse players picked in the top 5. Some drafts are weak, some are strong. This draft is definitely strong. Just because a player was picked top 5, or even #1, doesn't really tell the story of whether they will be good or not. The 2013 draft was horrible, sure some players have developed into great players like Giannis, Gobert, McCollumn, Oladipo (finally), but much of the rest of the draft was junk and was considered as much when it happened. 4. I guess we will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seminoles1 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 30 minutes ago, Pastor Dillon said: That's because Lebron has been hyped up more than any player in history. People take it as a personal offense if someone even brings up the idea of someone passing the great Lebron James. Durant could average 35 a game for the next 5 years, win 7 straight rings, 7 striaght finals MVPs, 5 straight regular season MVPs and people would still say "nope, he just isnt lebron" That's not true at all. None of that is realistic, so don't act butthurt because you keep bringing this up and no one agrees. By your admission Durant's only argument is going to be "Ringz", and the vast majority of people who are witnessing him play understand that it's because he joined an existing superteam because he couldn't beat his 2 contemporaries. That's not going to be enough to overcome everything else LeBron has going for him in the debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckrock101 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 35 minutes ago, Pastor Dillon said: Philly is a 10x better situation for PG than OKC is I'd just been thinking about that today. Assuming lebron doesn't go to philly, feel like PG to Philly would be a great move for team and player. 6ers get a top wing who can shoot, not to mention a core of Simmons/PG/Embiid is unbelievable defensively. for George, that's maybe his best chance to win a championship, outside of maybe joining lebron. Rockets maybe, but think they'd have to break up too much of the team to get him. 6ers could straight up sign him and still keep JJ as well. also think he'd really benefit from Simmons facilitating, but still has the ability to have everything run through him when he's feeling it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckrock101 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 man... Simmons / TJ Redick / Fultz George / Covington Saric / generic backup big Embiid / generic backup big and a top 10 draft pick too. boyyy, this team looks amazing, even if Simmons/Embiid/Fultz don't take a significant step forward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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