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Is Russell Wilson on a HOF pace?

TecmoSuperJoe

By TecmoSuperJoe
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ZenoRazon

ZenoRazon

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12 minutes ago, PapaShogun said:

Passer rating as an arguing point. What is this world coming to? 

How about comp%, how about TD/INT ratio, how about games won?

I have a challenge for you (anyone)

Find me any QB in any era who in their first seven seasons never had worst than a 61 comp%,  had three times as many TD's as INT's, and never missed a game.

Who?

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TecmoSuperJoe

TecmoSuperJoe

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19 minutes ago, ZenoRazon said:

How about comp%, how about TD/INT ratio, how about games won?

I have a challenge for you (anyone)

Find me any QB in any era who in their first seven seasons never had worst than a 61 comp%,  had three times as many TD's as INT's, and never missed a game.

Who?

Completion percentage varies by era. Same with touchdown to interception ratio. Same with passer rating. Games won is a nonsensical statistic. Steve Grogan and Jay Schroeder have great QB W/L records. 

Again, comparing eras doesn't make sense. There are way too many variables for and against players that can't be quanitfied even close to accurately. And your specifically arbitrary statistics designed to push your argument for a specific player simply romanticize one's accomplishments more so than treat them objectively. It's like if I said find me a receiver better than Eric Moulds in the month of December, when his team dominates the TOP,  catches at least two balls, and his quarterback is taller than 6'3". 

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TecmoSuperJoe

TecmoSuperJoe

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Just now, C0LTSFAN4L1F3 said:

Using passer rating in and of itself is not a problem. Of the standard stats that are listed, it is the highest correlate to winning by far. 

Passer rating varies by era. It also doesn't show how well you play per snap, how well you play in the pocket, the turnover throws made, the ones that aren't your fault, etc. Ryan Tannehill has a great passer rating this season. Over 100. He's horrible. 

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ZenoRazon

ZenoRazon

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14 minutes ago, PapaShogun said:

Completion percentage varies by era. Same with touchdown to interception ratio. Same with passer rating. Games won is a nonsensical statistic. Steve Grogan and Jay Schroeder have great QB W/L records. 

Again, comparing eras doesn't make sense. There are way too many variables for and against players that can't be quanitfied even close to accurately. And your specifically arbitrary statistics designed to push your argument for a specific player simply romanticize one's accomplishments more so than treat them objectively. It's like if I said find me a receiver better than Eric Moulds in the month of December, when his team dominates the TOP,  catches at least two balls, and his quarterback is taller than 6'3". 

How about this then....

I saw Montana play at ND, Marino at Pitt, Elway at Stanford, hell....Staubach at Navy, and everyone after them at their college.  Saw their rookie NFL seasons. Saw Tom Brady at Serra HS.  From what I have actually seen, watched, the best QB right out of the gate as a pro.....Russell Wilson. He was better in college, his first seven pro seasons far superior if looking at stats.

Will that work?

Wilson has been doing things never seen before, he's doing things unlike anybody else.

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ZenoRazon

ZenoRazon

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Work with me here.....

He left the college game as the single season all time passing efficency leader, an NCAA record.

His first NFL season, he ties the rookie TD rookie at 26 and posts a 100 passer raring.

His second season  another 100 passer rating which had never been done before, yep...NFL first, and wins a SB.

Since then he has played in another SB....................................this close to winning.  Had more 100 rating than anyone after seven seasons, had three times more TD than INTS, the best comp% ever after seven seasons, multi NFLrecords, the second highest passer rating in history, NOBODY has won more games.

To read.....but but the rules......hahahaha!!!!!!  

I;ll try again...

Saw all these guys play many times, the best I  saw early on....Russell Wilson, and I'm a Niner fan.

 

But todays Russell Wilson  back there with Montana/Marino, think about that.

 

 

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C0LTSFAN4L1F3

C0LTSFAN4L1F3

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2 hours ago, PapaShogun said:

Passer rating varies by era. It also doesn't show how well you play per snap, how well you play in the pocket, the turnover throws made, the ones that aren't your fault, etc. Ryan Tannehill has a great passer rating this season. Over 100. He's horrible. 

Obviously you have to take into account the era. It most definitely takes into account the turnover throws made, and determining what is your fault is quite the convoluted endeavor

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ZenoRazon

ZenoRazon

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How many things do we have to ignore with this?

Wilson has the second highest passer rating in NFL history, what.......doesn't matter?

Wilson has won more games in seven seasons than anyone.......the hell with it?

The guy has three times as many TD as INT.....who has done that, but......doesn't matter?

The numbers he's put up in his seven seasons superior to everyone......rules I tell ya rules?

Hell, just forget all those rushing yard that no other stud QB comes close to.

Come on people,  get real.

 

Seahawks QB Russell Wilson sets new record for most wins for a QB in his first seven NFL seasons

Jan 3, 2016 - Russell Wilson: first player in NFL history w/ 4,000 Pass yds, 30 passing TDs and 500 rushing yards. Per @ESPNStatsInfo ...
 
 
Aug 24, 2016 - Russell Wilson holds NFL record for game-winning drives through four ... Michael Bennett and Cliff Avril formed one of the league's best ..
 
 
Dec 1, 2015 - Seahawks' Russell Wilson sets record for fourth-quarter comebacks ... have gone on one of the greatest streaks in NFL history: 81 consecutive games where they have been at least within one score in the fourth quarter. ... .500 this year, he had a huge day with 345 passing yards and five touchdowns.

 

Dec 10, 2017 - Russell Wilson also officially passed Eli Manning for most fourth quarter touchdowns in a season, as he continues to shatter NFL records this ..
 
 
Nov 26, 2018 - Russell Wilson's career passer rating surpasses 100 after win ... only the second player in NFL history to have a career passer rating over 100 on Sunday. ... wins shy of the record for most wins by a quarterback in his first seven seasons. ... Wilson threw for 339 yards and two touchdowns on 22-31 passes.
 
Dec 30, 2012 - Russell Wilson ties Peyton Manning record for rookie TD passes. SEATTLE -- Seahawks quarterback Russell Wilson has tied Peyton Manning's NFL record for most touchdown passes by a rookie with 26 after a third-quarter score on Sunday against the St. Louis Rams.

All time Passer Rating

  •  
Rank Player Rate Years Tm
1 Aaron Rodgers 103.1 2005-2018 gnb
2 Russell Wilson 100.3 2012-2018 sea
3 Drew Brees 97.7 2001-2018 2TM
4 Tom Brady 97.6 2000-2018 nwe
5 Tony Romo 97.1 2004-2016 dal
6 Steve Young+ 96.8 1985-1999 2TM
7 Peyton Manning 96.5 1998-2015 2TM
8 Philip Rivers 96.0 2004-2018 sdg
9 Kirk Cousins 94.8 2012-2018 2TM
10 Matt Ryan 94.7 2008-2018 atl
11 Ben Roethlisberger 94.2 2004-2018 pit
12 Kurt Warner+ 93.7 1998-2009 3TM
13 Joe Montana+ 92.3 1979-1994

 

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ZenoRazon

ZenoRazon

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I do get the impression nobody actually thought about this.  If ya knew about Wilsons career you know how historically special it's been and noway in hell this...but the rules.....could stand in the way.  The guy owns a gang of firsts, records, he's doing things never seen before.

Watch how this will get totally ignored.

Who in history had more 100 passer ratings, a better TD/INT ratio and a better comp% than Russell Wilson in their first  seven seasons, come on, cool all the BS and give me a name.  Who got off the bus walked right in and took off, well?  Who was in two SB;s their first three seasons? 

I never get a name, never. Cool the.....well ya see back in the day......give me a name, and none of this....well once he became a starter, Wilson was ALWAYS a starter.

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skywlker32

skywlker32

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Ignoring all of cherry picked stats, who has ZERO all-pro nominations to date in their first 7 years (but did have 1x passing TD leader)?

Now who had 3 first team all-pro selections in their first 7 years , 1 2nd team all-pro selection in their first 7 years, 1 MVP (OPOY same year) in their second year, 4x passing yard leader in their first 7 years, 3x passing TD leader in their first 7 years?

I'll give you a hint, the second one is NOT Wilson. The all-pro selections and MVP/OPOY selections should make it clear that one was better. Offensive players aren't just magically getting better, the rules changes and offensive styles have changed statistics. For comparison, there are 16 players this year that have equivalent or better passer rating than the best passer rating of 1985. That doesn't mean that 16 of that sending Ryan Tannehill or Derek Carr back to 1985 would give them an MVP season. It just means that passing statistics are up because rules and offensive styles.

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Jlowe22

Jlowe22

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9 hours ago, ZenoRazon said:

I do get the impression nobody actually thought about this.  If ya knew about Wilsons career you know how historically special it's been and noway in hell this...but the rules.....could stand in the way.  The guy owns a gang of firsts, records, he's doing things never seen before.

Watch how this will get totally ignored.

Who in history had more 100 passer ratings, a better TD/INT ratio and a better comp% than Russell Wilson in their first  seven seasons, come on, cool all the BS and give me a name.  Who got off the bus walked right in and took off, well?  Who was in two SB;s their first three seasons? 

I never get a name, never. Cool the.....well ya see back in the day......give me a name, and none of this....well once he became a starter, Wilson was ALWAYS a starter.

I get the impression you don’t understand inflation and how it works.  Posting a list of raw stats between QBs of different eras means jack ****, but you keep doing it like it means something profound.

 

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C0LTSFAN4L1F3

C0LTSFAN4L1F3

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15 hours ago, ZenoRazon said:

How about comp%, how about TD/INT ratio, how about games won?

I have a challenge for you (anyone)

Find me any QB in any era who in their first seven seasons never had worst than a 61 comp%,  had three times as many TD's as INT's, and never missed a game.

Who?

Oh you want to play that game? Okay, I like games.

Find me a QB that, played his first 4 seasons in the league with a #1 scoring defense, spent just 28% of his career with a non-top 3 scoring defense, and never had a below average scoring defense in his entire career.  He was only ever asked to throw the ball more than 40 times 8 times in his 7 year career, and of those 8 games, only won 2 of them. He is 43% more likely on any given play to be sacked than to throw a touchdown pass.(Clearly shows a huge flaw in his game) Has had 0 MVPs, 0 All-Pro selections whether it be 1st or 2nd team, lead the league in TDs once, and passer rating once, and none in everything else. Oh, and he lead the league in sack yardage, by losing almost 300 yards in sacks in a season. In the only year he lead the league in passer rating, if you take into account all of his plays and not just the times the ball leaves your hand, he lost 3 fumbles and was sacked on an astounding 8.5 Sack%, immensely diminishing his actual efficiency. He also threw an essentially game-losing INT in the Super Bowl. (Spoiler: It's Russel Wilson)

Sounds like the GOAT to me right? 

You still don't seem to be aware, but several other players have managed to win MVP's, and be recognized as the best QB in the league multiple times in their first 7 seasons. Not only has Wilson achieved neither of those, but he never was even a 2nd team All-Pro, so he was never recognized as a top 2 QB in the league. Hardly the GOAT first 7 seasons.

Is he a great QB? Yes. Is he on a HoF pace? Possibly, or even probably. Is this the GOAT first 7 seasons? Absolutely ******* not

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Forge

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1 hour ago, C0LTSFAN4L1F3 said:

Oh you want to play that game? Okay, I like games.

Find me a QB that, played his first 4 seasons in the league with a #1 scoring defense, spent just 28% of his career with a non-top 3 scoring defense, and never had a below average scoring defense in his entire career.  He was only ever asked to throw the ball more than 40 times 8 times in his 7 year career, and of those 8 games, only won 2 of them. He is 43% more likely on any given play to be sacked than to throw a touchdown pass.(Clearly shows a huge flaw in his game) Has had 0 MVPs, 0 All-Pro selections whether it be 1st or 2nd team, lead the league in TDs once, and passer rating once, and none in everything else. Oh, and he lead the league in sack yardage, by losing almost 300 yards in sacks in a season. In the only year he lead the league in passer rating, if you take into account all of his plays and not just the times the ball leaves your hand, he lost 3 fumbles and was sacked on an astounding 8.5 Sack%, immensely diminishing his actual efficiency. He also threw an essentially game-losing INT in the Super Bowl. (Spoiler: It's Russel Wilson)

Sounds like the GOAT to me right? 

You still don't seem to be aware, but several other players have managed to win MVP's, and be recognized as the best QB in the league multiple times in their first 7 seasons. Not only has Wilson achieved neither of those, but he never was even a 2nd team All-Pro, so he was never recognized as a top 2 QB in the league. Hardly the GOAT first 7 seasons.

Is he a great QB? Yes. Is he on a HoF pace? Possibly, or even probably. Is this the GOAT first 7 seasons? Absolutely ******* not

But eye test

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