Packers Roster Cuts

[moretti19]

4 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

There's a thread comparing 2017/2018 rosters now. You want to argue Thompson do it in there, some of us are sick to death of it, pro or con side. He's gone.

Jackson is another Sparq freak. 4.4 at 220, 41 inch vert too. Actually athletically he's not too far from Saquan who everyone called this amazing freak.

What really excites me is the athletes we are getting. It seemed like we were constantly smaller or slower than other teams. 

[Cheech]

6 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

THAT is what I get sick about.  People acting like he was bad at drafting when the facts and evidence just don't support that claim. 

I lied.  I'll be done after this one.  

I think you're under the assumption that I said Ted was BAD at drafting.  In fact, I said he had some brilliant years.  2013 was one of them.  He also had some bad years.  2015 was one of them.  

This shouldn't be so hard.   

[green machine]

2 minutes ago, Cheech said:

Ok.  I'm done after this.  

What position is Randall playing in Cleveland?  

 

Free Safety

[PossibleCabbage]

I don't really want to continue the Randall tangent but I think it bears mentioning that the 2015 draft did not break well for us.  Just look at the guys drafted after Randall for a minute.

[MacReady]

Just now, Gopackgonerd said:

He was good at drafting later round guys, 1st round guys is where he struggled the most the past few years. Albiet it's the back of the first round, but it's not like there isn't good players there.

I disagree.  Clark, Randall, Clinton-Dix... All really good players.  The argument of how they're used can be made.  Them being bad players can't really be made.  Those were all good picks.

 

Just now, Cheech said:

What position is Randall playing in Cleveland? 

The position he should have played here.  Thompson wasn't making coaching decisions.  Randall played really well in his rookie year out of position. 

[Cheech]

Just now, PossibleCabbage said:

I don't really want to continue the Randall tangent but I think it bears mentioning that the 2015 draft did not break well for us.  Just look at the guys drafted after Randall for a minute.

Hah!  I have been.  You can stop at Kendricks.  Man did I want to see him in Green Bay!

[MacReady]

Just now, Cheech said:

I lied.  I'll be done after this one.  

I think you're under the assumption that I said Ted was BAD at drafting.  In fact, I said he had some brilliant years.  2013 was one of them.  He also had some bad years.  2015 was one of them.  

This shouldn't be so hard.   

And I disagree.  If you want to argue that Thompson should have traded up in 2015, go right ahead and I won't argue it.  2015 was NOT a good draft class for any team.  Six of his eight picks are good enough to make a roster right now.  That's a good draft.  That's a really good draft considering he was picking 30th overall in each round. 

[Leader]

Just now, Outpost31 said:

The position he should have played here.  Thompson wasn't making coaching decisions.  Randall played really well in his rookie year out of position. 

Disagree here. The immediate and pressing need was clearly for a boundary corner - or two. We had no business using a #1 on a Safety (with JUCO success at CB).

[MacReady]

Just now, Cheech said:

Hah!  I have been.  You can stop at Kendricks.  Man did I want to see him in Green Bay!

You conveniently leave out how you were probably saying it was a mistake we didn't draft Stephone Anthony instead of Randall.  Or that 14 teams passed on Kendricks AFTER Randall was selected.  Hindsight is a wonderful thing. 

[PossibleCabbage]

1 minute ago, Cheech said:

Hah!  I have been.  You can stop at Kendricks.  Man did I want to see him in Green Bay!

But since he went 45th, it's unlikely a lot of teams actually had a 1st round grade on him.  Kendricks is simply an average player whose skillset is perfect for the modern NFL, odds are pretty good if you took him in the 1st people are going to be mad about how their linebacker isn't producing up to his draft status for like 5 years.  If they took an ILB it probably would have been Anthony and I don't think that went well for the Saints.

[MacReady]

Just now, Leader said:

Disagree here. The immediate and pressing need was clearly for a boundary corner - or two. We had no business using a #1 on a Safety (with JUCO success at CB).

Granted.  What were our options?  Trade up to get Byron Jones instead?  PFF can't be counted on much, but Jones had a tiny bit better rating at corner this past year than Randall did.  What were our other options?  Jalen Collins, taken 12 picks later and who has been out of the NFL since the end of 2016?  Eric Rowe?  Ronald Darby probably.  Golson?  It's not like Thompson missed on an abundance of available corners at 30th overall. 

You could argue he should have just traded down or gone a different position, but Randall, even as a safety, was a better corner than the next 4-5 corners taken in that draft. 

[PossibleCabbage]

Like genuinely the hope in 2015 was that a Byron Jones, Marcus Peters,  or Kevin Johnson would land at 30 or that Vic Beasley would slip because he's undersized or that Bud Dupree would slip because he's raw.  All those guys were gone so the options were pretty much "reach at a non-premium position" or pull a rabbit out of your hat.  Like it's not like Randall couldn't play, and play corner, all of his problems were between his ears.  I figure the former GM honestly found value where there literally was none, it's just that things didn't develop as well as they were hoped.

[Leader]

2 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Granted.  What were our options?  Trade up to get Byron Jones instead?  PFF can't be counted on much, but Jones had a tiny bit better rating at corner this past year than Randall did.  What were our other options?  Jalen Collins, taken 12 picks later and who has been out of the NFL since the end of 2016?  Eric Rowe?  Ronald Darby probably.  Golson?  It's not like Thompson missed on an abundance of available corners at 30th overall. You could argue he should have just traded down or gone a different position, but Randall, even as a safety, was a better corner than the next 4-5 corners taken in that draft. 

If the boards not dropping your way - you move up - or you select a better fit talent and fill the need via FA. The "He didnt have other options" concept is moot. The point is he misused a #1 selection on a player who was intended from the very beginning to be of immediate need and playing out of position. Thats not good decision making and it played out exactly as you;d expect.

DR showed good closing and ball hawking skill - exactly as you'd expect (or hope for) from a Safety - but he was challenged maintaining coverage on the boundary - and it was a boundary CB we needed - and didnt fill.

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

5 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Granted.  What were our options?  Trade up to get Byron Jones instead?  PFF can't be counted on much, but Jones had a tiny bit better rating at corner this past year than Randall did.  What were our other options?  Jalen Collins, taken 12 picks later and who has been out of the NFL since the end of 2016?  Eric Rowe?  Ronald Darby probably.  Golson?  It's not like Thompson missed on an abundance of available corners at 30th overall. 

You could argue he should have just traded down or gone a different position, but Randall, even as a safety, was a better corner than the next 4-5 corners taken in that draft. 

What he likely should have done is used FA for a corner and played Randall as the deep safety.  Dix and Burnett could have played closer to the LOS.

[MacReady]

Just now, Leader said:

If the boards not dropping your way - you move up - or you select a better fit talent and fill the need via FA. The "He didnt have other options" concept is moot. The point is he misused a #1 selection on a player who was intended from the very beginning to be of immediate need and playing out of position. Thats not good decision making and it played out exactly as you;d expect.

DR showed good closing and ball hawking skill - exactly as you'd expect (or hope for) from a Safety - but he was challenged maintaining coverage on the boundary - and it was a boundary CB we needed - and didnt fill.

The fact remains Randall was a good pick.  I've already agreed that Thompson was not good at running a draft.  He should have been more aggressive, traded down less, traded up more, etc.  If Thompson wanted a corner, he picked the best corner, and he wasn't even a corner.  Randall was the best corner available, and Thompson saw that.  he deserves props there.  And it's not even true that Randall didn't play well.  He played REALLY well in his rookie year.  He had some really big plays in really key moments and after his rookie year, everybody expected him to be a good one. 

That's also neglecting his potential at his best fit, which is safety.  Where Randall played is the only thing that's moot in this conversation.  The conversation is about players Thompson drafted.  As Ragnar said, Thompson should have signed a corner after Randall's poor second year, then moved him to safety or at the very least the slot, where Randall also has value.  He didn't. 

I'm not going to argue with you on Thompson's ability to fill a roster.  He struggled there.  As far as his draft picks, he was very, very, very good at them.