What happened to the Saints defense?

[MookieMonstah]

43 minutes ago, SmittyBacall said:

I remember flipping on the NO@NYG game during a commercial and seeing Eli sail two balls over an open OBJ's head on back to back plays.

Not what I would consider a shut-down by Lattimore.

If a CB is forcing the QB to try and fit the ball into a tight window, and he fails, thats a product of good CB play. I'm not saying thats what happens, but far to often people try to discredit CBs or S with this argument.

[GSUeagles14]

5 minutes ago, Kip Smithers said:

Every team plays with safeties, no ****ting me. But the alignment and role of that safety varies from week to week. Your issue is that you seem to think that because Odell was quiet that it was just due to Lattimore. Which is not the case at all.

heck, technically speaking odell fared better when he was covered by lattimore opposed to anyone else. Anyone who watched that game didnt come away think lattimore shut him down, except one delusional saints fan.

[MookieMonstah]

2 minutes ago, GSUeagles14 said:

heck, technically speaking odell fared better when he was covered by lattimore opposed to anyone else. Anyone who watched that game didnt come away think lattimore shut him down, except one delusional saints fan.

I'm so glad you're not a Dolphins, Bills or Jets fan.

[GSUeagles14]

1 minute ago, MookieMonstah said:

If a CB is forcing the QB to try and fit the ball into a tight window, and he fails, thats a product of good CB play. I'm not saying thats what happens, but far to often people try to discredit CBs or S with this argument.

Did you watch the game yesterday? One of those two throws was an out/comeback where he had at least 7 yards of distance between him and lattimore and eli couldnt get it in the same county. it was not a pretty offensive game from eli or the giants yesterday, thats not controversial in the least to say. if youre coming away from that game and saying lattimore or crawley or whoever else shut someone down you have an agenda cause its not really reality.

[MookieMonstah]

2 minutes ago, GSUeagles14 said:

Did you watch the game yesterday? One of those two throws was an out/comeback where he had at least 7 yards of distance between him and lattimore and eli couldnt get it in the same county. it was not a pretty offensive game from eli or the giants yesterday, thats not controversial in the least to say. if youre coming away from that game and saying lattimore or crawley or whoever else shut someone down you have an agenda cause its not really reality.

Apparently, I need to repeat myself. "I'm not saying thats what happened but..." I didn't see the plays in question. What I do know is most of the time its a lazy attempt to discredit a secondary player. 

Lattimore has played well since Week 1. When he was on Julio he only allowed 1 catch for like what? 11 yards? You can use any argument you want to try and twist that but the reality is when Lattimore has been on Landry, OBJ and Julio the teams QB hasn't thrown that way. 

[GSUeagles14]

1 minute ago, MookieMonstah said:

I'm so glad you're not a Dolphins, Bills or Jets fan.

im so glad you resort to blanket, childish statements when presented with context. Dont want argue what happened, easy response "shut up, youre a biased falcon fan". Lets try to be adults, have an iq above 50 figure out what was wrong with what i said. Are you saying eli had a good game? That he didnt miss multiple passes that should have been completed to odell? 

 

Please answer the two bolded questions before anything else. if you wont, then theres no point in continuing as youre not interested in honest, genuine debate. 

[MookieMonstah]

1 minute ago, GSUeagles14 said:

im so glad you resort to blanket, childish statements when presented with context. Dont want argue what happened, easy response "shut up, youre a biased falcon fan". Lets try to be adults, have an iq above 50 figure out what was wrong with what i said. Are you saying eli had a good game? That he didnt miss multiple passes that should have been completed to odell? 

 

Please answer the two bolded questions before anything else. if you wont, then theres no point in continuing as youre not interested in honest, genuine debate. 

You've been the one to resort to petty, childish insults every time we've talked. I'm glad you're not a fan of a division rival because you ARE biased and you've gone to outrageous lengths to discredit Lattimore. Eli did not have a good game. Eli missed two passes that should have been completed, what I've said is its VERY common for CBs or S to FORCE these tight throws and QBs miss them more often than not. I don't remember these two plays in question so I can't comment either way with any certainty but even if you add those completions Lattimore held ODB in check and played a very good game. 

Lattimore could've held ODB to 0 catches and 0 targets and you would just say its because the other CB sucks. Having this argument with you is pointless.

[GSUeagles14]

1 minute ago, MookieMonstah said:

You've been the one to resort to petty, childish insults every time we've talked. I'm glad you're not a fan of a division rival because you ARE biased and you've gone to outrageous lengths to discredit Lattimore. Eli did not have a good game. Eli missed two passes that should have been completed, what I've said is its VERY common for CBs or S to FORCE these tight throws and QBs miss them more often than not. I don't remember these two plays in question so I can't comment either way with any certainty but even if you add those completions Lattimore held ODB in check and played a very good game. 

Lattimore could've held ODB to 0 catches and 0 targets and you would just say its because the other CB sucks. Having this argument with you is pointless.

of course, im wrong because im a biased falcon fan. Not arguing what actually happened, its just doesnt matter cause im a biased falcon fan. And for the record, since youre arguing something you didnt even watch, they werent tight throws, one there was no one within 6-7 yards of odell and eli threw 10 yards out of bounds and the other there was prob more like 3-4 yards of space. they were just misses, which happens but it wasnt cause of good coverage. 

 

Even excluding those two easy misses, odell didnt have a bad day given what the giants offense was. I keep saying over and over, context matters but you want to continue to ignore it. eli was really bad yesterday? doesnt matter, all latimore. Crawley (and williams) constantly getting picked on so no need to throw to lattimores side, doesnt matter lattimore did it all. As far as i cant tell, you havent argued that those things havent happened, just that they dont matter. Which i think is a weird argument to make but whatever.

[MookieMonstah]

1 minute ago, GSUeagles14 said:

of course, im wrong because im a biased falcon fan. Not arguing what actually happened, its just doesnt matter cause im a biased falcon fan. And for the record, since youre arguing something you didnt even watch, they werent tight throws, one there was no one within 6-7 yards of odell and eli threw 10 yards out of bounds and the other there was prob more like 3-4 yards of space. they were just misses, which happens but it wasnt cause of good coverage. 

 

Even excluding those two easy misses, odell didnt have a bad day given what the giants offense was. I keep saying over and over, context matters but you want to continue to ignore it. eli was really bad yesterday? doesnt matter, all latimore. Crawley (and williams) constantly getting picked on so no need to throw to lattimores side, doesnt matter lattimore did it all. As far as i cant tell, you havent argued that those things havent happened, just that they dont matter. Which i think is a weird argument to make but whatever.

No the issue is no matter what argument ANY ONE makes, you will just find a ridiculous counter argument. If ODB and Julio combined for 0 catches on 0 targets, you would just say its because PJ Williams got roasted all night. Its pointless to argue with someone who will twist things to fit their agenda instead of looking at the big picture.

I'd love to see clips of these two Eli misses. I'm not saying you're lying, just curious to see the throws. If he only missed two throws that would've amounted to what? 15-20 yards? Lattimore still did a phenominal job on a top 3 WR. End of discussion.

[Magnifico]

Hate the term "shutdown" or "blanket" coverage bar straight man to man plays. Even Richard Sherman in his heyday didn't fully play without some safety help and the best ball hawking and range covering safety in the league behind him in E. Thomas

Jeez. Some saints fans. It's not a disservice to Lattimore, bar Patrick Peterson there is barely any CB's who don't get safety support. Just because the Giants rolled help to Jenkins yesterday doesn't mean he's not a good corner, and he did a fine job of Michael Thomas, he didn't "shut him down though" the WR's are just too damn good and the rules favour them.

Lattimore has played well the last two/three games. He hasn't "shut down" anyone. No point getting pedantic about some small things. It's not disrespect...it's how coverage works!

Lattimore could shut down the lead receiver all week. You look at potential opponents like the Panthers, Rams, Eagles in the NFC and that's still a sore achilles heel for the Saints. The Rams and Packers would be death by a thousand cuts given their receiver talent.

[Hunter2_1]

GSU putting someone on blast for being "childish" is hilarious. 

[tyler735]

39 minutes ago, GSUeagles14 said:

heck, technically speaking odell fared better when he was covered by lattimore opposed to anyone else. Anyone who watched that game didnt come away think lattimore shut him down, except one delusional saints fan.

 

36 minutes ago, MookieMonstah said:

I'm so glad you're not a Dolphins, Bills or Jets fan.

 

32 minutes ago, GSUeagles14 said:

im so glad you resort to blanket, childish statements when presented with context. Dont want argue what happened, easy response "shut up, youre a biased falcon fan". Lets try to be adults, have an iq above 50 figure out what was wrong with what i said. Are you saying eli had a good game? That he didnt miss multiple passes that should have been completed to odell? 

 

Please answer the two bolded questions before anything else. if you wont, then theres no point in continuing as youre not interested in honest, genuine debate. 

Hahahahaha so much irony here! You literally just resorted childish statements 1-2 posts prior, and then play the "poor me I'm a victim" card. No wonder the Falcons forum is so dead on here, I wouldn't want to have to deal with your petulant BS either..

[tyler735]

41 minutes ago, Kip Smithers said:

Every team plays with safeties, no ****ting me. But the alignment and role of that safety varies from week to week. Your issue is that you seem to think that because Odell was quiet that it was just due to Lattimore. Which is not the case at all.

No I never said it Lattimore and Lattimore only. However they were primarily matched up against each other. It is Odell's job to make plays, and he largely failed to do so lined up against Lattimore most of the game. You can make all the excuses you want, or if you'd rather I say the Saints defense had no problem shutting down Beckham, and the Giants, I'd gladly say that as well as both are true. Football is a team game, and at the end of the day a player either makes plays to help is team win or he doesn't. Lattimore did so, Beckham didn't

[GSUeagles14]

1 hour ago, MookieMonstah said:

No the issue is no matter what argument ANY ONE makes, you will just find a ridiculous counter argument. If ODB and Julio combined for 0 catches on 0 targets, you would just say its because PJ Williams got roasted all night. Its pointless to argue with someone who will twist things to fit their agenda instead of looking at the big picture.

I'd love to see clips of these two Eli misses. I'm not saying you're lying, just curious to see the throws. If he only missed two throws that would've amounted to what? 15-20 yards? Lattimore still did a phenominal job on a top 3 WR. End of discussion.

lets talk about specifically what im talking about and not hypothetical world. of these "ridiculous counter arguments" that havent even been argued. you want to ignore meaningful context because you want to believe what you want to believe.  we both have said williams/crawley got absolutely lit up two weeks ago, the exact #'s would be interesting to see but whatever they were why even look the other way if youre having so much success. Apparently thats not valid reasoning to you and you should go  to a tougher match up just because reasons? Eli and the giants offense was not good yesterday, thats almost universally agreed upon. OBJ is reliant on Eli (and by extension the oline) to get time to run routes and watchable balls. Apparently another "ridiculous counter argument". Crazy thoughts, wrs are dependent to qbs. 

 

[SmittyBacall]

2 hours ago, MookieMonstah said:

If a CB is forcing the QB to try and fit the ball into a tight window, and he fails, thats a product of good CB play. I'm not saying thats what happens, but far to often people try to discredit CBs or S with this argument.

That's not what I would call a small window throw. The first throw is about as open as you are going to get in the NFL. The second play was closer, but he was still open. Those are two wins for Beckham Jr. that won't show up on the stat-sheet.