doumeyer Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 16 hours ago, JetsFan15 said: I agree with you and @Bobby816. We need some edge guys who will force QBs to step up in the pocket into Leo's waiting arms!!! LOL Add me to you list, that will work big time. I have been saying this for a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaZeN37 Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 Grady Jarrett (Age 25.10) 2016 - 34 Pressures; 3 sacks; 4 TFL; 9 QB Hits 2017 - 39 Pressures; 4 sacks; 15 TFL; 13 QB Hits 2018 - 53 Pressures; 6 sacks; 8 TFL; 16 QB Hits 3 year totals: 126 Pressures; 13 sacks; 27 TFL; 38 QB Hits Leonard Williams (Age: 24.8) 2016 - 48 Pressures; 7 sacks; 11 TFL; 19 QB Hits 2017 - 50 Pressures; 2 sacks; 3 TFL; 25 QB Hits 2018 - 53 Pressures; 5 sacks; 11 TFL; 20 QB Hits 3 year totals: 151 Pressures; 14 sacks; 25 TFL; 64 QB Hits Yet a lot of the fan base wants to trade away Leo for a 2nd round pick while also wanting to give Jarrett a giant contract in free agency. I don’t get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnaby8787 Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 1 hour ago, BlaZeN37 said: Grady Jarrett (Age 25.10) 2016 - 34 Pressures; 3 sacks; 4 TFL; 9 QB Hits 2017 - 39 Pressures; 4 sacks; 15 TFL; 13 QB Hits 2018 - 53 Pressures; 6 sacks; 8 TFL; 16 QB Hits 3 year totals: 126 Pressures; 13 sacks; 27 TFL; 38 QB Hits Leonard Williams (Age: 24.8) 2016 - 48 Pressures; 7 sacks; 11 TFL; 19 QB Hits 2017 - 50 Pressures; 2 sacks; 3 TFL; 25 QB Hits 2018 - 53 Pressures; 5 sacks; 11 TFL; 20 QB Hits 3 year totals: 151 Pressures; 14 sacks; 25 TFL; 64 QB Hits Yet a lot of the fan base wants to trade away Leo for a 2nd round pick while also wanting to give Jarrett a giant contract in free agency. I don’t get it. Jarrett is a top 5 run stopper in the league. That’s what separates them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaZeN37 Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 30 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said: Jarrett is a top 5 run stopper in the league. That’s what separates them. But I thought the argument is that Leo isn’t worth paying because he’s not a good enough pass rusher? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDotNova Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 56 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said: Jarrett is a top 5 run stopper in the league. That’s what separates them. Leo has 116 run stuffs since entering the league. That ranks him 3rd behind only Snacks and Donald. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnaby8787 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 57 minutes ago, SDotNova said: Leo has 116 run stuffs since entering the league. That ranks him 3rd behind only Snacks and Donald. Where are you getting that number from? https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/leonard-williams/#!#current-year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnaby8787 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 Jarrett has ranked 5th and 1st in run stuffs over the past two years. Leo has ranked 9th and 62nd. No clue where you got that 116 number from @SDotNova, but rarely do players have more than 10 a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 3 hours ago, BlaZeN37 said: Grady Jarrett (Age 25.10) 2016 - 34 Pressures; 3 sacks; 4 TFL; 9 QB Hits 2017 - 39 Pressures; 4 sacks; 15 TFL; 13 QB Hits 2018 - 53 Pressures; 6 sacks; 8 TFL; 16 QB Hits 3 year totals: 126 Pressures; 13 sacks; 27 TFL; 38 QB Hits Leonard Williams (Age: 24.8) 2016 - 48 Pressures; 7 sacks; 11 TFL; 19 QB Hits 2017 - 50 Pressures; 2 sacks; 3 TFL; 25 QB Hits 2018 - 53 Pressures; 5 sacks; 11 TFL; 20 QB Hits 3 year totals: 151 Pressures; 14 sacks; 25 TFL; 64 QB Hits Yet a lot of the fan base wants to trade away Leo for a 2nd round pick while also wanting to give Jarrett a giant contract in free agency. I don’t get it. I think we need to better utilize Leo. And I also by all means don’t think DT is a need worth spending big on FA on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDotNova Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 47 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said: Where are you getting that number from? https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/leonard-williams/#!#current-year I got the stat from PFF. Here's an article from PFF. It could be a definitional difference. PFF defines a stop by iDL as a play where that defender on 1st down prevents 40% of the yardage needed, on 2nd down 50% of the yardage, and on 3rd and 4th down the runner is kept from gaining a first down. Williams has been at his best as a run stuffer, notching 116 run stops since 2015 which ranks behind only Damon Harrison and Aaron Donald at the position. In any event, I don't think we can point to run defense productivity as the reason why Jarrett is viewed as more valuable than Leo. It probably has more to do with with public perception because of the scheme they play. Jarrett is viewed as this disrupting penetrating iDL. And Leo is viewed as more of someone who takes up blocks and clogs the middle. Both are disruptive and have an argument in their favor. https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-draft-history-grades-and-stats-for-every-first-and-second-round-pick-since-2015-afc-east-edition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnaby8787 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 25 minutes ago, SDotNova said: I got the stat from PFF. Here's an article from PFF. It could be a definitional difference. PFF defines a stop by iDL as a play where that defender on 1st down prevents 40% of the yardage needed, on 2nd down 50% of the yardage, and on 3rd and 4th down the runner is kept from gaining a first down. Williams has been at his best as a run stuffer, notching 116 run stops since 2015 which ranks behind only Damon Harrison and Aaron Donald at the position. In any event, I don't think we can point to run defense productivity as the reason why Jarrett is viewed as more valuable than Leo. It probably has more to do with with public perception because of the scheme they play. Jarrett is viewed as this disrupting penetrating iDL. And Leo is viewed as more of someone who takes up blocks and clogs the middle. Both are disruptive and have an argument in their favor. https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-draft-history-grades-and-stats-for-every-first-and-second-round-pick-since-2015-afc-east-edition Look at their definition of a run stop. That’s not a run stuff. Run stuffs are more impressive. With that said, Leo has a much higher total snap count than Jarrett for starters. Ironically, PFF also have Jarrett graded as a much better run defender. Why do you think his PFF grades are so much higher? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 To paint a clear picture for some. Signing Jarrett would be like having Snacks back but at 25yrs old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnaby8787 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 4 minutes ago, Bobby816 said: To paint a clear picture for some. Signing Jarrett would be like having Snacks back but at 25yrs old. I’m 100% cool with both, but Jarrett is the better player. I don’t think anyone outside of Jet land would argue that Leo is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingOfNewYork Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 3 hours ago, barnaby8787 said: I’m 100% cool with both, but Jarrett is the better player. I don’t think anyone outside of Jet land would argue that Leo is better. All of our players stink outside of Jet land honestly. I think we severely undervalue our guys talent. However factoring in weak areas such as Pass Rush and O-Line then you hurt everyone around the team since those are the two things on each side of the ball that get things going. Also poor coaching(Bates, Rogers, Morhinweg, etc) Scheme fits as well. A lot goes into it. Leo has top tier talent and should be used as a penetrating DT but we don’t utilize him that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnaby8787 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 6 hours ago, KingOfTheDot said: All of our players stink outside of Jet land honestly. I think we severely undervalue our guys talent. However factoring in weak areas such as Pass Rush and O-Line then you hurt everyone around the team since those are the two things on each side of the ball that get things going. Also poor coaching(Bates, Rogers, Morhinweg, etc) Scheme fits as well. A lot goes into it. Leo has top tier talent and should be used as a penetrating DT but we don’t utilize him that way. I agree with that 100% and it’s posisbkr that in the right scheme, Leo would be better than Grady, but as it stands, Grady has been better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 In my ideal defense I prefer to have two OLB type edge rushers (Barr/Josh Allen/Fowler) type coming off the edge. In that case in order to not get gashed in the run game you need some elite run stuffers. Having two elite run stuffers like Leo and Jarrett would not be a bad thing if we could pair them with two speed edge rushers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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