Raves Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 Just now, Soggust said: It was like 15 yards. He picks up the ball on the 12 yard line and the whistle blows when hes at like the 27. I think it was a unfortunate call, no doubt, but obviously we have seen far worse and it clearly didn't lose the game for the Saints. Just feels like human error to me. Are we sure it didn't? We've seen a many games that have been close and one side struggling only for them to have a big play and suddenly they seem like a different team. Also pretty sure Teddy B would've been a little more relaxed if they were up 13-6 compared to tied 6-6 and eventually behind. Granted they probably still lose, but I don't htink it's 27-16 like people want to argue, but probably close to 20-19. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Raves said: 5 minutes ago, Soggust said: it clearly didn't lose the game for the Saints Are we sure it didn't? Yes, we're sure. It was still a one score game heading into halftime and we'd whethered several Teddy B drives and held the Rams offense into check up until then. It was anyone's game, this call did not decide the outcome. Edited September 17, 2019 by Dome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NVRamsFan Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 The worst are the plays where they place the ball after in the wrong spot. A coach challenges the play and they still get it wrong. Everybody watching and even the announcers see it but they get it wrong twice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soggust Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 Just now, Raves said: Are we sure it didn't? We've seen a many games that have been close and one side struggling only for them to have a big play and suddenly they seem like a different team. Also pretty sure Teddy B would've been a little more relaxed if they were up 13-6 compared to tied 6-6 and eventually behind. Granted they probably still lose, but I don't htink it's 27-16 like people want to argue, but probably close to 20-19. Unless you can cite a specific example that I'm forgetting, I don't recall a single botched call ever completely losing the game before halftime. I feel like if we are going to swing 17 points off a poor call in the second quarter, because - momentum, then it delegitimizes almost every teams win since there are bad calls in most games (and sports). I agree there could be more accountability in general, but I'm not sure what a better solution is without reviewing every single play in depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 1 minute ago, Dome said: Yes, we're sure. It was still a one score game heading into halftime and we'd whethered several Teddy B drives and held the Rams offense into check up until then. It was anyone's game, this call did not decide the outcome. I mean I agree it's probably still a loss, but we've seen before where a single play can change the whole momentum of a team. I'm just saying we don't know how it would've affected the rest of the team and their motivation/intensity. Let's also look at Ohio State vs Indiana just this past weekend. Ohio State was struggling on offense seemed out of rhythm, then special teams blocks a punt that turns into a safety. After that the offense looks in rhythm and has little to no trouble moving the ball and scoring points. Once again, it was probably still a loss, the Rams are too good to beat with a back-up QB that had no actual game prep/timing with the WRs, but it's not impossible to think that the game would've been much closer than 27-16 as the memes suggest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candyman93 Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 I understand your pain Saints fans. 12:24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soggust Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 3 minutes ago, NVRamsFan said: The worst are the plays where they place the ball after in the wrong spot. A coach challenges the play and they still get it wrong. Everybody watching and even the announcers see it but they get it wrong twice. Definitely agree that we (as viewers) have much more of a right to criticize the refs during challenges as a whole. But I feel there should be a bit more leniency on these real-time calls. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, Soggust said: Unless you can cite a specific example that I'm forgetting, I don't recall a single botched call ever completely losing the game before halftime. I feel like if we are going to swing 17 points off a poor call in the second quarter, because - momentum, then it delegitimizes almost every teams win since there are bad calls in most games (and sports). I agree there could be more accountability in general, but I'm not sure what a better solution is without reviewing every single play in depth. I've said numerous times, I think it would've still been a loss, but that 17 points did happen when the Rams had momentum is all I'm saying. Also not all botched calls are equal IMO. Defensive TDs are probably one of the most momentum swinging plays I've seen in close games, much more so than a potent offense hitting a big play for a TD. For all we know the Saints D keeps the Rams offense in check for rest of teh half and the Saints score another FG before the half for a 16-6 lead going into the half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soggust Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, Raves said: I've said numerous times, I think it would've still been a loss, but that 17 points did happen when the Rams had momentum is all I'm saying. Also not all botched calls are equal IMO. Defensive TDs are probably one of the most momentum swinging plays I've seen in close games, much more so than a potent offense hitting a big play for a TD. For all we know the Saints D keeps the Rams offense in check for rest of teh half and the Saints score another FG before the half for a 16-6 lead going into the half. Yes you have, but remember this was also in response to: 17 minutes ago, Raves said: Are we sure it didn't? We are sure it didn't cost them the game. The Saints have an obligation to handle adversity / momentum shifts as much as every other team when there is a bad call. I'm not saying bad calls can't cost teams games (e.g. - Saints/Rams playoff game with PI), but I think most folks are saying that if simply blowing the whistle too early in the second quarter and preventing a TD return on defense loses the game because of momentum, then they didn't deserve to win regardless. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Raves said: I mean I agree it's probably still a loss, but we've seen before where a single play can change the whole momentum of a team. We've also seen it force the other team to step up and play better as well. A wakeup call of sorts. The play happened with 6 minutes to go in the half. Even if the Jordan TD stands, we don't know that the Rams wouldn't have responded with a 72 yard Cooks TD on the opening play of the next drive. You can play the "but what if" game all day long. Going into the half the score was 6-3, regardless of anything that happened. Saints kept it within 3 while adjusting to Brees injury and weathering a defensive TD being negated as well as 5 crappy Teddy Bridgewater drives. Our defense was playing well and we forced a punt on the Rams first offensive drive of the 2nd half. 18 minutes ago, Raves said: I've said numerous times, I think it would've still been a loss, but that 17 points did happen when the Rams had momentum is all I'm saying. This is false. We had the ball early in the 3rd with just a 3 point deficit and the momentum of just stopping them and still having a chip on our shoulder for the fumble TD being negated. It was our game to win at that point but we completely folded instead. We lost because: We lost our best and most important player in what was likely going to be one of the toughest games of the season our defense couldn't stop the Rams for a full game, we got gassed and the Rams moved to a hurry up because our WR corps was decimated because our line couldn't put a hand on Donald, or really anyone, and when they did they were committing penalties because Teddy held onto the ball for 4 seconds every play (exaggeration) rather than taking a couple yards when it was there (this led to some of the penalties on the offensive line) because Sean barely Teddy throw more than 7 yards downfield even though he was getting great protection (another exaggeration) because Alvin Kamara was running into the back of his line half the time Take your pick, but blaming the game on that call is no bueno. Edited September 17, 2019 by Dome 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 45 minutes ago, Raves said: I mean I agree it's probably still a loss, but we've seen before where a single play can change the whole momentum of a team. I'm just saying we don't know how it would've affected the rest of the team and their motivation/intensity. Let's also look at Ohio State vs Indiana just this past weekend. Ohio State was struggling on offense seemed out of rhythm, then special teams blocks a punt that turns into a safety. After that the offense looks in rhythm and has little to no trouble moving the ball and scoring points. The thing is, there’s no way of knowing if that play sparked an offensive turnaround or if the turnaround was going to happen anyway. If we went back in time and threw a flag on that blocked punt, maybe the offense finds it’s rhythm still. We can’t link the correlation with the causation. It’s like the Ravens-49ers SB, where some believe the blackout allowed the Ravens to win it. There’s just no proof of that, the only evidence is that...it happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 3 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said: The thing is, there’s no way of knowing if that play sparked an offensive turnaround or if the turnaround was going to happen anyway. If we went back in time and threw a flag on that blocked punt, maybe the offense finds it’s rhythm still. We can’t link the correlation with the causation. It’s like the Ravens-49ers SB, where some believe the blackout allowed the Ravens to win it. There’s just no proof of that, the only evidence is that...it happened. I agree and why I've said it's probably still a loss but am arguing with those that say with 100% certainty that it didn't change anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrantikRam Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Dome said: It's not the expectation because it would be unrealistic and destined for failure if you put any faith into NFL players buying into a system like. Agreed. I just think it's funny and also why fans should not get upset about officiating - because on your possession in the 4th quarter, your WR traps a pass and you get away with it, your team takes the lead. On the ensuing possession, under two minutes, the opposition has the same play happen, only the refs don't even stop to review it. Fans and coaches seem pretty bad about saying "well we got away with some stuff too, so it's fine" - if that 2nd team goes on to win, the coach of the 1st team will ask why that play wasn't reviewed since it happened under two minutes - which is crazy because ultimately both teams got away with a catch that wasn't a catch in this example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Raves said: I agree and why I've said it's probably still a loss but am arguing with those that say with 100% certainty that it didn't change anything. I don’t think many people are saying it didn’t change anything. Those who are saying that are probably best to be ignored. But the Saints hung with the Rams for a couple more drives and had a chance to take the lead and put the pressure on the Rams right at the start of the 3rd quarter. IMO it’s pointless to still be discussing the call’s impact on the game when so many other things went wrong. It’s a bit of a cop-out. Edited September 17, 2019 by Dome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstar12 Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 So not only is this new rule dumb there not even calling it right lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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