Skins212689 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 32 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Cousins got the Redskins to mediocrity with an awful defense. Who knows what would have happened if they develop a good to great defense and a good running game with a young back like Guice. Kirk’s passing game w/ Peterson’s running game last year gets the Redskins to the playoffs I believe. That's a opinion we will never know if it could be factual. We can't go back in time. I know facts he didn't do it in Minnesota last year and doesn't seem capable of getting done this year as well. This has went from his contract/play not meeting to IDK. You can have it Turtle. Facts will be proven at the end of the year. As said keep loving "Mr You Like That" I don't have too and have reasons why. On the big stage he more likely to fail than succeed. Edited October 3, 2019 by Skins212689 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 1 minute ago, turtle28 said: Ok, name the source. Idk who his sources are, Idk the dude personally. Thats a question for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 When has Stephen A Smith ever been a Redskins source? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 15 minutes ago, MikeT14 said: When has Stephen A Smith ever been a Redskins source? I'm not saying he's a Redskin source, I'm saying he's getting information from his colleagues who are Redskin sources. Didn't Ryan Clark play for the Redskins before and after Sean Taylors passing? Yes. Isn't Ryan Clark now working at ESPN? Yes. Wouldn't Ryan Clark beable to tell him what's it like in the Redskins organization? Yes. So as said I don't think Smith is just pulling this stuff out of his buttocks. Clark has his own experience and sources who possibly share information with First Take and the rest of ESPN. Edited October 3, 2019 by Skins212689 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Skins212689 said: That's a opinion we will never know if it could be factual. We can't go back in time. I know facts he didn't do it in Minnesota last year and doesn't seem capable of getting done this year as well. This has went from his contract/play not meeting to IDK. You can have it Turtle. Facts will be proven at the end of the year. As said keep loving "Mr You Like That" I don't have too and have reasons why. On the big stage he more likely to fail than succeed. Of course its an opinion, I'm well aware of what an opinion is. If you knew why the Vikings weren't as good last year then you'd know it had little to do with Kirk. The Vikings running game took a step back bc their OL was worse, Cook got hurt again, Latavius Murray wasn't used as much bc they were more pass first and the main reason was that their defense took a big step back mostly bc of Everson Griffith’s psychotic episode in Sept of last year which caused him to miss 12 games who was their best pass rusher. Edited October 3, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 5 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Of course its an opinion, I'm well aware of what an opinion is. If you knew why the Vikings weren't as good last year then you'd know it had little to do with Kirk. The Vikings running game took a step back bc their OL was worse, Cook got hurt again, Latavius Murray wasn't used as much bc they were more pass first and the main reason was that their defense took a big step back mostly bc of Everson Griffith’s psychotic episode in Sept of last year which caused him to miss 12 games who was their best pass rusher. These are excuses to me. If you got 84 million guranteed I'm looking for you to overcome things not blame others.Even freaking Rex Grossman did enough to get his team to a Superbowl. Yes I know their defense was the KEY but Grossman had to do things as well. We don't agree on Kirk Cousins getting 84 million guranteed and than being allowed a pass when his team doesn't make the playoffs after making the NFC Chamionship game the year before. Vikings would've been better just resigning Keenum for less in my book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Skins212689 said: These are excuses to me. If you got 84 million guranteed I'm looking for you to overcome things not blame others.Even freaking Rex Grossman did enough to get his team to a Superbowl. Yes I know their defense was the KEY but Grossman had to do things as well. We don't agree on Kirk Cousins getting 84 million guranteed and than being allowed a pass when his team doesn't make the playoffs after making the NFC Chamionship game the year before. Vikings would've been better just resigning Keenum for less in my book. You keep coming back to Kirk’s contract. Regardless of that, the players around him also have to perform well for the team to win. That hasn't happened. I'm NOT giving Kirk a pass here - he has to play better and he's said that - but so does their OL and their D. * We’re paying $27.5 million for Alex Smith, Case Keenum and Colt McCoy. Only $1.5 million less than Kirk is making. And, we lost Kendall Fuller and a 3rd round pick bc of the Alex Smith trade. We are winless with that group of QBs plus Haskins and we are paying over the $29 million that Kirk is making this year for our 4 QBs on our payroll - like $30 million. So, I'm not sure why you wouldn't want Kirk? He was better than what we are getting from Alex, Case and Colt combined and at this point he’s certainly better then Haskins. Vikings made the NFCCG in 2017 bc of a strong defense and a strong ground game. Their defense has regressed the last two years - I explained why that happened last year in 2018 - and you just brush that off as an excuse, but any knowledgeable football fan knows that you can pass for 500 yards and 6 TDs in a game, but if your defense gives up 6 TDs and a FG, you lose the game. How is that example a QBs fault for that loss? Edited October 4, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, turtle28 said: You keep coming back to Kirk’s contract. Regardless of that, the players around him also have to perform well for the team to win. That hasn't happened. I'm NOT giving Kirk a pass here - he has to play better and he's said that - but so does their OL and their D. * We’re paying $27.5 million for Alex Smith, Case Keenum and Colt McCoy. Only $1.5 million less than Kirk is making. And, we lost Kendall Fuller and a 3rd round pick bc of the Alex Smith trade. We are winless with that group of QBs plus Haskins and we are paying nearly the $29 million that Kirk is making this year. So, I'm not sure why you wouldn't want Kirk? He was better than what we are getting from Alex, Case and Colt combined. Vikings made the NFCCG in 2017 bc of a strong defense and a strong ground game. Their defense has regressed the last two years - I explained why that happened last year in 2018 - and you just brush that off as an excuse, but any knowledgeable football fan knows that you can pass for 500 yards and 6 TDs in a game, but if our defense gives us 6 TDs and a FG, you lose the game. How is that example a.QBs fault for that loss? His play was never worth 84 million dollars guaranteed from any team. He wasn't worth 84 million to keep. Sameway Smith wasn't worth Fuller and 3rd round pick plus a extention. Kirk Cousins wasn't the QB who should've reset the QB market like Mknight doesn't believe Collins should've been the SS to reset that market. Yes I know I keep focusing on his contract because his play doesn't match it. He was Good in Gruden system but that doesn't mean he deserved the GREATEST deal in QB history for being just GOOD. Edited October 4, 2019 by Skins212689 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 1 minute ago, Skins212689 said: His play was never worth 84 million dollars guaranteed from any team. He wasn't worth 84 million to keep. Sameway Smith wasn't worth Fuller and 3rd round pick plus a extention. Kirk Cousins wasn't the QB who should've reset the QB market like Mknight doesn't believe Collins should've been the SS to reset that market. Yes, his play was worth that contract bc that’s what his market dictated. Kirk had 3 straight years of over 4,000 yards (nearly 5000 yds in 2016), had 81 TDs to just 36 ints in those 3 seasons. He led the Redskins to an NFC East Division Championship in 2015 with a team with a bad defense and a bad running game getting them to the playoffs once and nearly 2 other times - despite being one of the most injured teams in the NFL in 2016 & 17. He had 4 teams interested in signing him and other teams wanted to trade for him in 2016 & 17 but dumb Brice wouldn't do it! Which, made the Redskins worse for it's future! But, keep defending Dan and Brice’s Bad decision to not keep Kirk while we want him the current Redskins remain winless after what will be 5 games by Sunday at 4:30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Yes, his play was worth that contract bc that’s what his market dictated. Kirk had 3 straight years of over 4,000 yards (nearly 5000 yds in 2016), had 81 TDs to just 36 ints in those 3 seasons. He led the Redskins to an NFC East Division Championship in 2015 with a team with a bad defense and a bad running game getting them to the playoffs once and nearly 2 other times - despite being one of the most injured teams in the NFL in 2016 & 17. He had 4 teams interested in signing him and other teams wanted to trade for him in 2016 & 17 but dumb Brice wouldn't do it! Which, made the Redskins worse for it's future! But, keep defending Dan and Brice’s Bad decision to not keep Kirk while we want him the current Redskins remain winless after what will be 5 games by Sunday at 4:30. How when the QB who had just took them to the NFC East championship game didn't get close to his deal? That's why I say I would've just paid Keenum to stay. Not overpay Cousin's whose stats are only better because he's a stat guy and doesn't play with the same aggression as Keenum played with. Edited October 3, 2019 by Skins212689 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 4 hours ago, Skins212689 said: How when the QB who had just took them to the NFC East championship game didn't get close to his deal? That's why I say I would've just paid Keenum to stay. Not overpay Cousin's whose stats are only better because he's a stat guy and doesn't play with the same aggression as Keenum played with. Well I agree the Vikings should have kept Keenum to keep the chemistry going, but if Kirk didn’t sign there, he was going to sign with the Jets or Cardinals for the same deal or close to it. He had more suitors than just the Vikings and teams would have traded for Kirk in 2016 & 17 if Brice had done the deal, but his stubborn arse did the same thing then that he’s doing with Trent now. Holding on to his stupid ground bc he thinks s player should just take the contract he offers or just play bc he has a contract instead of trading them for draft picks. Skins could have probably gotten a 1st and 2nd for Cousins and a 1st or 2nd or good player for Trent and a mid round pick too. That’s 3 starters and a back up - maybe a starter for 2 starters. Brice is so dumb! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 16 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Well I agree the Vikings should have kept Keenum to keep the chemistry going, but if Kirk didn’t sign there, he was going to sign with the Jets or Cardinals for the same deal or close to it. He had more suitors than just the Vikings and teams would have traded for Kirk in 2016 & 17 if Brice had done the deal, but his stubborn arse did the same thing then that he’s doing with Trent now. Holding on to his stupid ground bc he thinks s player should just take the contract he offers or just play bc he has a contract instead of trading them for draft picks. Skins could have probably gotten a 1st and 2nd for Cousins and a 1st or 2nd or good player for Trent and a mid round pick too. That’s 3 starters and a back up - maybe a starter for 2 starters. Brice is so dumb! Great we agree again. I would've tried to trade him to San Fran the year we got Allen at 17. Watson and Allen would've been my targets. Allen fail right into our laps and Tribusky went before Watson and Mahomes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Skins212689 said: Great we agree again. I would've tried to trade him to San Fran the year we got Allen at 17. Watson and Allen would've been my targets. Allen fail right into our laps and Tribusky went before Watson and Mahomes. I would have paid Kirk, but since you agree with Bruce and wouldn't sign Kirk, doing the trade you suggested was the smarter thing to do. Trade Kirk to San Fran for a 1st and 2nd. We would have had the 3rd pick in the 2017 NFL draft and the 17th pick. We could have drafted Mahomes, Jammal Adams, Mike Williams, John Ross, Lattimore or Watson and taken Jon Allen with the 17th pick. Edited October 4, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, turtle28 said: I would have paid Kirk, but since you agree with Bruce and wouldn't sign Kirk, doing the trade you suggested was the smarter thing to do. Trade Kirk to San Fran for a 1st and 2nd. We would have had the 3rd pick in the 2017 NFL draft and the 17th pick. We could have drafted Mahomes, Jammal Adams, Mike Williams, John Ross, Lattimore or Watson. Don't think I didn't catch your lil jab at me with the Bruce comment. I just don't think he was worth 84 million guaranteed. Had they stuck with SM maybe Kirk would've resigned (or been traded) for less prior to him leaving for the Vikings and Bruce getting SM canned over jealousy. I think during that time I was willing to give Kirk 50 million guranteed with a chance to earn 70 million throughout his contract. Edited October 4, 2019 by Skins212689 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted October 7, 2019 Share Posted October 7, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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