raidr4life Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 5 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: lol i knew that was coming. Without looking into the stats, I will say... 1. Throughout the season Jacobs wasnt on the field too many times on 3rd down. 2. Carr has improved significantly at presnap reads, so, while not much and you expect all good QBs to make the right read, an audible to the right run play, Carr should get some credit. 3. id guess are 3rd down rate was near 50-50 on run v pass. https://www.sfchronicle.com/raiders/article/Keep-it-moving-Raiders-offense-better-on-14836370.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 20 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: and i think this is why many argue Wins and losses are not a QB stat. QB is without a doubt the most important position on the field, and, they CAN be the direct reason for a win or a loss. but for the most part, it is a team game. How do you argue the top Qbs in history having the highest win loss % Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Just now, NCOUGHMAN said: How do you argue the top Qbs in history having the highest win loss % because it is the most important position on the field. so the top qbs in history, give their teams an advantage, because their QB play should be better than the other teams QB play. taken to the extreme here, but Chad pennington once posted a perfect passer rating and the Jets lost to the colts, he threw 3 TDs, no picks and his team loss. He acomplished something that has only been done 77 times in the NFL, and lost. if wins and losses are a QB stat, than surely a perfect game from a QB should result in a win no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: because it is the most important position on the field. so the top qbs in history, give their teams an advantage, because their QB play should be better than the other teams QB play. taken to the extreme here, but Chad pennington once posted a perfect passer rating and the Jets lost to the colts, he threw 3 TDs, no picks and his team loss. He acomplished something that has only been done 77 times in the NFL, and lost. if wins and losses are a QB stat, than surely a perfect game from a QB should result in a win no? For that Pennington comparison of those 77 times how many resulted in wins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Just now, NCOUGHMAN said: For that Pennington comparison of those 77 times how many resulted in wins? shhh dont worry about that lol i think like 71 of them resulted in wins hahah a couple other less convincing arguments lol.. you can say the media rates qbs by wins and losses, so that is why they go hand in hand. you can argue that an elite QB makes his team an attractive FA destination, which helps his team recruit better players? --- obviously the raiders losing a lot under Carr is not a good sign for Carr. But we have had some pretty bad teams in oakland with him as well. if he played better, yes he wouldnt be near last or last on those lists... but at the same time if our D played better or a ball is caught .. he also wouldnt be on those lists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chali21 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 20 minutes ago, raidr4life said: Ugh you guys just don't see he is not the same guy, watch him run around miss plays, give up on plays and look scared to take a hit, stop living in the past man. You’re right he’s not the same, but all the same he’s improved in 2019 on every stat but one, TDs. That’s not the past that’s now. Do i wish he’d be more aggressive? absolutely. I remember him throwing ropes in 2014 and 2016 and i haven’t seen that in awhile. He really needs to get that mamba mentality back Now i can’t say for certainty that he doesn’t like to take hits. It seems legit but Gruden does preach ball protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gannon12 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gannon12 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 6 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: shhh dont worry about that lol i think like 71 of them resulted in wins hahah a couple other less convincing arguments lol.. you can say the media rates qbs by wins and losses, so that is why they go hand in hand. you can argue that an elite QB makes his team an attractive FA destination, which helps his team recruit better players? --- obviously the raiders losing a lot under Carr is not a good sign for Carr. But we have had some pretty bad teams in oakland with him as well. if he played better, yes he wouldnt be near last or last on those lists... but at the same time if our D played better or a ball is caught .. he also wouldnt be on those lists. Lol 71/77 .910% lol personally i think elite qbs have to make unknown wrs ballers before big wrs want to play. Elite qbs have the ability to make unknown wrs ballers I think our banged up defense doesn’t receive help defense has held teams below 21 and under points 6 times no excuses we got hit up by super bowl contenders minus jets lol wrs dropping passes is hard cause with the new wrs it’s such a small sample size but sure coop dropped passes but he was a major reason 2016 happened for Carr I also think chemistry between takes time but most importantly opportunity Carr not giving wrs the opportunity 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 24 minutes ago, Gannon12 said: Lololol sad but true perfect music 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBXISBXVSBXVIII Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Gannon12 said: 🤮💩 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
true2form Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 4 hours ago, NYRaider said: His own personal statistics would have to come into play as well. Carr can't win and doesn't produce. We put up 14.5 ppg and went 1-5 with the playoffs on the line during the final 6 games of the season. Carr is a scrub son. Also why is that Amari Cooper was very good with pre-injury Carr and Dak? And the only time he sucked was with post injury DC? But it must just be his fault. DC couldn't ever do anything wrong. I already explained this to you and you continue to ignore it. Coop is good when he isn't the focal point. The only time he was the clear #1 on either team he failed. This can't be coincidence or disputed. With Crab and Gallup opposite him he's a 1,000 yard receiver and so were they. Without them on the other side he couldn't handle the attention. Making him, in my definition, not a #1 WR. Because according to me, a #1 WR excels no matter who the QB is or who is opposite of him. ie, DeAndre Hopkins with whoever they threw out there in Houston. You'd rather blame it on Carr because that pushes an agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidr4life Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 2 hours ago, BackinBlack said: because it is the most important position on the field. so the top qbs in history, give their teams an advantage, because their QB play should be better than the other teams QB play. taken to the extreme here, but Chad pennington once posted a perfect passer rating and the Jets lost to the colts, he threw 3 TDs, no picks and his team loss. He acomplished something that has only been done 77 times in the NFL, and lost. if wins and losses are a QB stat, than surely a perfect game from a QB should result in a win no? Now tell me how many times that's happened, their is always one outlier to find, how many perfect games by QB's ended in wins i'm willing to bet 99% of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidr4life Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 50 minutes ago, SBXISBXVSBXVIII said: 🤮💩 And that's a big reason why we don't score points, he chokes in the redzone, he has wasted so many plays, the Waller catch and run is a prime example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) 22 minutes ago, true2form said: I already explained this to you and you continue to ignore it. Coop is good when he isn't the focal point. The only time he was the clear #1 on either team he failed. This can't be coincidence or disputed. With Crab and Gallup opposite him he's a 1,000 yard receiver and so were they. Without them on the other side he couldn't handle the attention. Making him, in my definition, not a #1 WR. Because according to me, a #1 WR excels no matter who the QB is or who is opposite of him. ie, DeAndre Hopkins with whoever they threw out there in Houston. You'd rather blame it on Carr because that pushes an agenda. The only season that he struggled was 2017 where he was playing with post injury Derek Carr. He literally produced at a Pro Bowl level here his first two seasons, Carr gets hurt, he struggles for 20 games with post injury Carr, gets to a new team and gets right back to being a Pro Bowl level player. You think that has nothing to do with Carr? Why is he producing at the exact same level he was before Carr got hurt? And why hasn't any WR had success with post injury Carr? Cooper has been a 1,000+ yard guy in 4 of his 5 seasons in the NFL and supposedly he's not a #1 WR? Come on man. And based on your definition there are only like 2 or 3 #1 WR's in the entire league, lmao. Edited January 4, 2020 by NYRaider Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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