2022 NFL Draft Thread

[NYRaider]

4 minutes ago, Trojan said:

I am not for replacing Carr, but I would still take Howell to develop. Carr has 1 more year on his deal. 100% would take a QB 10 years younger than him on a cost controlled deal. Like Derek he seems to be a phenomenal person with a strong arm understated mobility and unbeatable work ethic.

Derek Carr isn't playing next season without an extension. I get that he says all of the right things but he has already had a serious lower leg injury and this will be the last time in his career he will ever be able to sign a long term extension with $100M+ in guaranteed money. He'd be a fool to play out the last year on his deal with zero financial commitment from the team going forward, what if he gets hurt?

[NYRaider]

1 minute ago, Trojan said:

Have you read the Yahoo in depth article on Howell? I'll link it incase but it's a longer article and isn't super football-y but helps sell the person that is the prospect.

https://sports.yahoo.com/last-dance-agenda-carolina-qb-sam-howell-looks-to-take-down-clemson-and-lead-unc-to-cfp-194834092.html

Sam Howell is a solid prospect but he regressed big time this year without a star studded cast of NFL prospects around him.

[Rich7sena]

9 minutes ago, Trojan said:

I am not for replacing Carr, but I would still take Howell to develop. Carr has 1 more year on his deal. 100% would take a QB 10 years younger than him on a cost controlled deal. Like Derek he seems to be a phenomenal person with a strong arm understated mobility and unbeatable work ethic.

I think it's likelier/better Carr signs an extension and we use our early draft picks on players who can help the team asap.

I haven't looked up anything about Howell's intangibles, but his on field performances don't particularly stand out to me. I think it's likelier he ends up like Chase Daniel that Derek Carr.

[ronjon1990]

2 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Sam Howell is a solid prospect but he regressed big time this year without a star studded cast of NFL prospects around him.

You realize you're essentially going against your previous argument with this, right? 

Howell is a ? because he regressed without a star studded cast of NFL prospects around him, but Bryce Young, who plays with even more NFL talent around him shouldn't be questioned despite not playing without NFL talent? 

Why does Howell get knocked for regressing without NFL talent around him, but Young gets drooled over when he's always been surrounded with it? What if they switched places and Young underachieved without Alabama's talent pool? 

Supporting cast matters. 

[NYRaider]

3 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

You realize you're essentially going against your previous argument with this, right? 

Howell is a ? because he regressed without a star studded cast of NFL prospects around him, but Bryce Young, who plays with even more NFL talent around him shouldn't be questioned despite not playing without NFL talent? 

Why does Howell get knocked for regressing without NFL talent around him, but Young gets drooled over when he's always been surrounded with it? What if they switched places and Young underachieved without Alabama's talent pool? 

Supporting cast matters. 

Not really. Bryce Young had a great season overall and struggled in one game against a historically great defense in Georgia. Young this season was also far better against better competition than Howell ever was during his college career. 

Howell regressed over the course of the entire season playing against juggernauts such as NC State, Georgia Tech, South Carolina, and Pittsburgh. If Young regresses all of next season then you can definitely make the comparison but that remains to be seen. 

Howell came into the season as someone who could potentially be the #1 overall pick and now he's a fringe first round pick at best. 

[ronjon1990]

Just now, NYRaider said:

Not really. Bryce Young had a great season overall and struggled in one game against a historically great defense in Georgia. Young this season was also far better against better competition than Howell ever was during his college career. 

Howell regressed over the course of the entire season playing against juggernauts such as NC State, Georgia Tech, South Carolina, and Pittsburgh. If Young regresses all of next season then you can definitely make the comparison but that remains to be seen. 

Howell came into the season as someone who could potentially be the #1 overall pick and now he's a fringe first round pick at best. 

1. False. Bryce Young had plenty of times he struggled. He was bad most of the Iron Bowl too. The only way he "only struggled once" is if you are box score scouting. 

2. Bryce Young had infinitely more talent around him on both sides of the ball than Sam Howell could have ever dreamed of having at NC. Again, switch places and see how it works. 

3. Happens annually. Again, stick Howell on a semi-pro team, he probably still looks like a #1 overall pick. That's my point. You're choosing to ignore that Young is in a far superior situation than Howell, by about 10 miles, by refusing to acknowledge that he benefits from playing with far superior talent around him. Prove to me that Young wouldn't regress if he had North Carolina's supporting cast. You can't, because we've never seen Bryce Young play without a supporting cast of 1st and 2nd round picks. 

[NYRaider]

1 minute ago, ronjon1990 said:

1. False. Bryce Young had plenty of times he struggled. He was bad most of the Iron Bowl too. The only way he "only struggled once" is if you are box score scouting. 

2. Bryce Young had infinitely more talent around him on both sides of the ball than Sam Howell could have ever dreamed of having at NC. Again, switch places and see how it works. 

3. Happens annually. Again, stick Howell on a semi-pro team, he probably still looks like a #1 overall pick. That's my point. You're choosing to ignore that Young is in a far superior situation than Howell, by about 10 miles, by refusing to acknowledge that he benefits from playing with far superior talent around him. Prove to me that Young wouldn't regress if he had North Carolina's supporting cast. You can't, because we've never seen Bryce Young play without a supporting cast of 1st and 2nd round picks. 

Bryce Young was the best player in college football this season and made some extremely clutch plays to win against Auburn.

Young is in a much better situation then Howell, he was good enough to earn a scholarship and become the starter at Alabama, Howell was not. And what does Young's potential production in a hypothetical world have to do with Sam Howell's draft status?

We've seen Howell regress over the course of an entire season, that's the reason his draft stock has plummeted.

[Bitty 2.0]

1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

Yet somehow the Ravens have won 77% of the games that he has played and 33% of the games he has not played. I never said he was a great passer but he's a very good, dynamic football player.

Just think how dynamic he would be as a WR

Edited January 11, 2022 by Bitty 2.0

[NYRaider]

12 minutes ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

Just think how dynamic he would be as a WR

I think he has proven to be most dynamic when he has the ball in his hands every play.

[ronjon1990]

33 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Bryce Young was the best player in college football this season and made some extremely clutch plays to win against Auburn.

Young is in a much better situation then Howell, he was good enough to earn a scholarship and become the starter at Alabama, Howell was not. And what does Young's potential production in a hypothetical world have to do with Sam Howell's draft status?

We've seen Howell regress over the course of an entire season, that's the reason his draft stock has plummeted.

1. He also had the best supporting cast in all of football and made some bad plays too. 

2. Aaron Rodgers was garbage then, since he got JUCO offers and then Cal. Pat Mahomes must've sucked too, because Texas Tech is awful. That straight up BUM Trey Lance couldn't get out of the D2 ranks. Your boy Lamar played at Louisville. You promote Malik Willis, and he plays at Liberty ffs. 

3. I'll explain this 1 more time: Put Sam Howell in Alabama's offense, he likely doesn't regress. Put Bryce Young in North Carolina's, he's not sniffing a Heisman. You are knocking a guy for not being a superstar with poor supporting cast, while heralding a guy who's worst supporting player is a future 2nd rounder. I'm not explaining it again, it isn't rocket science. 

Edited January 11, 2022 by ronjon1990

[NYRaider]

26 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

1. He also had the best supporting cast in all of football and made some bad plays too. 

2. Aaron Rodgers was garbage then, since he got JUCO offers and then Cal. Pat Mahomes must've sucked too, because Texas Tech is awful. That straight up BUM Trey Lance couldn't get out of the D2 ranks. Your boy Lamar played at Louisville. You promote Malik Willis, and he plays at Liberty ffs. 

3. I'll explain this 1 more time: Put Sam Howell in Alabama's offense, he likely doesn't regress. Put Bryce Young in North Carolina's, he's not sniffing a Heisman. You are knocking a guy for not being a superstar with poor supporting cast, while heralding a guy who's worst supporting player is a future 2nd rounder. I'm not explaining it again, it isn't rocket science. 

What other players have done in the past holds no merit on the future of current NFL Draft prospects. Tom Brady was a 6th round pick and wasn't even starting at Michigan his final season. What does that have to do with Sam Howell?

We can speak in hypotheticals all that we want but we can only assess prospects based on what they did this season. If you put Mac Jones on the Jaguars and Trevor Lawrence on the Patriots, you think people would view them like they currently do? 

Malik Willis has elite physical tools, he's a dynamic runner and has an absolute cannon arm. He also did not regress this season like Howell did. 

I'm not knocking him because he wasn't a superstar, I'm saying that he regressed this season, which is the truth. Howell did not play like a first round pick.

[ronjon1990]

11 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

What other players have done in the past holds no merit on the future of current NFL Draft prospects. Tom Brady was a 6th round pick and wasn't even starting at Michigan his final season. What does that have to do with Sam Howell?

We can speak in hypotheticals all that we want but we can only assess prospects based on what they did this season. If you put Mac Jones on the Jaguars and Trevor Lawrence on the Patriots, you think people would view them like they currently do? 

Malik Willis has elite physical tools, he's a dynamic runner and has an absolute cannon arm. He also did not regress this season like Howell did. 

I'm not knocking him because he wasn't a superstar, I'm saying that he regressed this season, which is the truth. Howell did not play like a first round pick.

Where Sam Howell was offered scholarships holds no merit. 

[NYRaider]

3 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

Where Sam Howell was offered scholarships holds no merit. 

So why didn't he go to a program with a ton of talent around him? He wanted to play for a bad team and lose millions of dollars?

[Trojan]

I disagree that Sam Howell regressed the entire year. Sam Howell was amazing last year, then NFL talent left and he had a bad week one. After week 1 he evolved his skillset and used his running ability to cater to the offensive woes and tried to carry the team. Look at the middle of the year when he carried NC against ND ultimately losing by a score which completing 77% for 340ish yards a TD and rushing for 100 and a TD. He had a turnover as well, but ND was a very good team this year. I feel like a lot of the negatives on Howell are on the offense he runs. If you watch watch JT OSullivan's Youtube channel is, he has some videos on Howell and I can't remember which ones but he talks about the first level RPOs v. second level RPOs. A lot of the plays where Howell looks bad it's on these first level RPOs where he is to read the DL and it's a no win situation. I don't really knock him for that, and he executes them still when it's clearly a bad situation play call wise. I don't know if he is allowed to audible, but if he is that's the only knock I'd put against him there. He isn't prototypical height, but he wasn't an athlete athlete either. He's an inch or two shorter than Carr, but he was a stocky 230 and based off his running this year I'd think he's about 220 right now which is bigger than say a Tua. His arm looks incredibly live to me, where I read others saying he has okay arm talent. He can rocket that thing downfield though, and maybe you can knock him when he tries a post play with single high or whatever but the arm fires. I like his footwork and his base when he throws and his motion looks compact and mechanically sound enough to not be a concern. The person Sam Howell is is very clean and the type of kid you'd be completely okay with selecting. It's a little nice to see he had an OL/RB/WR and was phenomenal and then lost them struggled a bit but adjusted instead of folding.

[Trojan]

5 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

So why didn't he go to a program with a ton of talent around him? He wanted to play for a bad team and lose millions of dollars?

He grow up right next to North Carolina, is the state's all time passing leader in high school and it was his dream school since he was a little kid. He had offers as a five star from Alabama, Oregon, FSU, Miami, Nebraska, Michigan (our potential HC), Florida, Clemson, Georgia, Ohio State, Arkansas, Vandy, South Carolina, Ole Miss, Maryland, Kentucky, Minnesota, Wake Forrest, Tennesee and East Carolina.