abstract_thought Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 Just now, Madmike90 said: Nor does saying you know to the exact level that 48 rookie offensive linemen played too... My point is if these guys were below league average on what were some really good teams they wouldn't have been playing as much as they did. Some guys looked at all the 1st round OL drafted since 2015. About 57% graded out at a positive level as rookies. Those odds get lower as the draft progresses. In the 2nd round, the chances you get a rookie better than Larry Borom are probably about a coin-flip. It's already unknown whether Jenkins and Borom will be above-average NFL players. The likelihood that all 3 of Jenkins, Borom, and a rookie will be at least average is less than 50%. With that in mind, it's probably best that the Bears sign some veteran capable of starting. And I think it's fair to wonder, at this point, why the Bears haven't. Many OL have signed to reasonable deals. Why haven't the Bears signed any of them? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 1 minute ago, WindyCity said: It really doesn’t. Most teams struggle to find 2 immediate week 1 contributors outside of round 1 in a draft. Even more so when one of them is an OLmen. Look at last years draft of OLmen outside of round 1 and tell me you are comfortable wading into that and finding a day 1 starting RG. Outside of Humphries Trey Smith and Dickerson it isn’t strong. Meyers was up and down. We have already gone back and forward on this and I am not about to change my stance...there were far more solid interior linemen than these 4... Another example of drafting that is very similar to the picks we have and what we need... 2019 Tennessee Titans...6 draft picks... Jeffery Simmons in the 1st round aside... A.J Brown...Nate Davis...Amani Hooker Like I said the list goes on and on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 1 minute ago, abstract_thought said: Some guys looked at all the 1st round OL drafted since 2015. About 57% graded out at a positive level as rookies. Those odds get lower as the draft progresses. In the 2nd round, the chances you get a rookie better than Larry Borom are probably about a coin-flip. It's already unknown whether Jenkins and Borom will be above-average NFL players. The likelihood that all 3 of Jenkins, Borom, and a rookie will be at least average is less than 50%. With that in mind, it's probably best that the Bears sign some veteran capable of starting. And I think it's fair to wonder, at this point, why the Bears haven't. Many OL have signed to reasonable deals. Why haven't the Bears signed any of them? We haven't signed mid level guys because Poles has been clear in his want to build through the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abstract_thought Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 Just now, Madmike90 said: We haven't signed mid level guys because Poles has been clear in his want to build through the draft. Do you consider those options to be mutually exclusive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 Just now, abstract_thought said: Do you consider those options to be mutually exclusive? I consider it to be very reasonable when we are only missing one starter on the offensive line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abstract_thought Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: I consider it to be very reasonable when we are only missing one starter on the offensive line. Do you believe rookies who have not played at a consistent level should be declared outright starters with no competition? And even if we assume each of Jenkins, Borom, and a rookie will be above-average starters - one of them is almost guaranteed to miss time due to injuries. Wouldn't it be wise to have a capable backup? Right now the Bears are sitting on the money. They're not cap-stretched at all. There is no opportunity cost in signing some veterans, even if they become high-level backups. Edited March 29, 2022 by abstract_thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 Just now, abstract_thought said: Do you believe rookies who have not played at a consistent level should be declared outright starters with no competition? And even if we assume each of Jenkins, Borom, and a rookie will be above-average starters. One of them is almost guaranteed to miss time due to injuries. Wouldn't it be wise to have a capable backup? Right now the Bears are sitting on the money. They're not cap-stretched at all. There is no opportunity cost in signing some veterans, even if they become high-level backups. It's a presumption to say they won't face competition...as many have pointed out we still will sign 6-8 vets over the next few weeks...Poles isn't sitting on his hands...he is playing the game the exact same way as the rest of the NFL...how many guys have been signed around the NFL over the past 3-4 days? Not many and it is the same way every year...the signings will come but patience is required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZBearsFan Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 4 minutes ago, WindyCity said: It really doesn’t. Most teams struggle to find 2 immediate week 1 contributors outside of round 1 in a draft. Even more so when one of them is an OLmen. Look at last years draft of OLmen outside of round 1 and tell me you are comfortable wading into that and finding a day 1 starting RG. Outside of Humphries Trey Smith and Dickerson it isn’t strong. Meyers was up and down. Again, finding one who will start is is easy. If we draft a round 2 guard and he’s healthy, dollars to donuts he’s gonna be a starter for us. Whether or not he meets the criteria you are setting for the level of that player’s performance is an entirely different thing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 If we are talking cheap interior OL then I am surprised Chris Reed is still out there from Indy...played over 500 snaps and didn't allow a sack all year while grading highly as a run blocker...pretty athletic guy as well so you would the zone scheme and Flus has some knowledge of him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZBearsFan Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 Say that 5 minutes from now the Bears were to announce that they’ve signed WR Keelan Cole, G Alex Lewis, CB Fabian Moreau and S Ronnie Harrison all to 1-year deals. How much does that really change anyone’s outlook on anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 Guys who would still set a floor. Ereck Flowers Daryl Williams Space Trai Turner Oday Abushi Space Chris Reed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 I am Pre going on record. If we sign Tyrann Mathieu and have 30 million dollars invested at S and a 10 cent OL… I will be upset. Signing a 30 year old expensive defender would go against everything we have done this offseason. Pre-warning 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 5 minutes ago, WindyCity said: I am Pre going on record. If we sign Tyrann Mathieu and have 30 million dollars invested at S and a 10 cent OL… I will be upset. Signing a 30 year old expensive defender would go against everything we have done this offseason. Pre-warning It would allow them to either trade Jackson this year, or cut him next year, though. And Jackson stinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 5 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: It would allow them to either trade Jackson this year, or cut him next year, though. And Jackson stinks. They won’t do either because his contract is a mess. He also isn’t as bad as you say he is. Signing a 30 year old expensive defender on a rebuilding team with no offensive talent would be ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted March 29, 2022 Share Posted March 29, 2022 2 minutes ago, WindyCity said: Signing a 30 year old expensive defender on a rebuilding team with no offensive talent would be ridiculous. I'm not sure Mathieu would be super expensive. He didn't go right away, his contract might end up being pretty reasonable. Or, reasonable-ish. And it would allow them to take Jackson's very large contract off the books... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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