49ers offseason 2022

[Forge]

1 minute ago, 49erscap said:

Hmmm, I wonder what they consider mid-level CB? Levi Wallace maybe? 

That'd be a good pick up

[49erscap]

2 minutes ago, Forge said:

The guy I thought made a ton of sense was Fuller. Awful year last season, but at 30 could bounce back and has to take a one year prove it after that season

Casey Hayward, Steven Nelson might be 2 mid level CBs, maybe anyway lol

[P_locniners]

8 minutes ago, 49erscap said:

Hmmm, I wonder what they consider mid-level CB? Levi Wallace maybe? 

That would be my choice, not sure what he will command in FA, but I would consider him mid-level. Kyle Fuller as well

[49ersfan]

5 hours ago, P_locniners said:

Per Grant Cohn via Rob Schuh ( who is at the combine), the Niners are looking for a mid-level CB in FA along with a Offenisve Tackle insurance policy for McGlinchey.

so do t hope for Gilmore, but the mid-tier CB’s are what we are looking at

Didn't someone report that the Niners were also looking at the DL in the combine? 

This FO has some trends that don't really waver. Besides QB, they value the DL above all else. They almost always fill up their DB room with mid-round picks and bargain bin or mid-level FA's. And they always pay a premium for offensive players that Shanny falls in love with, to mixed results. 

[N4L]

15 hours ago, 49ersfan said:

Didn't someone report that the Niners were also looking at the DL in the combine?

its a sign they know they cant/wont re-sign DJJ imo. reshuffling the DL seems to be a huge priority for us every year and I love it. Somehow we never properly address DE though, its weird. 

We are looking at speed edge rushers. yes please. get two of them and take this pass rush to the next level. 

Maybe someone with enough athleticism to drop into space occasionally. Mincah Parsons role, only a primary DE first and foremost. Basically, what simmons in ARI could be but the offbrand version because athletes like those two go in the first round for the most part

 

I am super excited to see what DeMeco does this offseason/next season. He is a better DC than Saleh imo. He has always been a very astute field general and he is becoming a grandmaster chess player.

The gameplans he was putting together late in the season were phenomenal. The GB game was a masterclass.

in the NFCCG Mcvay got him a few different times by catching him in the wrong coverages, but it was the third time they went head to head and its very hard to anticipate what adjustments teams are going to make to you. (That is what Kyle is one of the best in the league at doing, lets see him without McDaniel though). 

I would say the defense did their job in the NFCCG so I wouldnt say it cost us the game, but DeMeco definitely got schooled a little bit and our secondary had issues carrying the right players in and out of zones. Kupp got loose and they just gave Odell the entire damn field to work with for that reason. 

LAR with a legit WR1 across from kupp is deadly. Idk who that will be for them next year considering Odell probably wont play. Their OL will probably have issues because they lack the resources to do much there. Late round OL depth is the best they can do. Whit probably retires and thats a huge loss for them. They have no T with enough talent to fill into that spot. 

Add those speedy edge rushers to get to stafford from all angles and he will turn the ball over. The NFC is ours for the taking 

Edited March 5, 2022 by N4L

[J-ALL-DAY]

Take that @Forge!!!!!!

[J-ALL-DAY]

I've been saying for months we need to take a tackle for McGlinchey's replacement. I don't care how much he has improved in pass protection, just does not make much sense allocating over 30M on the tackle spots. With Williams' big contract, we need a tackle on a rookie deal on the other side. So I'm glad to hear we are going to address that position in the draft.

Cornerback in free agency is also what I've been suggesting. We have gotten some really good years out of 30+ year old veteran CBs or close to that age CBs in free agency since the Harbaugh days from Rogers to Sherman to Verrett. Gilmore is the one that fits the bill the best in this free agency class.

I want to attack the trenches on both sides of the ball hard in this draft. Not a lot of holes but need to plan for the future and need to improve the depth. Ideally, getting a speedy edge rusher would be great in 2nd or 3rd round. 

[757-NINER]

2 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

I've been saying for months we need to take a tackle for McGlinchey's replacement. I don't care how much he has improved in pass protection, just does not make much sense allocating over 30M on the tackle spots. With Williams' big contract, we need a tackle on a rookie deal on the other side. So I'm glad to hear we are going to address that position in the draft.

Cornerback in free agency is also what I've been suggesting. We have gotten some really good years out of 30+ year old veteran CBs or close to that age CBs in free agency since the Harbaugh days from Rogers to Sherman to Verrett. Gilmore is the one that fits the bill the best in this free agency class.

I want to attack the trenches on both sides of the ball hard in this draft. Not a lot of holes but need to plan for the future and need to improve the depth. Ideally, getting a speedy edge rusher would be great in 2nd or 3rd round. 

I'm with you with everything except Gilmore. I don't want to spend that kind of money. Go get a Levi Wallace or a Charvarius Ward on a 1 year prove it deal and continue to let Thomas and Lenior develop. Wouldn't mind going after a guy like Bryce Callahan and letting Lenior concentrate on being on the boundary for the time being. Go get another CB fairly early in the draft....wash, rinse & repeat. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

2 minutes ago, 757-NINER said:

I'm with you with everything except Gilmore. I don't want to spend that kind of money. Go get a Levi Wallace or a Charvarius Ward on a 1 year prove it deal and continue to let Thomas and Lenior develop. Wouldn't mind going after a guy like Bryce Callahan and letting Lenior concentrate on being on the boundary for the time being. Go get another CB fairly early in the draft....wash, rinse & repeat. 

Gilmore still had a very good season and I don't think he will cost what you think. Short-term? Sure, but it will be like a two year deal while he is still very good and then we won't be on the books for much after that. Having someone of that caliber would make this defense INSANELY good. I mean it already held three of the best offenses in the league to around 16 PPG in the playoffs. We can still develop Thomas and Moseley can even get some time in the slot. And let's be real, not like our corners are exactly durable so Thomas will be playing plenty. 

If we get someone like Charvarius Ward? That's fine as well. 

[757-NINER]

1 minute ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Gilmore still had a very good season and I don't think he will cost what you think. Short-term? Sure, but it will be like a two year deal while he is still very good and then we won't be on the books for much after that. Having someone of that caliber would make this defense INSANELY good. I mean it already held three of the best offenses in the league to around 16 PPG in the playoffs. We can still develop Thomas and Moseley can even get some time in the slot. And let's be real, not like our corners are exactly durable so Thomas will be playing plenty. 

If we get someone like Charvarius Ward? That's fine as well. 

Gilmore definitely catapults the defense into the 'scary good' category. He's still a top teir talent. I just don't want to fork over that type of cash to an aging player. When we brought on guys like Rogers and Sherman in the past, we needed that 'name' vet to really solidify the CB room while the roster was in transition. We're past that kind of FA signing imo. We have young guys in the fold already. Let them play plenty and continue to develop. Sign a guy on the cusp of his prime who's willing to bank on himself, come here with a chip on his shoulder and show out. I'm kind of over signing the aging vet to shore up the outside. We should be devloping our drafted CBs and letting them outplay their draft status, making their positions priority every other draft. 

Now if we can get Gilmore on a reasonable deal??

Sure, I'm down.

But what is reasonable, considering the other moves and extensions we have to make? 

[J-ALL-DAY]

6 minutes ago, 757-NINER said:

Gilmore definitely catapults the defense into the 'scary good' category. He's still a top teir talent. I just don't want to fork over that type of cash to an aging player. When we brought on guys like Rogers and Sherman in the past, we needed that 'name' vet to really solidify the CB room while the roster was in transition. We're past that kind of FA signing imo. We have young guys in the fold already. Let them play plenty and continue to develop. Sign a guy on the cusp of his prime who's willing to bank on himself, come here with a chip on his shoulder and show out. I'm kind of over signing the aging vet to shore up the outside. We should be devloping our drafted CBs and letting them outplay their draft status, making their positions priority every other draft. 

Now if we can get Gilmore on a reasonable deal??

Sure, I'm down.

But what is reasonable, considering the other moves and extensions we have to make? 

The extensions aren't terribly a big deal for now. And we can generate space by not picking up Ebukam's option and making some restructures. But I don't know if we are past that type of signing though. I have no reason to believe that Moseley/Thomas cannot hold it down, but having a top talent makes a big difference. And Moseley has been hurt the past few seasons so you can't trust his health. 

To me giving him a 3 year 45-47M deal where really only the first two years are guaranteed look fair to me. He's that type of talent. 

[Forge]

1 hour ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Take that @Forge!!!!!!

Never liked Ben 😂

[J-ALL-DAY]

Another thing @757-NINERthe reason I BADLY wanted Jackson (before he outpriced himself with his performance) and now Gilmore, we need DBs that are able to create turnovers. Ward is awesome and a top 3 cover FS in the league, but he's not creating any turnovers and neither is Tartt. Those guys are awesome but that's their weakness and we don't have a ballhawk at CB either. If Gilmore plays close to the entire season, you are likely getting 4-5 INTs from him. That's very valuable to go on top of his elite coverage. 

[757-NINER]

38 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Another thing @757-NINERthe reason I BADLY wanted Jackson (before he outpriced himself with his performance) and now Gilmore, we need DBs that are able to create turnovers. Ward is awesome and a top 3 cover FS in the league, but he's not creating any turnovers and neither is Tartt. Those guys are awesome but that's their weakness and we don't have a ballhawk at CB either. If Gilmore plays close to the entire season, you are likely getting 4-5 INTs from him. That's very valuable to go on top of his elite coverage. 

Yeah but turnovers are a fickled stat in terms of CBs. Granted neither Ward nor Tartt are ballhawks, I can live with that, given what they give me elsewhere. 

Ints are great and all but I feel like sometimes the ball bounces for you and against you. We create enough fumbles/PDs that the lack of turnovers don't have me overly concerned.

Jimmy is in our rearview (hopefully). Needing extra possessions shouldn't be as important with Lance under center. His ability to produce explosive plays and extending drives with his legs should boost our PPG. Of course you always want as many turnovers as possible but it's something I don't ever want to count on to help generate scoring opportunities.

[N4L]

2 hours ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Another thing @757-NINERthe reason I BADLY wanted Jackson (before he outpriced himself with his performance) and now Gilmore, we need DBs that are able to create turnovers. Ward is awesome and a top 3 cover FS in the league, but he's not creating any turnovers and neither is Tartt. Those guys are awesome but that's their weakness and we don't have a ballhawk at CB either. If Gilmore plays close to the entire season, you are likely getting 4-5 INTs from him. That's very valuable to go on top of his elite coverage. 

I am all for Gilmore on a 2-3 year deal. He would really solidify our corner depth and let us take a few swings in later rounds/sign UDFAs who are developmental guys and just see what sticks on the back end of the roster. Eman is only signed for one more season. Trey is on his rookie deal so it makes sense to bring in a 2-3 year rental at a premium position to help take this defense to another level. So considering we are officially in "win now" mode, and from a roster building standpoint, it makes a ton of sense. Gilmore is worth pushing the envelope of the salary cap for.

I will say though, in a general sense I stay away from FA CBs from NE and SEA. Pete and Bill are the corner whisperers and idk many guys who went on to replicate their success away from those teams. Gilmore and Jackson are probably the exception to that though. 

You are absolutely correct about this defense needing to create takeaways. It was a problem previously, but they did a great job of that at the end of the season though. With this regime/iteration of our defense going back to 2018ish - there have always been a lot of opportunities for takeaways but they wouldnt get the bounce and would also miss some layups. 

I always say that takeaways are contagious, and in the second half of this season, the defense was getting multiple a game. People hate on Norman but he did lead the league in forced fumbles last year and didnt even go to training camp. I felt like that sparked something for us. All of a sudden everyone else started getting some. 

Guys like Fred and Ward, who are two of the most sound coverage players in the entire league across any position, have made takeaways a point of emphasis in their training. They have both talked about it. Fred especially has started to punch the ball dozens of times a game. Doesnt always force a fumble but its worth giving up an extra yard or two sometimes to try and get the ball back. That one he had against GB was absurdly timely. It honestly flipped the whole game. 

Ambry seems to have good ball skills. He dropped a couple early while he was still gaining his footing in the league, but once he got comfortable, he got very good at playing the ball in the air. I think we could give him help over the top and let him sit on some underneath routes and try and jump quick passes. Quick passes are one way teams have attacked us to negate the pass rush. Ambry has long arms and is a smooth athlete. He can beat a WR to a spot when he comes hard downhill and get his hands on the ball

I think part of the reason we havent gotten a lot of INTs from corners we have drafted is because we havent spent super premium draft capital on them. Eman was a UDFA. He is a super sound tackler and seemingly always has good leverage for his coverage assignment. Its hard to be mad at a lack of splash plays when a dude is just so fundamentally sound.

So basically all of this is to say that I think the core of this defense is maturing to a point where the takeaways are going to happen more frequently. The defense was built on good coverage and a lethal pass rush and sometimes it literally is just a matter of having the ball bounce correctly, ie Jimmie Ward's INT in the NFCCG