NYRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Author Share Posted March 12, 2022 52 minutes ago, OnlyGlove said: We can dress it up how we like it. But overcoming having the clear 4th best QB in the division is going to be difficult. I'd be on the phone to the colts asking for '23 and '24 first round picks. Build the roster and get a young QB next year So just wave the towel because the Broncos traded for Wilson and hope to god in a few years we may be able to compete? lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyGlove Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 hour ago, NYRaider said: So just wave the towel because the Broncos traded for Wilson and hope to god in a few years we may be able to compete? lol What's the difference to that now? We have the 4th best roster and the 4th best QB. A lot of our best players where on rookie deals and now will start to get paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 hour ago, OnlyGlove said: What's the difference to that now? We have the 4th best roster and the 4th best QB. A lot of our best players where on rookie deals and now will start to get paid. They said we had the 4th best roster last year too. FA hasn’t even started yet and some of y’all are already waving white flags. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drfrey13 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 On 3/9/2022 at 12:38 PM, 101Raider said: I’d extend him. However, I’d be open to listening to teams offers, so I’d be in no hurry to do it. A giant, blockbuster trade package would have to take place to get me to budge. QB is the most important position and Carr is a really good QB. I think a deal like what Wilson would get me to move. No, I don’t think he’s as valuable as Russ, but a desperate team does silly things… This is why I would Guarantee his salary this year and look to franchise tag him next year. It leaves the door open for a trade for 2 off-seasons and buys us time. If you extend him then you are going to have to take a cap hit when you trade him. So say we extend him for 2 years $70 million with a $40 guaranteed. If he has a $20 million signing bonus we will take that hit as soon as we trade him. An extension locks him in as our QB for at least a year or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 10 hours ago, Geezy said: The problem isn’t Carrs salary, it’s blowing cash on guys like Littleton, Nassib, Kwit and high picks on guys like Ferrell, Arnette and Ruggs, if we got ANYTHING from HALF those guys we’d be a totally different team. Many of you seem to overlook rookie QB contract and how it allows teams to spend BIG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 hour ago, bucksavage1 said: Many of you seem to overlook rookie QB contract and how it allows teams to spend BIG Obviously it’s a benefit to have a QB on a rookie deal, but here’s the thing, the QB actually has to be good for it to mean anything. My point is if we weren’t wasting so many assets and getting absolutely nothing in return, we’d be in a much better position, with Carr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 17 minutes ago, Geezy said: Obviously it’s a benefit to have a QB on a rookie deal, but here’s the thing, the QB actually has to be good for it to mean anything. My point is if we weren’t wasting so many assets and getting absolutely nothing in return, we’d be in a much better position, with Carr. It’s literally impossible to be perfect with your assets. You’re looking at a 60% hit rate at best in FA and the Draft. To win a Super Bowl outside of a Rookie QB contract, you are gonna need to hit almost 100% of your assets. Therefore, a Rookie QB Contract allows way more misses, and way more realistic. And yes, the QB has to be good, obviously. Super Bowl winner: 2012 Flacco - Rookie QB Contract 2013 Wilson - Rookie QB Contract 2014 Brady - 30% Discount 2015 Manning - Took a 25% discount at the start of this season 2016 Brady - 30% Discount 2017 Wentz - Rookie QB Contract (they don’t get anywhere close to the #1 seed if Foles is QB all season) 2018 Brady - 30% discount 2019 Mahomes - Rookie QB Contract 2020 Brady - Discount as always 2021 Stafford - Rams break the norm, but they went all in like a Baseball team for a two-year window. They will be meh after this season. But it did work out for them. Rookie QB contract with a good QB is the biggest possible asset/value you can have in this league and it’s not even close. If Carr takes a 30% discount, and takes 29-30M a year, we’ll be in business. But he is likely taking 38-40M a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Author Share Posted March 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, BayRaider said: If Carr takes a 30% discount, and takes 29-30M a year, we’ll be in business. But he is likely taking 38-40M a year. Quote Now comes this note from NFL insider Jordan Schultz that the Raiders are prepared to offer Derek Carr top-end quarterback money. The report also indicates that the former second-round pick is seeking $35-plus million annually on a new contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, BayRaider said: It’s literally impossible to be perfect with your assets. You’re looking at a 60% hit rate at best in FA and the Draft. To win a Super Bowl outside of a Rookie QB contract, you are gonna need to hit almost 100% of your assets. Therefore, a Rookie QB Contract allows way more misses, and way more realistic. And yes, the QB has to be good, obviously. Super Bowl winner: 2012 Flacco - Rookie QB Contract 2013 Wilson - Rookie QB Contract 2014 Brady - 30% Discount 2015 Manning - Took a 25% discount at the start of this season 2016 Brady - 30% Discount 2017 Wentz - Rookie QB Contract (they don’t get anywhere close to the #1 seed if Foles is QB all season) 2018 Brady - 30% discount 2019 Mahomes - Rookie QB Contract 2020 Brady - Discount as always 2021 Stafford - Rams break the norm, but they went all in like a Baseball team for a two-year window. They will be meh after this season. But it did work out for them. Rookie QB contract with a good QB is the biggest possible asset/value you can have in this league and it’s not even close. If Carr takes a 30% discount, and takes 29-30M a year, we’ll be in business. But he is likely taking 38-40M a year. Not asking for perfection, but 3 blown first rounders in two years and 40mill of cap space and nothing in return is another level of ineptitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 7 minutes ago, BayRaider said: It’s literally impossible to be perfect with your assets. You’re looking at a 60% hit rate at best in FA and the Draft. To win a Super Bowl outside of a Rookie QB contract, you are gonna need to hit almost 100% of your assets. Therefore, a Rookie QB Contract allows way more misses, and way more realistic. And yes, the QB has to be good, obviously. Super Bowl winner: 2012 Flacco - Rookie QB Contract 2013 Wilson - Rookie QB Contract 2014 Brady - 30% Discount 2015 Manning - Took a 25% discount at the start of this season 2016 Brady - 30% Discount 2017 Wentz - Rookie QB Contract (they don’t get anywhere close to the #1 seed if Foles is QB all season) 2018 Brady - 30% discount 2019 Mahomes - Rookie QB Contract 2020 Brady - Discount as always 2021 Stafford - Rams break the norm, but they went all in like a Baseball team for a two-year window. They will be meh after this season. But it did work out for them. Rookie QB contract with a good QB is the biggest possible asset/value you can have in this league and it’s not even close. If Carr takes a 30% discount, and takes 29-30M a year, we’ll be in business. But he is likely taking 38-40M a year. So let’s find a rookie QB, or a QB with a mega rich SuperModel wife that allows our QB to take a discount Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, Geezy said: Not asking for perfection, but 3 blown first rounders in two years and 40mill of cap space and nothing in return is another level of ineptitude. You would need perfection though if Carr takes 38M. Our non existent close to 0 hit rate would need to be like 95% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Geezy said: So let’s find a rookie QB, or a QB with a mega rich SuperModel wife that allows our QB to take a discount Unfortunately outside of Tom Brady, most players care way more about maximizing money than winning a ring. That’s why you just keep taking shots in the draft. You act like there should be a QB in the draft who’s guaranteed for success to even explore the option. And you are extremely risk-adverse in general. You take one every few years until you hit. Sometimes in the 1st Round, sometimes 2nd/3rd. Most of them will fail, but the payoff has a ridiculously high chance at a Super Bowl Championship. So far, giving top dollar to QB’s has not worked out for anyone what so ever. Rams you can argue, but no one has ever went “All In” for a two year window like they have before, which is basically the biggest risk of them all. Edited March 12, 2022 by BayRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Author Share Posted March 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, BayRaider said: You would need perfection though if Carr takes 38M. Our non existent close to 0 hit rate would need to be like 95% If he takes like a 3 yr/$105M extension his $35M cap hit would account for roughly 15% of our salary cap for the next three seasons. Not much more than his previous deal, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, NYRaider said: If he takes like a 3 yr/$105M extension his $35M cap hit would account for roughly 15% of our salary cap for the next three seasons. Not much more than his previous deal, lol. Still doesn’t allow much wiggle room for misses in FA and the Draft. You would need to hit every draft pick and every FA signing, which has a super low odds of happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted March 12, 2022 Author Share Posted March 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, BayRaider said: Unfortunately outside of Tom Brady, most players care way more about maximizing money than winning a ring. That’s why you just keep taking shots in the draft. You act like there should be a QB in the draft who’s guaranteed for success to even explore the option. And you are extremely risk-adverse in general. You take one every few years until you hit. Sometimes in the 1st Round, sometimes 2nd/3rd. Most of them will fail, but the payoff has a ridiculously high chance at a Super Bowl Championship. So far, giving top dollar to QB’s has not worked out for anyone what so ever. Rams you can argue, but no one has ever went “All In” for a two year window like they have before, which is basically the biggest risk of them all. The NFL landscape is changing too, teams are way more willing to move on from a QB than they were in the past. I think the only two QB's that have been with their current team longer than Derek Carr are Aaron Rodgers and Matt Ryan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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